US is getting rolled 5-1 by freaking Mexico. No surprise since I don't know half of the players on the US roster, and I actually follow MLB somewhat. This will probably be the last year of the tournament if I had to guess. American players are just not willing to compete in it.
WBC: US vs. Mexico
- Thread starter Bigedawg
- Start date
I don't blame the players for not wanting to compete
Having this in the middle of spring training is stupid as hell
Having this in the middle of spring training is stupid as hell
I like the idea of the WBC, but the setup is actually awful.
Instead, every 4 years they should take 7-10 days off at the All Star Break instead of 3 days and hold the Classic then.
Instead, every 4 years they should take 7-10 days off at the All Star Break instead of 3 days and hold the Classic then.
It's like if you took the NFL pro bowl
and only used players that didn't make the playoffs.
When you combine meaninglessness and mediocrity, who can be bothered to care?
and only used players that didn't make the playoffs.
When you combine meaninglessness and mediocrity, who can be bothered to care?
Really?
You don't know David Wright, Joe Mauer, RA Dickey, Ryan Braun, Brandon Phillips, and Jimmy Rollins?
As long as the US trots out gimmick pitchers like Dickey and in the past Dontrelle Willis and tries to put out a bunch of free swingers without any speed in the lineup whatsoever- you are going to get this.
R A Dickey is a great story- but he is still a knuckleball pitcher, meaning highly unpredictable. The Mexican League is full of junkballers, so it's no surprise that he got teed off on.
I bet if the commissioners office paid the best Americans a 1 million dollar appearance bonus and 2 million for winning the WBC you would see them join.
P- Verlander
P- Strasburg
P- Kershaw
The best closers in the game.
C- Posey
1B- Prince Fielder
2B- Dustin Pedroia
3B- Evan Longoria
SS- Troy Tulowitski
RF- Bryce Harper
CF- Mike Trout
LF- Andrew McCutcheon
DH- Ryan Braun
Some of the older guys are just from a below average baseball generation in America in my opinion. By far the most exciting players are Harper, Trout, Posey, McCutcheon, and Strasburg. And in the future, we will see guys like Billy Hamilton, Kolten Wong, Manny Machado, maybe Jonathan Singleton with that group coming on up. Just a more talented and toolsy group of American players.
You don't know David Wright, Joe Mauer, RA Dickey, Ryan Braun, Brandon Phillips, and Jimmy Rollins?
As long as the US trots out gimmick pitchers like Dickey and in the past Dontrelle Willis and tries to put out a bunch of free swingers without any speed in the lineup whatsoever- you are going to get this.
R A Dickey is a great story- but he is still a knuckleball pitcher, meaning highly unpredictable. The Mexican League is full of junkballers, so it's no surprise that he got teed off on.
I bet if the commissioners office paid the best Americans a 1 million dollar appearance bonus and 2 million for winning the WBC you would see them join.
P- Verlander
P- Strasburg
P- Kershaw
The best closers in the game.
C- Posey
1B- Prince Fielder
2B- Dustin Pedroia
3B- Evan Longoria
SS- Troy Tulowitski
RF- Bryce Harper
CF- Mike Trout
LF- Andrew McCutcheon
DH- Ryan Braun
Some of the older guys are just from a below average baseball generation in America in my opinion. By far the most exciting players are Harper, Trout, Posey, McCutcheon, and Strasburg. And in the future, we will see guys like Billy Hamilton, Kolten Wong, Manny Machado, maybe Jonathan Singleton with that group coming on up. Just a more talented and toolsy group of American players.
Sure. Those are exactly the guys I was referring to. Actually, I said HALF of the roster. Guys like Cishek, Collins, Detwiler, Gregerson, Holland, Perez, Perkins, Hosmer, Pestano, etc. None of the above are household names.
I actually think in the existing format that a team of prospects would be a better option for the US. The Latin American players play all winter while our guys take the winter off. It would be a great opportunity for AA top prospects who are on the verge of making the show and most of those guys play winter ball
I actually think in the existing format that a team of prospects would be a better option for the US. The Latin American players play all winter while our guys take the winter off. It would be a great opportunity for AA top prospects who are on the verge of making the show and most of those guys play winter ball
Whaaat? Those dudes are there for the latinas, man--they don't give a chit about the baseball! Chillin' amigos. Tuning up for the real season, enjoying the sun and fun.
The Dominican lineup is NASTY!
http://espn.go.com/extra/baseball/wbbc/boxscore?gameId=330307117&league=WBBC
http://espn.go.com/extra/baseball/wbbc/boxscore?gameId=330307117&league=WBBC
There is no doubt that they could do a lot better with it. The bottom line is the American players simply don't have the national pride that the other countries do. You look at the Dominican lineup, and they simply don't have any players that are worried about blowing their arm or whatever out in this thing. It's like that for every country except for one- USA.
If the US gets swept out, it might be for the best in the long run because if they want this tournament to be relevant, they are going to have to have a good US team.
The funny thing is, I can only think of two guys that have ever had their season ended in the WBC and both of them played for Japan.
But again, I'm not surprised by this at all. MLB Network talked all about how loaded Team USA was, but I saw a bunch of free swingers and not a lot of team speed. RA Dickey was a bad decision because of the fact that he throws the same crap these guys see in their winter league and on top of that, you have to use a roster spot on one of his personal catchers. What's sad is they cut Kris Medlan and Gio Gonzalez both of whom probably would have won tonight.
If the US gets swept out, it might be for the best in the long run because if they want this tournament to be relevant, they are going to have to have a good US team.
The funny thing is, I can only think of two guys that have ever had their season ended in the WBC and both of them played for Japan.
But again, I'm not surprised by this at all. MLB Network talked all about how loaded Team USA was, but I saw a bunch of free swingers and not a lot of team speed. RA Dickey was a bad decision because of the fact that he throws the same crap these guys see in their winter league and on top of that, you have to use a roster spot on one of his personal catchers. What's sad is they cut Kris Medlan and Gio Gonzalez both of whom probably would have won tonight.
I really am sorry that you don't know half of the lineup, that's just on you as a baseball fan I guess. I can forgive some of the relief pitchers but if you don't know the guys in the starting lineup then you might be better suited for a frat party in oxford I guess. Were you thrown by the name Giancarlo? Because he was the guy who hit 71 home runs in the last two years. Everyone else should be a household name.
I can see not knowing the pitchers because there are a lot of unknowns here with cishek, perikins, pastardo and co. But just because someone doesn't know these guys doesn't mean they're not nasty.
The single question I have for this team is pitching RA Dickey. Yeah he won the cy young last year but with a tournament that has a 65 pitch limit in the first round he just doesn't make sense.
Knuckle ball pitchers can take two or three innings- which can be 40-50 pitches in themselves- just to find a grove. I'd much rather add a young gun that throws gas, that these clowns couldn't hit, than keep Dickey on the staff. Oh well.
I can see not knowing the pitchers because there are a lot of unknowns here with cishek, perikins, pastardo and co. But just because someone doesn't know these guys doesn't mean they're not nasty.
The single question I have for this team is pitching RA Dickey. Yeah he won the cy young last year but with a tournament that has a 65 pitch limit in the first round he just doesn't make sense.
Knuckle ball pitchers can take two or three innings- which can be 40-50 pitches in themselves- just to find a grove. I'd much rather add a young gun that throws gas, that these clowns couldn't hit, than keep Dickey on the staff. Oh well.
It's just a TERRIBLE time to play a global tournament. I don't blame the US players one bit for not playing. Their commitment is to their MLB team first. Why? Cause USA isn't paying them $50 million dollar salaries, their MLB team is and if they get injured during this thing nobody will be there for them a year from now. Take care of those that are taking care of you.
the WBC may not be popular here, but it's not exactly meant to grow baseball here. it was created to grow the MLB brand in new markets, specifically europe and china. it matters more to other countries, fine, but why should that piss you off?
also, i saw an article talking about how the 3rd super bowl didn't sell out and was blacked out in the host market and started at 3 pm et. and look at it now. sometimes it just takes a little time to catch on.
that said, if you are a die hard fan of a MLB squad and your ace blew out his elbow in the WBC, you'd be furious. pitching isn't natural like running or even hitting, and it puts a lot of stress on elbows and shoulders. much like a NFL RB typically only has so many carries/hits in him before he declines (hence the high turnover rates among RBs and why you don't see many RBs remain productive past 30), pitchers also only have so many pitches in their arms. for every nolan ryan, there's 1000 mark fidrych's. why would a MLB fan want their $100M aces wasting those pitches in a meaningless tourney?
also, i saw an article talking about how the 3rd super bowl didn't sell out and was blacked out in the host market and started at 3 pm et. and look at it now. sometimes it just takes a little time to catch on.
that said, if you are a die hard fan of a MLB squad and your ace blew out his elbow in the WBC, you'd be furious. pitching isn't natural like running or even hitting, and it puts a lot of stress on elbows and shoulders. much like a NFL RB typically only has so many carries/hits in him before he declines (hence the high turnover rates among RBs and why you don't see many RBs remain productive past 30), pitchers also only have so many pitches in their arms. for every nolan ryan, there's 1000 mark fidrych's. why would a MLB fan want their $100M aces wasting those pitches in a meaningless tourney?
Yep. Stanton is exactly who I was referring to when discussing the US ROSTER. ** If you are not frustrated with the players who are missing like Trout, McCutchen, Kemp, Fielder, Verlander, Price, Kershaw, Medlen, Strasburg, Heyward, Posey, Hamilton, Motte, Papelbon, Putz, Nathan, and on and on. You certainly don't have to be a big name player to be on the roster, but if you don't think any of the above would have improved the US team then that is on you, as you say.
That is why I said that USA baseball/MLB should pay them a salary to play. They should also take a cue from Team USA basketball and get these players endorsement deals.
I still think it's a sad commentary on American baseball players when our players are more worried about getting hurt and the players from around the world in pretty much every country are so eager to play in this. The NBA's best have no problem suiting up for the Olympics, the NHL's best, not to mention soccer players. And sure, not EVERY single superstar goes out for Team USA in those sports- but you still see many of the best- like LeBron, Kobe, etc, but in baseball we are sending our second and third string and that is pitiful.
I think MLB is being a little short sighted
with that. I do think it is used to grow the game internationally- and it has. The WBC was seen by more people in Japan than the Olympics, it has helped baseball grow in the Netherlands, and it is helping grow the game around the world- although it is just starting to scratch the surface in many of those places.
At the same time, it could and should be used to grow baseball in America. And I think it's a mistake if MLB doesn't use it for that. See how the Dream Team helped grow basketball here and around the world for that matter.
As a Cardinals fan, if Adam Wainwright pitched in the WBC and got hurt, I wouldn't fault the WBC, Team USA, Joe Torre, or whomever else I wanted to blame. They have pitch limits and they are being handled by professional coaches- not some overcompetitive high school coach from Texas. Would it suck? Absolutely. Would I not want another Cardinals pitcher to pitch in it? I can't see myself feeling that way at all. I'm also a fan of Team USA, so it's not like he is showing off in some semi-pro tournament.
It's extremely hard to quantify a pitcher being hurt in a single game anyway. Those are repetitive motion injuries, and there is at least as much of a chance of a pitcher getting hurt in spring training, an exhibition game like the Braves are going to play in Pearl, or something like the All-Star game- although, granted the chance of the All-Star game injury would be less just because we're talking one inning, but it's still a possibility. Basically the WBC is asking for 3-5 innings out of these aces- not a 150 pitch performance.
with that. I do think it is used to grow the game internationally- and it has. The WBC was seen by more people in Japan than the Olympics, it has helped baseball grow in the Netherlands, and it is helping grow the game around the world- although it is just starting to scratch the surface in many of those places.
At the same time, it could and should be used to grow baseball in America. And I think it's a mistake if MLB doesn't use it for that. See how the Dream Team helped grow basketball here and around the world for that matter.
As a Cardinals fan, if Adam Wainwright pitched in the WBC and got hurt, I wouldn't fault the WBC, Team USA, Joe Torre, or whomever else I wanted to blame. They have pitch limits and they are being handled by professional coaches- not some overcompetitive high school coach from Texas. Would it suck? Absolutely. Would I not want another Cardinals pitcher to pitch in it? I can't see myself feeling that way at all. I'm also a fan of Team USA, so it's not like he is showing off in some semi-pro tournament.
It's extremely hard to quantify a pitcher being hurt in a single game anyway. Those are repetitive motion injuries, and there is at least as much of a chance of a pitcher getting hurt in spring training, an exhibition game like the Braves are going to play in Pearl, or something like the All-Star game- although, granted the chance of the All-Star game injury would be less just because we're talking one inning, but it's still a possibility. Basically the WBC is asking for 3-5 innings out of these aces- not a 150 pitch performance.