Well Coach.........
- Thread starter shsdawg
- Start date
by other coaches
rumors of drug issues and suspensions
The Sidney saga
Fighting in the stands on national TV in wife beaters, one player not being kicked off for it, and the coach being retained at the end of the season
Lack of discipline in the program
Coaches talk people. Grant, Johnson, Barbee, Kennedy...they know what the hell is going on here- and they talk to other coaches. Players talk to other players about what goes on in the programs. Our reputation is like our program was at the end of Jackie's tenure.
Adding all that extra baggage to our job has hurt our search quite a bit. And I didnt realize it would to this extent.
And to add to it- Scott Stricklin cant let what happened today happen. You dont let something like that get out unless you know damn sure the deal is done. Our AD is not doing a very good job with this search in my opinion.
I didnt realize how problematic our program was viewed from the outside- and I think our AD is doing a piss poor job. But before you jump on me about this search, think about what you are saying. You're trying to throw it in my face that our job is not attractive- maybe you ought to ask yourself why that is when we have won games, pay well, and have talent inside the state to support the program? We have a very stable Athletic Department and a history of being very patient with coaches. So explain to me why we are having trouble hiring?
rumors of drug issues and suspensions
The Sidney saga
Fighting in the stands on national TV in wife beaters, one player not being kicked off for it, and the coach being retained at the end of the season
Lack of discipline in the program
Coaches talk people. Grant, Johnson, Barbee, Kennedy...they know what the hell is going on here- and they talk to other coaches. Players talk to other players about what goes on in the programs. Our reputation is like our program was at the end of Jackie's tenure.
Adding all that extra baggage to our job has hurt our search quite a bit. And I didnt realize it would to this extent.
And to add to it- Scott Stricklin cant let what happened today happen. You dont let something like that get out unless you know damn sure the deal is done. Our AD is not doing a very good job with this search in my opinion.
I didnt realize how problematic our program was viewed from the outside- and I think our AD is doing a piss poor job. But before you jump on me about this search, think about what you are saying. You're trying to throw it in my face that our job is not attractive- maybe you ought to ask yourself why that is when we have won games, pay well, and have talent inside the state to support the program? We have a very stable Athletic Department and a history of being very patient with coaches. So explain to me why we are having trouble hiring?
G
Goat Still Grindin
Guest
I saw this post on a UK board about the MSU job: <div>Coach34 said:
</div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Verdana; font-size: small; ">"I can't see any solid, young coach wanting to coach in the state of Mississippi. There is a bit of talent there but those jobs seem to be dead ends."</span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Verdana; font-size: small; ">
</span></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Verdana" size="2">I know this guy was talking about basketball, but it got me thinking about about the basketball and football coaches at MSU and Ole Miss the last 25 years. How many have left for better jobs? Tuberville is the only one I could remember. Stansbury could have gone to Clemson, but he came back to MSU to "retire". If you believe all the rumors about Mullen being a hot commodity, you could make a case for him, but in reality, the UK poster was right. Except for Tuberville, both places have been dead ends.</font></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Verdana; font-size: small; ">
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Forget the fact that when he got here in 1990 the MSU basketball program was one of the worst in a BCS conference in the country. Forget all those games he won, forget the SEC championship and the 2 SEC tourney championships. Because the final two years of his tenure were below par, our job is now looked upon as ******. Perhaps the job has always been a difficult one and Stansbury just did a super job for his first 12 years in overcoming that and winning more than he was supposed to. But no, we wouldn't want to admit that. Let's just follow Coach34's lead and blame Stans for everything.
NOW you finally get it, at least part of it. You laughed at me a couple of months ago when I said I wasn't sure that any up and comer would want this job at this point. The AD is going to have REALLY earned his money if he avoids a Freeze type hire. Freeze may turn out to be Vince Lombardi but his hire wasn't one thy would get anyone excited.
We still may have to hire an assistant coach as our new head coach because things didn't change enough for us to become a higher quality school where a current head coach would want to take a step up to.
I applaud Stansbury for what he was able to accomplish. I was too young to know anything about MSU basketball during the years we sucked, but from all accounts we were terrible. Stansbury changed that, and we should be forever grateful. But do you not find it odd that even with all of that success we have had at least2 mid major coaches that currently make 1/3 of the money we are willing to pay them turnour job down? Who do you think is responsible for that?
I love Stansbury for what he did, but if you think he is blameless for our current situation then you are kidding yourself.
I applaud Stansbury for what he was able to accomplish. I was too young to know anything about MSU basketball during the years we sucked, but from all accounts we were terrible. Stansbury changed that, and we should be forever grateful. But do you not find it odd that even with all of that success we have had at least2 mid major coaches that currently make 1/3 of the money we are willing to pay them turnour job down? Who do you think is responsible for that?
I love Stansbury for what he did, but if you think he is blameless for our current situation then you are kidding yourself.
is that coaches around the country recognized what Stans had done here, no matter WHAT the last two years were like. When you run someone off who had done more than all but one or two coaches in the program's history, that also makes them think long and hard about taking the job. The comparison to Cutcliff IS a valid one. We may still get a decent hire but the things you point out AND the things I point out are not making it easy. The lack of talent we have coming back is a HUGE factor as well. I wonder if the Moultrie announcement had anything to do with Drew backing out. It would have made ME think.
Can't compare SEC basketball to SEC football. There are mid major conferences that may be better than the SEC at the top in basketball. A Bryce Drew/ Kenny Payne hire in basketball is nowhere near as bad as a Hugh Freeze hire in the greatest conference in the nation. You're just as bad about slinging **** and negativity and then when something finally goes wrong, there you are to claim you saw it coming. Turns out, neither you nor C34, nor anyone else for that matter, saw this bull **** coming. But hopefully Scott can pull something out of his ***.shsdawg said:
Cutcliffe was one year removed from Cotton Bowls........did you read that? Cotton Bowls. That's better than an NIT appearance in basketball. Not to mention, there wasn't teammates beating the hell out of each other and "dumpster fire" references to Ole Miss' football team at the time. It was one down year and they canned him.
But expand it to other states too.
In Louisiana you've had Dale Brown and John Brady. Neither left for greener pastures. If you go back 25 years in football the only ones who left for better things might be Arnsparger and Saban, and Saban was a colossal failure in the NFL before striking gold at Bama.
In Alabama you've had Wimp, Hobbs and Gottfried at Bama and Sonny Smith, Ellis, and Lebo. All were fired. In football, it's a massacre. Stallings is the only coach who retired somewhat on his own terms. Perkins, Curry, Dubose, Shula, Price, Dye, Bowden, and Tuberville were all fired too.
Kentucky people of all people ought to realize that their situation is the exception, not the rule, but even there Sutton got canned, Pitino left on his own, Tubby left before they fired him, and Gillespie got fired. Cal will be there until he gets bored with college ball or given a show cause penalty.
In Louisiana you've had Dale Brown and John Brady. Neither left for greener pastures. If you go back 25 years in football the only ones who left for better things might be Arnsparger and Saban, and Saban was a colossal failure in the NFL before striking gold at Bama.
In Alabama you've had Wimp, Hobbs and Gottfried at Bama and Sonny Smith, Ellis, and Lebo. All were fired. In football, it's a massacre. Stallings is the only coach who retired somewhat on his own terms. Perkins, Curry, Dubose, Shula, Price, Dye, Bowden, and Tuberville were all fired too.
Kentucky people of all people ought to realize that their situation is the exception, not the rule, but even there Sutton got canned, Pitino left on his own, Tubby left before they fired him, and Gillespie got fired. Cal will be there until he gets bored with college ball or given a show cause penalty.
You make some valid points, but when it comes to LSU and Bama football and UK basketball, it is rare (except in a case like Pitino and Saban) that a coaching change isn't a firing. Those jobs aren't stepping stones like MSU and Ole Miss, which really haven't been stepping stones at all.DawgatAuburn said:
Funny you should mention Richard and Sherrill - two people who "retired" to oblivion.Coach34 said:
were hesitant to dump Stans even though he was not getting the job done now that he had in the past. We are a decent basketball job, and yes the new facility improves its attractiveness a little, but no realistic fan should have really been thinking coaches from all over were going to be beating our door down. Sorry but basketball jobs in the SEC, when you aren't KY, are just not that great and are in NO way viewed like the SEC football jobs. And that goes even without whatever "inner" issues our program might have had over the past couple of years. I have said all along that when you have 4 to 5 thousand fans in the seats at non-conference games and 7 to 8 thousand fans for conference games EVEN IN GOOD YEARS then you are NOT a big time basketball school and that is our situation right now. Scott should still be able to find a very capable basketball coach but I sincerely doubt its going to be the "sexy" hire so many here initially wanted.
That'sbecause your self-esteem isn't attached to message board cred and you actually care enough about MSU to not post negative information to prove you are in the know or to support an agenda.HD6 said:
I guess that's the point. We're no more a dead end job than most other jobs. You win, you get a better opportunity (Saban, Pitino). You lose, you get fired (everyone else.) The difference is UK hoops is a stepping stone to the NBA, Bama and LSU are SS to the NFL, and State and Ole Miss are stepping stones to better college jobs (Tuberville, perhaps Mullen one day).