Williams vs Stansbury (I dont want this post getting lost)

[Dawgbreeze]

I was at my daughter's soccer practice the other night, and 2 dads didn't get the memo that it was canceled....me being one, and the other was one dad i hadn't met nor seen....well, to make it short, it was a former player during my time at State....we took our daughter's across the fields to a private area and we practiced with our girls....just me, him and our girls....I don't know if its appropriate to state his name with his comments without his permission, seeing it was just the 2 of us talking....but most of you familiar with the late 90s teams should be able to figure out who it is....

conversation started about our current team, and Ill give you what he said, but the most interesting comments were Williams v. Stansbury....

first off, he thinks this team is in.....Sydney could very well be the cancer that causes Stansbury to lose his job.....his best team probably ever, and Sydney holding them back...

he also said almost verbatim, exactly what Shane Power said.....Stans is a much better coach than people give him credit for, and not as a great recruiter as many think....

His opinion of the whole fire/keep Stans is to keep him.....he told me, something like 3 most wins ever in SEC overall, 6 most wins in SEC history....( i wasn't sure the difference, but i got his point)....he said that there are only 2 coaches in the SEC that are better than Stans in SEC now, UF and UK....I made the point to him (i am not a Stans supporter) that the bottom line is, you are judged by Tourney appearances and success in it.....he totally agreed and that is when he went back to say that he thinks this team is better than its record shows, and Sydney has caused more losses and turmoil than games he has helped us win....and it very well could cost Stansbury his job......

He went further to say "right now" i say Stans needs to stay....he is 3rd best coach in this league, and it is a risky move to get rid of Stansbury right now (he used the term 'risky' several times).....he mentioned Pelphry as a guy that was fired prematurely and was a great coach...

now, he played with williams as head coach and stans as HC......he said much what C34 said about Williams.....the players respected him, and he was a hard ***.....he was the disciplinarian that is what this current team would need right now.....he said guys WOULD NOT take shots in games for fear of being pulled out of the game....on the other hand, he said Stansbury lets them "play" and that is the main difference between the two coaching styles....

One thing I have never known about Stansbury, and he mentioned that "what most people don't (didn't) know about Stansbury".....is that during the RW era, Stansbury did all of the scouting of the opposing teams, ALL the game planning, and writing up all the plays that would work for a particular game, also did all the recruiting and keeping in touch with the recruits, not RW.....in turn, he mentioned, because Stans did all that, then we had the Final 4 run, is what led to RW's arrogance that eventually cost him his job.....after the Final Four, RW became very arrogant, and did no recruiting (Stans did all of that too).....said RW became the coach that showed up only at practices and games....and it became very obvious to both the players, assistant coaches, and the AD.....and that is why RW was forced out....i thought that was interesting.....He did say, that he thinks that may be Stans problem, that he tries to do too much as a HC and doesn't pass along enough responsibilities to his assistants...

a couple of more interesting things he told me, when I said I think its a bad thing with a team when they have a players only meeting (much like Colin Cowherd says).....he went on and said they had a few players only meetings, including one during the FF run.....another story he told me, during the SEC tourney, 20 guys were crammed into a hotel room, and Stans addresses the team, and about 3 mins into him talking a loud roar of a snore lets out.....it was Dampier and he was sound asleep....the whole team busted out laughing....Stans never said another word, and they went out and beat Kentucky....(i am assuming that was the 96 championship game)....

again, I was gonna post this at some point, but I thought this thread was worthy for the reply....

 

[maroonmania]

keeping Stans. Yes, I get frustrated with a lot of what I see on the court when I know what our team's potential is and yes, I get fed up with the soap opera that seems to be Rick's program and his lack of control with his players. However, I remember just how bad MSU basketball CAN be pre-Williams and Stans and as I look around at other SEC basketball programs who THOUGHT they were upgrading their HC position only to fall into basketball purgatory. As I weigh the factors of all the positives and negatives of Stansbury I still feel there is a higher percentage our program gets worse with a coaching change than there is that it gets better. Some of you say "well I don't care how our program does if we aren't advancing in the NCAA tournament". Well, I'm not in that camp. I love getting into and playing well at NCAA tournament time but that, for me, is not the end all be all. I also enjoy having a program that is No. 1 in the state to MS recruits and in most years being .500 or better in a pretty competitive SEC. I've also enjoyed winning an outright SEC title and being in the SEC tournament finals 4 of the past 9 years. And though next year could be rough we still have a great class coming in that should have us quite competitive in the future. My biggest 2 gripes with Stans is that he should hire more qualified assistants to help him and he also should demand more respect from his players. However, I just think most of the folks on here who think we are going to be able to bring in a coach who will routinely have us playing deep into the NCAA tournament are not being very realistic. With all the talent we've had come through the program we've only made the round of 16 or better twice in the history of the school. And beyond that, now that Mullen is here, a lot of MSU fans aren't as focused on basketball anyway which makes it even tougher to push to those levels as far as fan support goes.

 

[shsdawg]

Andy Kennedy so much.

 

[klerushund]

...we have a FINAL 17ING FOUR banner hanging in our coliseum because of Richard Williams. <div>
</div><div>
</div>

 

[fishwater99]

..



first off, he thinks this team is in.....<span style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">Sydney</span> could very well be the cancer that causes Stansbury to lose his job.....his best team probably ever, and Sydney holding them back...

he also said almost verbatim, exactly what Shane Power said.....Stans is a much better coach than people give him credit for, and not as a great recruiter as many think....<span style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">(I somewhat agree)</span><br style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">
His opinion of the whole fire/keep Stans is to keep him.....he told me, something like 3 most wins ever in SEC overall, 6 most wins in SEC history....( i wasn't sure the difference, but i got his point)....he said that there are only 2 coaches in the SEC that are better than Stans in SEC now, UF and UK....I made the point to him (i am not a Stans supporter) that the bottom line is, y<span style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">ou are judged by Tourney appearances and success in it.....he totally agreed and that is when he went back to say that he thinks this team is better than its record shows</span>, and Sydney has caused more losses and turmoil than games he has helped us win....and it very well could cost Stansbury his job......


now, he played with williams as head coach and stans as HC......he said much what C34 said about <span style="font-weight: bold;">Williams.....the players respected him, and he was a hard ***.....he was the disciplinarian that is what this current team would need right now.....he said guys WOULD NOT take shots in games for fear of being pulled out of the game.</span>...on the other hand, he said Stansbury lets them "play" and that is the main difference between the two coaching styles....<span style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">(Good Point)</span>

One thing I have never known about Stansbury, and he mentioned that "what most people don't (didn't) know about Stansbury".....is that during the RW era, Stansbury did all of the scouting of the opposing teams, ALL the game planning, and writing up all the plays that would work for a particular game, also did all the recruiting and keeping in touch with the recruits, not RW.....in turn, he mentioned, because Stans did all that, then we had the Final 4 run, is what led to RW's arrogance that eventually cost him his job.....after the Final Four, RW became very arrogant, and did no recruiting (Stans did all of that too).....said <span style="font-weight: bold;">RW became the coach that showed up only at practices and games....and it became very obvious to both the players, assistant coaches, and the AD.....and that is why RW was forced out</span>...<span style="font-weight: bold; text-decoration: underline;">(Dick was asked to resign because he was sleeping with a Pom squad girl, that's a fact)</span>.i thought that was interesting.....He did say, that he thinks that may be Stans problem, that he tries to do too much as a HC and doesn't pass along enough responsibilities to his assistants...

Thanks for the info.........

 

[anon1754664043]

If Stansbury did all the recruiting, game planning, scouting and handled discipline when Richard was the coach, then why does he send unprepared, undisciplined, unmotivated teams out to play game after game while he is the head coach...... something does not add up.

 

[KurtRambis4]

bring out. I'm probably seen as a "Stansbury supporter" who thinks he can do no wrong by the coach34/fishwater/lars crowd. However I am just trying to refute points made by people on here that are ridiculous. Some of this crowd thinks that Stansbury can't even tie his own shoes, and that Stansbury has no clue how to coach basketball. That assumption is just plain out stupid. To think they he has gotten where he is now without ANY knowledge of coaching is just 17ing dumb, to say the least. However, I can also say that he isn't the second coming of John Wooden. I just think it is ridiculous for some of these clowns to suggest (or even flat out state) that he cannot coach and is a moron.</p>

 

[Coach34]

If Stansbury did all the recruiting, game planning, scouting and handled discipline when Richard was the coach, then why does he send unprepared, undisciplined, unmotivated teams out to play game after game while he is the head coach...... something does not add up.

Stansbury has never been any kind of discipline coach- thats just a bunch of crap- Williams handled discipline while he coached- to state otherwise is ludicrous

It's amazing how Stansbury did the exact opposite as an assistant that he does as a head coach

 

[maroonmania]

Stans handled discipline when Williams was coaching. Recruiting, game planning and scouting yes but certainly not discipline. Stans doesn't do enough of that while running his own program much less when an assistant for someone else. Probably the biggest reason he doesn't get much respect from his players. Of course though when you use the old "hear no evil, see no evil" that Stans does you never convince yourself there is a NEED for discipline. Stans will continue to tell you there are no issues with this team or program and never has been.

 

[Coach34]

Stans handled discipline when Williams was coaching. Recruiting, game planning and scouting yes but certainly not discipline. Stans doesn't do enough of that while running his own program much less when an assistant for someone else. Probably the biggest reason he doesn't get much respect from his players. Of course though when you use the old "hear no evil, see no evil" that Stans does you never convince yourself there is a NEED for discipline. Stans will continue to tell you there are no issues with this team or program and never has been.

but Richard didnt even have him at practice at times- had him our recruiting instead. aGAIN, anybody that watched them practice or was ever around the team knew who ran that show- Richard Williams

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

Or your friend a liar or something. He says RW wouldn't even let Stans come to practices.

 

[KurtRambis4]

he mention Stansbury handling discipline? It's funny how we get something straight from a player (and this isn't the first former player) mentioningthings disputing your assertions, and it's false information and not true. Yet, we are supposed to believe something coming from a private school jr. high girls basketball coach?? I know you hate Stansbury because he took over for your boyfriend, but just try to be objective.

 

[Dawgbreeze]

Stans handled discipline when Williams was coaching. Recruiting, game planning and scouting yes but certainly not discipline. Stans doesn't do enough of that while running his own program much less when an assistant for someone else. Probably the biggest reason he doesn't get much respect from his players. Of course though when you use the old "hear no evil, see no evil" that Stans does you never convince yourself there is a NEED for discipline. Stans will continue to tell you there are no issues with this team or program and never has been.

but Richard didnt even have him at practice at times- had him our recruiting instead. aGAIN, anybody that watched them practice or was ever around the team knew who ran that show- Richard Williams

 

[Dawgbreeze]

another guy that transferred out of Williams program.

 

[dpaul6]

You say talk to Calipari and Donovan about how good he is and how much they like him.....if I recall all the coaches in the SEC loved Crooms too

 

[Dawgbreeze]

You say talk to Calipari and Donovan about how good he is and how much they like him.....if I recall all the coaches in the SEC loved Crooms too

Stansbury has won the SEC, beat Florida, and played Kentucky's butts off. When Stans goes 0for in the league, then try to make that comparison. Go back and help coach out, he needs it.

 

[Coach34]

because they knew the program would never advance under him. Just like those guys know the basketball program wont ever advance nationally under Stansbury


Not to mention Crooms has a Coach of the Year trophy- as does Richard Williams... Stansbury doesnt

 

[Dawgbreeze]

because they knew the program would never advance under him. Just like those guys know the basketball program wont ever advance nationally under Stansbury


Not to mention Crooms has a Coach of the Year trophy- as does Richard Williams... Stansbury doesnt

Croom is not even close to Stansbury and even you know it but we all know you'll never admit you could be wrong about something. After all, it was you who said Richard Williams and Rick Pitino are the best two college coaches around. That in itself shows your ignorance.

 

[coach66]

a better coach. He simply won't give the others coaches the responsibilities they need and then let them do their job and hold them accountable according to Deep.

 

[KurtRambis4]

all of the facts and making up theories.

 

[Coach34]

.

 

[GloryDawg]

bd

 

[MadDawg.sixpack]

or am I dreaming?

nope - not dreaming, just looked it up

 

[patdog]

At the time a few other SEC coaches were pretty ++!@@%$! about him kicking their asses so they gavetheir COTY award to Dave freaking Odom. Seriously. They really did give it to Dave Odom.

 

[KurtRambis4]

with actual knowledge, as opposed to third hand-hearsay (at best), stated that Stansbury was a big part in game planning and scouting. Then you make up something refuting the original posters assertion on discipline, which the original poster never even said. When confronted about the poster not saying that, you don't even say you were wrong, you just ignore it.

 

[Coach34]

it's very normal for asst coaches to put together scouting reports. Hell, grad assts put them together along with the other teams film cut-ups in football.

As far as gameplanning- 95% of the time the players have no clue as to who is doing what. They show up, practice, and then leave to study or chase *****. As Dee Bost said this season- they arent watching much film- so they have no idea what the coaches say or input while in the offices. 9/10 of people you talk to will talk about Williams and his total control when he coached. I dont know what player he talked to- but I used to play with Burns, Merritt, Tony Watts, Greg Carter and that group- and it was always "Williams this...Williams that"....you never heard a damn word about Stansbury

Nugdawg posted about watching us practice while Williams coached- as it was exactly as I said it was- Richard Williams in total control. I even talked about Stansbury missing practices for scouting trips- and Dawgbreeze admitted reluctantly that that was true as well.

So I'm still missing all these "facts"

 

[KurtRambis4]

the thing about you, you're are NEVER wrong. You're still dodging the question. Now you're calling a player a liar but you expect people to believe you, who has zero connection to the process.

 

[Coach34]

not only did he do all the recruiting for Williams, he did everything else behind the scenes, and just let Richard look important in public. Just ignore that we ran the same tenacious D and same sets we ran before Stansbury got to State that we did to win the SEC title in 1991. Stansbury just told Williams when to show up and look cute. And Williams was so thankful for everything Stansbury did to prop him up during those years- Williams recommended Duane Reboul to be the new head coach.

Then after Stansbury actually got the job- is so smart that he changed the way things had been run- including the S&C.

We are witnessing a genius in Stansbury that is so far ahead of us- we dont even realize his greatness.

 

[dawgstudent]

[No message]

 

[Coach34]

.

 

[dawgstudent]

[No message]

 

[patdog]

I'm certain that I've seen him bitching about having a better team in baseball and losing in the playoffs to a weaker team that had a dominant pitcher because in LA their playoff format is only 1 game in each round (not a 2-of-3 series like in MS). Sounds exactly like a year or two that he gives Stans hell about.

 

[Coach34]

I'm certain that I've seen him bitching about having a better team in baseball and losing in the playoffs to a weaker team that had a dominant pitcher because in LA their playoff format is only 1 game in each round (not a 2-of-3 series like in MS). Sounds exactly like a year or two that he gives Stans hell about.

the other team wasnt "weaker"- they won 5 straight state championships...we even signed one of their players- Mr Forrest Moore

 

[dawgstudent]

[No message]

 

[Coach34]

but unfortunately, they wouldnt let that ****** pitch vs us. We got the 2nd round draft pick throwing in the low 90's.

But it's ok, I pulled the Dave Odom and got the recognition later on, even if I didnt get the hardware

 

[DerHntr]

nm

 

[KurtRambis4]

a 17ing idiot. Where did I say he was a genius? You have sTILL not answered the question, after 5 posts asking you to. I'm just under the impression that a former player(s) know more about the goings on of our program compared to some dubmass in BFE, LA.

 

[KurtRambis4]

sTILL haven't answered the question, coach