"We've won the war."

[fatpiggy]

I don't think Iran is winning. I don't think anyone is winning. We are locked in a lose-lose struggle at the moment. The problem is we think of this as a zero sum game - either we win all or lose all. That is 20th century thinking. One would think Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq showed us the flaws in that thinking.

As for the nukes it is entirely laughable that y'all think they could have a nuke anytime soon. We kicked their a$$ with a couple bunker busting bombs in 2025. I am ALL FOR doing that as often as we see activity at their nuclear sites. But no, we had to go execute their entire leadership, attack their conventional military, bomb hundreds of school girls and the like.

As for "doing exactly what we want him to": Trump is deeply underwater with everyone except the absolute hardcore nutbags who continue to support him despite a mountain of evidence he is doing an awful job. He will go down in history as a monster and 10 years from now most of y'all will pretend you never supported him.

I disagree. We are winning, we will continue to win. Never underestimate the US Military. Iran is losing by almost every metric.

And while you may think Trump is underwater I disagree. Trump may be underwater on Iran, but I assure you we love what he is doing otherwise.

DEI is getting a donkey kick to the face. That’s probably #1 issue on my list behind the economy, even ahead of immigration. Immigration is a decisive win for Trump.


You see where MI 5 excluded white applicants? Yeah, no doubt democrats want that here and Trump is in the way.

We are winning. Iran is getting their *** kicked. ($2mm+ Iranian Rials per dollar this morning)

iF gas prices trend lower into mid terms, which I think they will, Republicans will outperform current expectations at midterms by a lot.

 

[fatpiggy]

Economy - Check. Much better off than Democrats. Just look at the data and numbers.


Immigration - check. Decisive victory for Trump. Democrats said it couldn’t be done.

Culture wars - check. DEI dying. Trannys labeled mentally Ill. Doctors prevented from Mutilating children. Returning to meritocracy and away from racist Marxism.

MAGA is doing just fine. We will way outperform
Current expectations at midterms.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

I disagree. We are winning, we will continue to win. Never underestimate the US Military. Iran is losing by almost every metric.

And while you may think Trump is underwater I disagree. Trump may be underwater on Iran, but I assure you we love what he is doing otherwise.

DEI is getting a donkey kick to the face. That’s probably #1 issue on my list behind the economy, even ahead of immigration. Immigration is a decisive win for Trump.


You see where MI 5 excluded white applicants? Yeah, no doubt democrats want that here and Trump is in the way.

We are winning. Iran is getting their *** kicked. ($2mm+ Iranian Rials per dollar this morning)

iF gas prices trend lower into mid terms, which I think they will, Republicans will outperform current expectations at midterms by a lot.

I will never again count Trump out (I've learned that lesson already) so I grant you it is possible you will be right on the midterms. But at the moment all signs point to a beat down...unless he manages to mess with electoral processes in purple districts.

Regardless, I think those that still support Trump are delusional in their support. He is actively damaging our economy, our military, our foreign policy, and more. America is much weaker today than we were when he took office ... and it ain't exactly close.

 

[fatpiggy]

I will never again count Trump out (I've learned that lesson already) so I grant you it is possible you will be right on the midterms. But at the moment all signs point to a beat down...unless he manages to mess with electoral processes in purple districts.

Regardless, I think those that still support Trump are delusional in their support. He is actively damaging our economy, our military, our foreign policy, and more. America is much weaker today than we were when he took office ... and it ain't exactly close.

How can you say he is actively destroying our economy, when almost all economic data is better than under the democrats Biden admin? I don’t want to hear a Covid excuse. Dems lost because they used the Covid excuse for too long and no one believed them.

I’m not saying MAGA will outright win midterms, the incumbent party has several disadvantages. But I also think your feed is skewed. MAGA is very happy with Trump, but I do give you the Iran exception. My position is they will outperform CURRENT expectations which are not great.

America a is much weaker today? In what respect? We have limited one of our biggest threats in Iranian nukes. Russia is a side show and Ukraine has been seemingly making strides with our help and weapons.


You are normally an objective poster but I think your bias is shining through this morning.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

We are just going to

How can you say he is actively destroying our economy, when almost all economic data is better than under the democrats Biden admin? I don’t want to hear a Covid excuse. Dems lost because they used the Covid excuse for too long and no one believed them.

I’m not saying MAGA will outright win midterms, the incumbent party has several disadvantages. But I also think your feed is skewed. MAGA is very happy with Trump, but I do give you the Iran exception. My position is they will outperform CURRENT expectations which are not great.

America a is much weaker today? In what respect? We have limited one of our biggest threats in Iranian nukes. Russia is a side show and Ukraine has been seemingly making strides with our help and weapons.


You are normally an objective poster but I think your bias is shining through this morning.

We are just going to disagree. Inflation is higher than when Trump entered office, he has failed on every economic promise he gave, we have dumb tarriffs all over and on and on and on.

And yes, I acknowledge my bias. But in this case I think the data supports my point of view. I think you might have an opposite bias TBH that clouds your judgement on this.

 

[fatpiggy]

We are just going to

We are just going to disagree. Inflation is higher than when Trump entered office, he has failed on every economic promise he gave, we have dumb tarriffs all over and on and on and on.

And yes, I acknowledge my bias. But in this case I think the data supports my point of view. I think you might have an opposite bias TBH that clouds your judgement on this.

You are judging the Biden admin on the inflation rate on the day that he left office. That rate did not reflect his term at all. Not even close. Inflation expectations fell the day Trump won in November. Democrats can blame Covid all they want, but that was only a part of the problem and the Democrats failure to manage that problem lead to the highest inflation in 50 years, a 9% yoy rate. Inflation was the #1 issue last election and democrats lost convincingly to "Hitler".

I think your average voter see's that MAGA is better for their wallet, tariffs and all. Is it perfect, NO. Far from it. But if you have to choose between the two, it's MAGA economics all day every day.

Not to mention that the Democrat leader for presidency is an economically illiterate self-described socialist, and I don't think Democrats are going to win on that platform.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

You are judging the Biden admin on the inflation rate on the day that he left office. That rate did not reflect his term at all. Not even close. Inflation expectations fell the day Trump won in November. Democrats can blame Covid all they want, but that was only a part of the problem and the Democrats failure to manage that problem lead to the highest inflation in 50 years, a 9% yoy rate. Inflation was the #1 issue last election and democrats lost convincingly to "Hitler".

I think your average voter see's that MAGA is better for their wallet, tariffs and all. Is it perfect, NO. Far from it. But if you have to choose between the two, it's MAGA economics all day every day.

Not to mention that the Democrat leader for presidency is an economically illiterate self-described socialist, and I don't think Democrats are going to win on that platform.

And you are ignoring Trump’s influence on the inflation in Biden’s term. The truth is they both sucked on inflation.

 

[lucas80]

It sounds like the war is still going on.

 

[Knickslions69]

It’s all okay. We have Lake America now

 

[Anon1750875978]

To date, the only thing Merica has successfully done is kill a school full of young girls as a result of misdated intelligence.
And I use the word "intelligence" lightly.

Lost world support, minus Bibi, and forced up the cost of consumer goods and energy.

I'm getting tired of so much #winning.

 

[fatpiggy]

And you are ignoring Trump’s influence on the inflation in Biden’s term. The truth is they both sucked on inflation.

We will have to, again, agree to disagree. There is a clear difference in my mind.

Democrat Governors shut everything down during covid. If you look at inflation on a state level post covid, i think you will find that Republican lead states average almost 1 full percentage point lower in inflation than their Democrat counterparts.

 

[baltimorened]

Fair points. I would have preferred more lawn mowings as needed, but now that we are in it, regime collapse from economic and military pressure is my hope - and seems a possibility if reports are true that Iran cannot meet its army payroll and so forth.

What say you?

here's the part I don't understand....The military operates on "objectives"....I.e, what do we want to accomplish. it's clearly laid out in the basic 5 paragraph field order.

So, if I understood correctly the stated objectives for the Iran excursion were to deny Iran the ability to develope a nuclear weapon and to destroy Iran's ability to manufacture weapons that threaten their neighbors (ballistic missiles)..OK, we've done those things according to Pentagon leaders and President Trump.

Then came the strait of Hormuz...kind of a we broke it we need to fix it objective...well, again according to our leaders, we control the strait...ships are moving.....check, another objective completed.

Now accomplishing what we set out to do, the question becomes, "what the heck are we doing now?"

 

[Scrubby]

They discombobulated him

 

[firegiver]

It may not be over and we may not have won yet, but Iran is getting their *** kicked.

moral victory? yay?

 

[fatpiggy]

moral victory? yay?

In the end it will be a real victory. No one is declaring victory yet. It's kind of like that FSU vs Clemson football game a few years ago. We were up something like 63-17 in the 3rd quarter. You had to keep playing but the only thing the other team can do to stop you is run out the clock. Iran is getting their *** kicked. How much time remains in the game is up to them. They may score a couple mop up points, but everyone knows who won.

Iran won't have a nuclrear weapon.
They will have lost a lot of respect from their neighbors that they attacked.
Strategic alternatives will erode Iran's long term stronghold on the region. (alternative pipelines, shipping lanes)
Their economy is in shambles.

When it's over, it will be more than a moral victory.

 

[Huey Grey 2]

here's the part I don't understand....The military operates on "objectives"....I.e, what do we want to accomplish. it's clearly laid out in the basic 5 paragraph field order.

So, if I understood correctly the stated objectives for the Iran excursion were to deny Iran the ability to develope a nuclear weapon and to destroy Iran's ability to manufacture weapons that threaten their neighbors (ballistic missiles)..OK, we've done those things according to Pentagon leaders and President Trump.

Then came the strait of Hormuz...kind of a we broke it we need to fix it objective...well, again according to our leaders, we control the strait...ships are moving.....check, another objective completed.

Now accomplishing what we set out to do, the question becomes, "what the heck are we doing now?"

There is no objective beyond a senile 80 man getting bored and wanting to inside trade off a war. How are you not getting that?

 

[Riveting]

And you are ignoring Trump’s influence on the inflation in Biden’s term. The truth is they both sucked on inflation.

CPI total increase in Trump term one: 7.8%

Total increase in Biden term: 21%.

The numbers don't lie, Trav.

 

[Riveting]

There is no objective beyond a senile 80 man getting bored and wanting to inside trade off a war. How are you not getting that?

Is that more of your critical thinking, like your insight that we are running out of missiles because we are bombing the Iranian desert and wastelands?

 

[Finance85]

Besides the need to manipulate the oil market for insiders, and if we've won the war, then why the need to start lobbing missiles again?

This was a pretty stupid war. It continues to be a stupid war.

 

[dpic73]

We will have to, again, agree to disagree. There is a clear difference in my mind.

Democrat Governors shut everything down during covid. If you look at inflation on a state level post covid, i think you will find that Republican lead states average almost 1 full percentage point lower in inflation than their Democrat counterparts.

 

[baltimorened]

How can you say he is actively destroying our economy, when almost all economic data is better than under the democrats Biden admin? I don’t want to hear a Covid excuse. Dems lost because they used the Covid excuse for too long and no one believed them.

I’m not saying MAGA will outright win midterms, the incumbent party has several disadvantages. But I also think your feed is skewed. MAGA is very happy with Trump, but I do give you the Iran exception. My position is they will outperform CURRENT expectations which are not great.

America a is much weaker today? In what respect? We have limited one of our biggest threats in Iranian nukes. Russia is a side show and Ukraine has been seemingly making strides with our help and weapons.


You are normally an objective poster but I think your bias is shining through this morning.

not to be contrarian, but unless there has been a significant shift in party affiliations, 27% of voters are Republican and 27% are democrats....so even if every republican votes that way in the mid terms, they are dependent on independents to win elections. And, while MAGA republicans might be happy with Trump's economy, most of the independents in my circle are not. No matter the "facts" as presented, people see inflation, grocery prices, growing debt, interests/mortgage rates, a war with no clear end, the constant chaos and they are not happy. Personally, I don't compare this economy to Biden's Trump 1 or anybody else's for that matter. I try to look at things as they are today, and I just don't see things as booming and I don't see any plans on the horizon from the administration to overcome today's problems. Congress has not helped as they don't seem able to manage themselves much less the economy....just my 2 cents

 

[baltimorened]

And you are ignoring Trump’s influence on the inflation in Biden’s term. The truth is they both sucked on inflation.

I think that's true. Trump's first term carried over to Biden's in the same way Biden's carried over to trump's. Trump's problem though is that he came into office making a lot of promises - that most intelligent people knew he couldn't keep - and voters remember those. In the same vein, since Trump is not on the ballot, representatives and Senate candidates have to come up with their own "promises" at the same time defending trumps's. It's way easier for voters to fall for the promises of what might be than accept the promises that were made that simply didn't happen.
But I'm not a vote projection guru. There's still a lot of time between now and the election and you'd think both parties might have something up their sleeves. We'll find out shortly

 

[baltimorened]

To date, the only thing Merica has successfully done is kill a school full of young girls as a result of misdated intelligence.
And I use the word "intelligence" lightly.

Lost world support, minus Bibi, and forced up the cost of consumer goods and energy.

I'm getting tired of so much #winning.

I don't think that's accurate...even if we missed 50% of the time, the number of munitions dropped/aimed at the nuclear and missile production sites had to have had some positive impact. That's what is hard to understand...we accomplished what we said we wanted to accomplish, what are we still there?

 

[Huey Grey 2]

I think that's true. Trump's first term carried over to Biden's in the same way Biden's carried over to trump's. Trump's problem though is that he came into office making a lot of promises - that most intelligent people knew he couldn't keep - and voters remember those. In the same vein, since Trump is not on the ballot, representatives and Senate candidates have to come up with their own "promises" at the same time defending trumps's. It's way easier for voters to fall for the promises of what might be than accept the promises that were made that simply didn't happen.
But I'm not a vote projection guru. There's still a lot of time between now and the election and you'd think both parties might have something up their sleeves. We'll find out shortly

There's barely any time to substantively change anything by November. Inflation is baked in. High gas prices are baked in. The war is baked in.

There are no sleeves. It's out in the open how bad Trump has been and how weak Republicans have been to oppose him.

 

[Anon1750875978]

I don't think that's accurate...even if we missed 50% of the time, the number of munitions dropped/aimed at the nuclear and missile production sites had to have had some positive impact. That's what is hard to understand...we accomplished what we said we wanted to accomplish, what are we still there?

How does anyone know what the mission was???

The reasons change weekly depending on how badly the war efforts are going.
One thing is certain...Iran has been obliterated.

 

[Anon1750875978]

There's barely any time to substantively change anything by November. Inflation is baked in. High gas prices are baked in. The war is baked in.

There are no sleeves. It's out in the open how bad Trump has been and how weak Republicans have been to oppose him.

Farmers gonna love the prices for their fall fertilizer applications.

Eff em.

 

[DFSNOLE_rivals]

here's the part I don't understand....The military operates on "objectives"....I.e, what do we want to accomplish. it's clearly laid out in the basic 5 paragraph field order.

So, if I understood correctly the stated objectives for the Iran excursion were to deny Iran the ability to develope a nuclear weapon and to destroy Iran's ability to manufacture weapons that threaten their neighbors (ballistic missiles)..OK, we've done those things according to Pentagon leaders and President Trump.

Then came the strait of Hormuz...kind of a we broke it we need to fix it objective...well, again according to our leaders, we control the strait...ships are moving.....check, another objective completed.

Now accomplishing what we set out to do, the question becomes, "what the heck are we doing now?"

The fact you believe what comes out of this administration is hilarious. Do you also believe them when they said the war has been won 25+ different times?

How about other things this administration claims? Gas at $1.95/gallon. Food prices down. The US being more respected than at any time in history. Trump comparing himself to Christ.

Trump and his entire administration lie. A lot. Stop being gullible.

 

[DFSNOLE_rivals]

When it's over, it will be more than a moral victory.

At what cost? What exactly will have been achieved that wasn't already in place under JCPOA? Remember, that agreement had the backing of the P5+1 (the US, UK, France, Russia, China, and Germany) plus the European Union.

 

[hawkeyetraveler]

CPI total increase in Trump term one: 7.8%

Total increase in Biden term: 21%.

The numbers don't lie, Trav.

Biden printed WAY too much stimulus IMO. I’ve never said otherwise. But Trump printed even more. You and I have discussed that ad nauseum. Biden inherited a looming inflation crisis and made it worse…no doubt. But Trump handed him the crisis.

Inflation takes a while to kick in after a policy action as you well know. So while the numbers are what they are, you can’t put all of Biden’s inflation on him alone.

Conversely Trump got handed an economy with inflation rates falling only to promptly issue tariffs and start a war to pick it back up somewhat.

Again, both of them had bad policies/actions vis-a-vis the inflation rate. That is the truth.

 

[Riveting]

At what cost? What exactly will have been achieved that wasn't already in place under JCPOA? Remember, that agreement had the backing of the P5+1 (the US, UK, France, Russia, China, and Germany) plus the European Union.

Thanks for the comical post immediately after one in which you say "stop being gullible."

Congress never approved the jcpoa it was such a weak appeasement deal. Even Schumer was against it because of the 24-day (not hour, day) notice before inspections of undeclared nuclear sites.

 

[firegiver]

We will have to, again, agree to disagree. There is a clear difference in my mind.

Democrat Governors shut everything down during covid. If you look at inflation on a state level post covid, i think you will find that Republican lead states average almost 1 full percentage point lower in inflation than their Democrat counterparts.

If Trump's doing so great with the economy. Why are the job numbers such ****?
When you say economy, do you just mean the stock market?
Because by the metrics of jobs, he's doing terrible.

US economy loses 23,000 jobs in July as labor market weakens

U.S. employers shed 23,000 jobs and the unemployment rate fell to 4.1% in July, new Labor Department data shows.

www.usatoday.com

He's created terrible relationships with our trading partners, thus prices are going up on goods...
He's created a war pushing up the global price of oil. The only reason its not way more expensive at the pump is because of China burning through their reserves now, by the way we are too.
He's going to leave the next president a HUGE MESS. Its going badly... by a whole lot of metrics.

 

[Riveting]

Biden printed WAY too much stimulus IMO. I’ve never said otherwise. But Trump printed even more. You and I have discussed that ad nauseum. Biden inherited a looming inflation crisis and made it worse…no doubt. But Trump handed him the crisis.

Inflation takes a while to kick in after a policy action as you well know. So while the numbers are what they are, you can’t put all of Biden’s inflation on him alone.

Conversely Trump got handed an economy with inflation rates falling only to promptly issue tariffs and start a war to pick it back up somewhat.

Again, both of them had bad policies/actions vis-a-vis the inflation rate. That is the truth.

What Trump handed autopen was a covid vaccine that Joe bungled the implementation. Joe also did much to wreck our energy production with his idiot green energy policies.

You didn't address the substantial difference in the CPI numbers:

- 21% in 4 years under autopen.
- 7.8% in Trump 1
- 4.8% so far in Trump 2

 

[Riveting]

If Trump's doing so great with the economy. Why are the job numbers such ****?
When you say economy, do you just mean the stock market?
Because by the metrics of jobs, he's doing terrible.

US economy loses 23,000 jobs in July as labor market weakens

U.S. employers shed 23,000 jobs and the unemployment rate fell to 4.1% in July, new Labor Department data shows.

www.usatoday.com

He's created terrible relationships with our trading partners, thus prices are going up on goods...
He's created a war pushing up the global price of oil. The only reason its not way more expensive at the pump is because of China burning through their reserves now, by the way we are too.
He's going to leave the next president a HUGE MESS. Its going badly... by a whole lot of metrics.

Because he has shrunk the fed workforce by ~300,000

 

[DFSNOLE_rivals]

Thanks for the comical post immediately after one in which you say "stop being gullible."

Congress never approved the jcpoa it was such a weak appeasement deal. Even Schumer was against it because of the 24-day (not hour, day) notice before inspections of undeclared nuclear sites.

BAU for MAGA. Deflect. Try answering the questions.

Congressional approval was not needed for the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA) because the Obama administration structured it as a non-binding political commitment rather than a formal treaty. Treaties require a two-thirds ratification vote in the U.S. Senate, but executive political commitments do not require formal congressional approval to take effect.The Role of Congress and INARAReview Process: Congress passed the bipartisan Iran Nuclear Agreement Review Act (INARA) of 2015. This law required the president to submit the deal for legislative review.Disapproval Veto: INARA gave lawmakers a 60-day review window to pass a joint resolution of disapproval.Outcome: Opponents failed to muster the necessary supermajorities to override a promised presidential veto, allowing the agreement to proceed without a formal congressional vote of approval.

 

[firegiver]

Because he has shrunk the fed workforce by ~300,000

And where did all that money go?
How about you cite a source for your claim.
Because that doesnt account for all the job losses last month.

 

[Riveting]

BAU for MAGA. Deflect. Try answering the questions.

Congressional approval was not needed for the Joint Comprehensive Plan of Action (JCPOA) because the Obama administration structured it as a non-binding political commitment rather than a formal treaty. Treaties require a two-thirds ratification vote in the U.S. Senate, but executive political commitments do not require formal congressional approval to take effect.The Role of Congress and INARAReview Process: Congress passed the bipartisan Iran Nuclear Agreement Review Act (INARA) of 2015. This law required the president to submit the deal for legislative review.Disapproval Veto: INARA gave lawmakers a 60-day review window to pass a joint resolution of disapproval.Outcome: Opponents failed to muster the necessary supermajorities to override a promised presidential veto, allowing the agreement to proceed without a formal congressional vote of approval.

What questions? I was commenting on your absurd statement - made more absurd by saying Russia and China backed it, as if that is supposed to give us confidence.

You are not denying the 24-day (not hour) inspection notice, which was pathetic by any standard but appeasement.

 

[dpic73]

What Trump handed autopen was a covid vaccine that Joe bungled the implementation. Joe also did much to wreck our energy production with his idiot green energy policies.

You didn't address the substantial difference in the CPI numbers:

- 21% in 4 years under autopen.
- 7.8% in Trump 1
- 4.8% so far in Trump 2

How did Joe bungle the implementation? If it wasn't for him, it would have been months before most people had access to the vax as Trump just dropped it off to the states with no coordination and spent the month after it was rolled out crying about fake election fraud, while only mentioning the vaccine once. What a laughable statement.

 

[tigres88]

"We've won the war of choice" @NorthernHawkeye who won the war of choice against his wife by punching her

 

[dpic73]

If Trump's doing so great with the economy. Why are the job numbers such ****?
When you say economy, do you just mean the stock market?
Because by the metrics of jobs, he's doing terrible.

US economy loses 23,000 jobs in July as labor market weakens

U.S. employers shed 23,000 jobs and the unemployment rate fell to 4.1% in July, new Labor Department data shows.

www.usatoday.com

He's created terrible relationships with our trading partners, thus prices are going up on goods...
He's created a war pushing up the global price of oil. The only reason its not way more expensive at the pump is because of China burning through their reserves now, by the way we are too.
He's going to leave the next president a HUGE MESS. Its going badly... by a whole lot of metrics.

 

[Riveting]

How did Joe bungle the implementation? If it wasn't for him, it would have been months before most people had access to the vax as Trump just dropped it off to the states with no coordination and spent the month after it was rolled out crying about fake election fraud, while only mentioning the vaccine once. What a laughable statement.

The states all have their own public health systems so it was reasonable to expect them to be able to handle it, considering they knew it was coming. And some states did quite well, such was WVa.