It is an employees market right now in many careers. And WFH remotely from Covid has made many consider their options more than ever before.
Young employees and work
- Thread starter TortElvisII
- Start date
Anecdotal evidence ain't got **** on empiricism. I can find 1,000 videos of entitled baby boomers being lazy, whiney slobs.
Doesn't mean **** in the grand scheme.
Doesn't mean **** in the grand scheme.
I vet all of my employees by assuring they are vaccinated and regularly boosted and that they are people of color. If they aren’t a POC, they must show me a BLM or Ukrainian yard sign or at least 10 social justice tweets.
I then pay them $39K a year.
My problem is the higher management is wondering why I'm going through so many employees. But others are as well.
Agree. Employers aren’t going to give raises worth a ****. I got about a $20K increase in income by leaving a ****** boss and going to a different company. That’s your best chance at getting the income you want, job hop because once an employer has you, they’re not going to give significantly more money if you’ve already been working there. They will let people leave and then try to hire a new person for less.
I don’t care about the woes of most employers because these people will toss you out if it could save them a dollar. My dad made it to retirement after three decades with a company but my mom, her employer got a new owner who thought older people were making too much and then tried to push them out by making life miserable.
Companies want a one way street with loyalty and then act shocked that an employee does what’s in their best interest.
But I will agree with how soft many young employees are with the ‘calling in’ sick card or “anxiety.” I think I’ve only had one sick day my entire life and that’s when I was bad off.
It is on the parents to create a sense of urgency in a child's life. It isn't because these people aren't smart enough.
If educated work should be rewarding. If education isn’t required you’re gonna get the bottom of the barrel. When going into a career everyone should weigh lifestyle as much as the dinero. I think the old school mentality of staying in a job one doesn’t like went out many years ago. Now jobs like that are just that jobs, stepping stones to a career.
You obviously aren't hiring now. Everyone I know is having this same problem. Not just fast food and WalMart. Lawyers can't get secretaries or paralegals and truckers at shipping companies and equipment operators at excavation co's.
I’m betting this young lady got her mom to do her 5-page paper, or least provided significant help.
At the same time, we could point to the issues with companies. Stuff like taking way too long in a hiring process and then letting good candidates get away due to the company dragging their feet with three interviews or waiting weeks to get back to someone, not being up front about salary, wanting lots of experience and qualifications and then want to pay like $40K.
With inflation out of control, it’s going to be even more difficult to get people to sign on to a soulless job for crap money and to simply try and boost the income of the owner. I worked for a guy who was an absolute POS who wanted one person to work essentially three to four jobs and then pay crap but the owner would constantly be going on vacations and trips and then act upset if there was the slightest obstacle.
I think this has been a long time coming. I’m not referring to entitled 20 somethings. I’m talking about everybody who has had to work for greedy bastards who don’t care about their employees or reward the production and want to take advantage of people. Companies fail to understand it costs more to constantly have turnover than to properly pay their employees.
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I'm simply discussing the issues for both employer and employee instead of the "young people just don't wanna work" narrative. If we can be critical of the employee landscape (rightfully so), we can also be critical of employers. It goes both ways.
People have a natural resistance and dislike for having someone else controlling them for part of their day. The best way to overcome that and create good employee moral, keeping them around is to try to create an atmosphere of partnership. Make employees feel like they are part of a team, you and they are all on the same team, working for common goals. And most importantly have some sort of profit sharing or bonus system set up so that when they go the extra mile to do a high quality job for you they will be rewarded. Inspire a spirt of entrepreneurship with your staff When the company wins everyone wins.
Working from home during COVID changed the whole dynamic for me in hiring employees. In early 2020, right before COVID, I had a position posted and had 68 applicants, which was on par for similar positions I’ve posted over the years. Position was frozen because of COVID and I had to go through the same process about 9 months ago. I had 8 applicants.
As others have pointed out….quality of life has become much more important than a career for many people.
As others have pointed out….quality of life has become much more important than a career for many people.
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Of course it’s an employee’s market. Biden created ten thousand million jobs.
As I like to tell my kids “there’s a reason they call it work and not play.” Further, there’s a reason they have to pay you to do it.
My company is excellent at this. Have gotten really nice bonuses every year but I have also earned it being a high performer. They like to send gift cards out frequently when small goals are met which is a nice touch. Best part is having a boss that leaves me alone. Does not micromanage as long as you do your job. Although I would rather do something else these days I cannot complain about the company I work for. They really do try and keep morale high.
Living in Key West for the last ten years we all joked that that island has the most unused degrees per capita. Everyone had a degree but worked service industry so they could live on an island, boat days, screw off, play tourist days, travel, take off a month if you felt like it, etc.
It was definitely quality of life over career and “the right way” or whatever. It’s changed some since COVID though, can’t really just take a month off anymore because of not having enough employees to work.
Taking off a month and doing what love to do is a creation of modern society. We have lost any semblance of work being something to be admired. We can only bring in so many Illegals to do our manual labor while the rest of the nation plays video games and tic toks for a living. Just from a societal standpoint this can't last long.
I had to teach a 20 yo how to hold a broom to sweep a couple years ago. 20 yo and had never been taught that simple skill. I think my mom showed me that when I was 5 or younger. I think some of you are confusing being spoiled with being happy.
I had to teach a 20 yo how to hold a broom to sweep a couple years ago. 20 yo and had never been taught that simple skill. I think my mom showed me that when I was 5 or younger. I think some of you are confusing being spoiled with being happy.
I’m late stage Gen X. Was raised with the boomer mentality that you take whatever pay is given and go above and beyond for any job no matter how ****** the job is, and you stay at that job as long as possible. I carried this ehtos until my mid-30s.
I worked for a company for 11 years, received glowing performance reviews for 10 years (I quit giving a **** in my last year), came in on days off, stayed late/came in early, picked up extra shifts, volunteered to work most holidays even did some work for free when the company needed a bunch of stiff done but banned OT. What did that get me? Two small raises over a decade and the expectation that my “above and beyond” would be my normal as the company left empty desks empty and demanded increased workload with no pay increase. I became expected to come in on days off, stay late, etc. Job required a degree and paid $33K.
In 2017 I became disgruntled and quit. Took a job paying $50K at another company. Same ****. Went above and beyond, great reviews, got a promotion in title only. When I asked for a raise, i was basically laughed out of the CEO’s office. So, I quit in 2021. Moved to my present company in a senior role that pays almost $100K. This company provides ample PTO, a small yearly COLA raise and performance-based bonuses if the team meets our metrics. When I’ve logged 40 hours, I can log off. If I hit 40 hours on Thursday afternoon, I’m off Friday no questions asked. We are not expected to be on call and are discouraged from checking email on days off and vacations.
My generation learned that in today’s employment climate, the best way to get a sizable raise is to switch companies. Employers are no longer loyal, why should employees be loyal in return?
This is why I don’t understand the people who brag about working 60 hours a week in piss poor conditions for low wages. It’s not the badge of honor they think it is.
I have adopted the philosophy of “work to live, don’t live to work” and couldn’t be happier with my career. I finally realized that busting my *** for a company that would replace me within a week if I fell over dead isn’t worth it. Now, I do my job every day and do it well, but when that laptop closes, I am done for the day. I no longer mentally take my work home with me. I don’t feel guilty and am not made to feel guilty for taking time off. Just last week, I wasn’t feeling work one day and burned a PTO day for the hell
if it. Not a single person was a dick about it. The properly balanced work/life balance has made a big difference in my physical and mental health.
So, while the younger generation might not be willing to bust *** for peanuts, I kind of applaud them for using their leverage in the employment market to their advantage.
I worked for a company for 11 years, received glowing performance reviews for 10 years (I quit giving a **** in my last year), came in on days off, stayed late/came in early, picked up extra shifts, volunteered to work most holidays even did some work for free when the company needed a bunch of stiff done but banned OT. What did that get me? Two small raises over a decade and the expectation that my “above and beyond” would be my normal as the company left empty desks empty and demanded increased workload with no pay increase. I became expected to come in on days off, stay late, etc. Job required a degree and paid $33K.
In 2017 I became disgruntled and quit. Took a job paying $50K at another company. Same ****. Went above and beyond, great reviews, got a promotion in title only. When I asked for a raise, i was basically laughed out of the CEO’s office. So, I quit in 2021. Moved to my present company in a senior role that pays almost $100K. This company provides ample PTO, a small yearly COLA raise and performance-based bonuses if the team meets our metrics. When I’ve logged 40 hours, I can log off. If I hit 40 hours on Thursday afternoon, I’m off Friday no questions asked. We are not expected to be on call and are discouraged from checking email on days off and vacations.
My generation learned that in today’s employment climate, the best way to get a sizable raise is to switch companies. Employers are no longer loyal, why should employees be loyal in return?
This is why I don’t understand the people who brag about working 60 hours a week in piss poor conditions for low wages. It’s not the badge of honor they think it is.
I have adopted the philosophy of “work to live, don’t live to work” and couldn’t be happier with my career. I finally realized that busting my *** for a company that would replace me within a week if I fell over dead isn’t worth it. Now, I do my job every day and do it well, but when that laptop closes, I am done for the day. I no longer mentally take my work home with me. I don’t feel guilty and am not made to feel guilty for taking time off. Just last week, I wasn’t feeling work one day and burned a PTO day for the hell
if it. Not a single person was a dick about it. The properly balanced work/life balance has made a big difference in my physical and mental health.
So, while the younger generation might not be willing to bust *** for peanuts, I kind of applaud them for using their leverage in the employment market to their advantage.
I agree with everything you said but the last paragraph. I used to go to work sick and “power through” and then realized that no job is worth my health and I have sick time available for a reason. If i feel like crap, I won’t be doing my best work if I do go in.
I finally realized what I do isn’t so important that it can’t be done a day or two later when I’m feeling better. I still feel guilty when I do call in, but I finally work somewhere where I’m told to feel better instead of being made to feel like entire company will spiral into collapse if I am home sick for a day or two.
How so?
I just shared my work experience and what I’ve learned in my 25+ years as a member of the work force, which is if you want a considerable pay bump in 2022, go somewhere else; what’s the point of going above and beyond for an employer who won’t go above and beyond for you in return; work to live but don’t live to work; no job is worth your health or most of your time. I know people who work so much their families never see them or they take work with them on vacation. What kind of life is that?
Making 33k a year working 60 hours a week for 10 year with a degree puts you at poverty level and you were making half as much as a preschool teacher or janitor. I have no idea what you are doing but nobody was advocating for whatever god awful, extremely terrible job situation you were in.
That last line especially, I see it all the time. Oh congratulations, you work so much and don’t see your kid and your wife is unfulfilled and your relationships are on auto pilot and your spare time is going golfing?
Great life.I’ve got a friend who has been at a company for 11 years. Tremendous worker, super smart, has a masters degree but only makes $46K a year. He gets new job titles but people coming in off the streets make more than him. He sticks around simply cause they leave him alone and it’s easy work and he does a side hustle but seeing him never get any significant bump in pay has been a huge indicator in my mentality of “Wanna get paid? It’s not going to be with this company” until you find the one it does.
My last two job hops increased my pay more than any of the other jobs were ever going to. Even one employer where I could financially show my value in the numbers didn’t make them budge on paying. These people don’t give a crap and your work will go unappreciated and be completely forgotten the first chance there’s a mistake.
Look out for yourself and your family because most companies sure as **** won’t give a crap what happens to you.
There is a great deal of information on the internet as to what most jobs pay in your given area of the country. Most companies will just give you a 2%-3% annual cost of living raise unless you get a promotion. It is up to you to negotiate for more if you are underpaid.
If you like your employer, go out and get a better offer. If your employer values you, they will likely match it if they can afford it. If not, jump to the new job. That said employers look down on potential hires that are jumping jobs every few years. Continuity is a valuable trait for employers as turnover is expensive.
If you like your employer, go out and get a better offer. If your employer values you, they will likely match it if they can afford it. If not, jump to the new job. That said employers look down on potential hires that are jumping jobs every few years. Continuity is a valuable trait for employers as turnover is expensive.
Work to your payscale. Want me to do more than what I am paid to do? Better pay me more then.
You get what you pay for.
Going above and beyond more often than not just gets you more work with little to no reward. Used to work at one place that would give out certificates of appreciation and dumb **** like that. That's fine and all, but I can't pay bills or take time off with certificates of appreciation.
Want to get $50K in features out of your car? Well then pay $50K for your car, not $30K.
This, my last two full-time employers both tried desperately to get me stay but the first one my outside offer was so much vastly superior that they never stood a chance, and even if they did match it I would have never taken it.
My most recent previous employer had several people above me beg me to come back and the last thing they said was "well we have these things planned down the line and think you could fit in the picture with this stuff, but we can't offer anything concrete or any timeline right now." Well I've got a concrete offer, you better offer something concrete if you want to keep me. Promises and potential plans don't pay the bills. Alas they did not offer anything concrete and I left that ******** and just about anyone worth a **** over there has already left or is about to.
Always torn on this.. I've seen ****** workers and I've dealt with ****** managers.
Do the job you're hired to do, but don't kill yourself either. Hard work will pay off in some way, just always remember that you'd be replaced if you got hit by a bus tomorrow.
Do the job you're hired to do, but don't kill yourself either. Hard work will pay off in some way, just always remember that you'd be replaced if you got hit by a bus tomorrow.
Not always the case depending on the employer but being an excellent employee gives you leverage. However, it’s absolutely your responsibility to use it and negotiate a better deal. After I had enough feathers in my cap I called my boss and told him a competitor approached me and offered me $15k more. Did the whole “I really love working there but that was too much money to turn down” speech. Fact was I had no such offer. It took 15 min for him to call me back and say he could match the offer. It was a risk but one I felt at the time was worth taking and that I had earned the higher pay.
It taught me that employers will not pay you anymore than they can get away with. It’s up to the employee to grow a set and ask for it. If they are a good employee they will quickly figure out what their true worth to the employer is.
Making up a fake offer is generally not a good strategy to get a raise. If you leave your employer without another job, that is a bad financial decision. If you stay, it is obvious that you didn't have an offer and you blew your credibility.
You need to know what others in your same job, similar experience, in the local industry are making. Just because you want $15,000 more doesn't mean that it is realistic for your position. Being a good worker is important but if you are near the top of the pay range for your job, you may need a promotion to earn better money. Ask your employer what you need to do to become more valuable to the company so that you can earn a promotion & make better money. That is a better strategy than lying about another offer.
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Also when the fed funds rate goes to 4.0%-4.50% later this year, the economy is going to slow big time.
Every generation has a general personality given the culture and state of things. A careerbuilder article said boomers stayed at jobs on average of 8 years & 3 months. Gen X was 5 years, millennials was 3 years, Gen Z 2 years.
This isn’t the environment the boomer era came up in so you’re not going to see millennials staying at a place for a decade given most millennials are anywhere from 26-41, I think.
Things change. Not everyone is going to mimic an environment that doesn’t exist for them anymore.
“More valuable” can be a tall task to convince bad management who really never have any idea how much one person does until there’s no one there to do it. Or they stick to status quo because that’s what they know and are comfortable with and don’t want to deter from protocol.
A company my buddy has worked for the last decade, keeps having massive turnover due to the company’s refusal to give raises (while blowing money on absolute dumb **** and keeping execs) and a refusal to adapt to remote for a lot of their employees who don’t need to physically be in the office. They keep losing employees who are finding companies that will do that. Valuable employees.
They change nothing. They keep doing the same process hoping it sticks and new hires keep quitting making the previous loss of employees much more damaging.
Most people and companies aren’t forward thinkers. They’re reactionary.
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I have seen it multiple times myself. For one it's disturbing how much they must pump up their resume knowing the jobs they have left for and what their skill set actually was when they left. I have told many employee's before that it takes a good year to get comfortable in a job if you are walking in from outside. It can be less if you are an internal hire but still takes time to work through enough scenarios that you have a working knowledge strong enough to make autonomous decisions. In all cases they laugh and tell me it won't take that long, but for those that have been around it did. I don't think it's a search for fulfillment either, I believe it's the new way to make more money. On one hand it makes sense but I agree with other posters that you also limit your pool of companies to work for pretty quickly when you job hop. I see that much movement and I trash a resume because of it and I am sure many others do as well. I don't need a 30 year person, but I do need someone who wants a career path and has the drive to fulfill it.
I agree 100%… but it’s a valuable trait that many employers feel they don’t/shouldn’t have to pay for.
I've worked close to 30 years in a career I enjoy. The problem with todays youth is that they either want all the things their parents worked years for right now, or they want anyone who's ever been wildly successful to be stripped of everything they've worked for out of envy.
That's the public school system propping up failure. Had a son in a private high school and if he missed an assignment, he had two days max to get it in and that would be with a big points penalty at that. After that, it was a zero.
I’ve quit many a job. It’s a job, don’t do it for fun. I’ll go find something else when I really don’t wanna go in anymore. But I don’t have a mortgage, wife, or kid. I live easy. Not career oriented. Way more to life than work.
i used to work my *** off, it wasn’t worth it imo
i used to work my *** off, it wasn’t worth it imo