“You can’t defend the foul line”

[bac2therac]

refs had little to do with this

let ALOT go which usually benefits RU. Indiana matched our physicality which surprised RU I think. There were missed calls both ways.

RU had the ball in a one possession game, fumbled the ball, took a bad 3, missed two one and ones, couldnt haul down a rebound, took another ill advised jumper....all in the last 3 minutes

 

[fluoxetine]

Not saying it's the refs fault. Just saying 24 FTs on 48 attempts vs 10 on 58 is a big difference. You can have a big difference even in a perfectly officiated game.

 

[bac2therac]

well we fouled intentionally last 2...so that added 4 and Paul missed two potential attempts so 20 to 14 isnt so glaring

 

[G- RUnit]

Not saying it's the refs fault. Just saying 24 FTs on 48 attempts vs 10 on 58 is a big difference. You can have a big difference even in a perfectly officiated game.

Are you suggesting a perfectly officiated game? I think Coach Pike disagrees.
I think 4th foul on Cliff exhibit 1.
I think 17/24 v 6/10 suggests a ridiculous bias.
Indiana had 14 turnovers to RU’s 10. So BAC to suggest that RU was more sloppy rings really hollow.

More often than not it really is Officiating. Like it or not.

 

[bac2therac]

Are you suggesting a perfectly officiated game? I think Coach Pike disagrees.
I think 4th foul on Cliff exhibit 1.
I think 17/24 v 6/10 suggests a ridiculous bias.
Indiana had 14 turnovers to RU’s 10. So BAC to suggest that RU was more sloppy rings really hollow.

More often than not it really us Officiating. Like it or not.

Cliff got away with an obvious foul and they also were not calling alot of contact in paint also didnt call a foul on rutgers when going for the ball near the Indiana bench. Went both ways, they missed some on Indiana too

 

[bethlehemfan]

well we fouled intentionally last 2...so that added 4 and Paul missed two potential attempts so 20 to 14 isnt so glaring

It wasn’t terribly one sided but there were a couple of brutal calls in key moments down the stretch. That said if we execute we win.

 

[jerseybird]

uhhh

Officiating aside, they took 24 FTs on 48 FG attempts and we took 10 on 58 FG attempts. That is a huge difference.

They did not have to foul. Their game plan worked, and we took a lot of wild shots with many taken as the shot clock wound down. Comparing our shot selection to their choices explains why we had to foul and they did the heavy lifting before our errant tosses. They made it hard on our shooters and they made their own shots easier to execute. Outcoached and outplayed. Not by much, but by enough to win a game against an equally tough opponent.

 

[fluoxetine]

Are you suggesting a perfectly officiated game?

No?

They did not have to foul. Their game plan worked, and we took a lot of wild shots with many taken as the shot clock wound down. Comparing our shot selection to their choices explains why we had to foul and they did the heavy lifting before our errant tosses. They made it hard on our shooters and they made their own shots easier to execute. Outcoached and outplayed. Not by much, but by enough to win a game against an equally tough opponent.

That's all fine. I'm just saying your post saying that the foul difference wasn't big is false. There was a big difference in the fouls that actually matter (the ones that give you free throws).

 

[jerseybird]

No?

That's all fine. I'm just saying your post saying that the foul difference wasn't big is false. There was a big difference in the fouls that actually matter (the ones that give you free throws).

Usually, when a team that is playing from behind against a hotter team commits fouls in the latter part of the game, those fouls are leading to foul shots. Seems pretty normal fare to me.

 

[fluoxetine]

Usually, when a team that is playing from behind against a hotter team commits fouls in the latter part of the game, those fouls are leading to foul shots. Seems pretty normal fare to me.

I'm not saying it's not normal, I'm just saying there was a big difference.

Like I said, this doesn't imply anything besides the simple fact that the difference was big.

 

[RedTeam1994]

Hard contact was mostly legal tonight on both sides, but Indiana did a better job fighting through it and finishing. Couple of headscratching calls, but mostly it was just a hackathon on everyone with no whistles.

I agree. On balance I think it evened out.

And this from someone who doesn’t shy away from bitching about the refs when it DOES give the other team the advantage….. and that DOES happen sometimes, right @bac2therac?

 

[ru66]

Why? Did he guard 2 players at the same time.

Why? Figure it out yourself you're an expert offering a dumb, comment you think is" cute". But here's my answer-- everyone had to pick up the emotional , and extra defensive burden of losing the second best defender on the team and the defensive anchor especially the seniors.If you think extra effort wasn't made you're wrong, it was obvious.

 

[Joey Bags]

There were like 1 or 2 bad calls against us, not why we lost.

We held indiana without a basket for 10 minutes and barely scored ourselves over that stretch. That was the game right there.

 

[RU206]

Can’t control the refs. What the team can control is making front ends of 1 and 1
And attempting a layup down 3 instead of passing it out to Caleb. Caleb is hot and cold on O. It would be great if he had better self awareness and shared the ball more when he is struggling.
RU didn’t play well and only lost by 6 on the road to a ranked team. This team is still good and can make a run in the tournament.

 

[Scarlet Shack]

We didn’t Deserve the whistle guys

We hardly played through contact last night when on offense ….how many of our shots were fall aways ….???

I am very critical of the crap we get on the officials …and for the most part , I was fine with last nights officiating . We didn’t earn the foul shots last night …

 

[G- RUnit]

It wasn’t terribly one sided but there were a couple of brutal calls in key moments down the stretch. That said if we execute we win.

That’s always true. But still can say that about any factor. Two tough defensive games and both times in first half, Indy and MSU in bonus shooting long before us. Garden was our home game right?

The 4th foul on Cliff, an elite player on a fast break, where Indiana player initiated contact and flopped, and after Hyatt call, was especially egregious and outrageous. Granted one play but in the context of the game: Fast break and 4th foul. No T on Indy. Be consistent.

We never seen to get the continuation and 1 calls but opposing teams always do. Maybe I’m biased.

As above poster stated:

“ RU didn’t play well and only lost by 6 on the road to a ranked team. This team is still good and can make a run in the tournament.”

We didn’t play well and only lost by 6 on the road to a ranked team. That ranked team shot 17 for 24 from the line. The other ranked team was only 6 for 10. Both teams played tough D.

Maybe game wasn’t loss at the line and fouls, but numbers like it or not, suggest a major factor. Hard to dispute, much as many want to. Don’t think coach bringing up disparity post game was an accident.

 

[mildone_rivals]

People who don’t think officiating matters.

Or that it evens out?

Pike obviously disagrees again.

The disparity!!!

Shame.

You are misinterpreting his point. He's not complaining about the refs. He said, multiple times in the press-conference, that he continually tells the players they need to defend without fouling.

He isn't blaming the officials.

 

[G- RUnit]

Usually, when a team that is playing from behind against a hotter team commits fouls in the latter part of the game, those fouls are leading to foul shots. Seems pretty normal fare to me.

That wasn’t the case yesterday. Both MSU and Indy opposing teams got to big leads because of big foul discrepancy in the first half. So hardly normal. MSU game only got close because MSU purposely started fouling at end. Remember Garden was our home game right so we got all the calls. SMH.

So quick to call T on Hyatt for flopping. Then call no T on Indy player who flopped and a foul on our best player during the 2nd half of a great comeback.

 

[RedTeam1994]

simply not the game to whine about the refs. sure a few bad calls.

but it simply was NOT one of those situations (WHICH WE HAVE SEEN!!) where they let the other team grab and hold all game and call us for every ticky-tack foul. that simply did not happen last night.

I think we can name a dozen other reasons why we lost before the refs even get mentioned

 

[G- RUnit]

You are misinterpreting his point. He's not complaining about the refs. He said, multiple times in the press-conference, that he continually tells the players they need to defend without fouling.

He isn't blaming the officials.

Agree to disagree. “Disparity” Hard fought game two great teams. I think misinterpretation is on your end. If you don’t think there’s a message in there….

 

[Yeah Baby]

Point taken. But it doesn't matter when Paul an 83% FT shooter misses BOTH ends of a 1 and 1.

To you and to all of those who liked your thread bwahahaha.

I can assure you that nobody has EVER missed both ends of a 1 and 1. Nobody ever will.

 

[BellyFullOfWhiteDogCrap]

vs MSU we attacked the basket and shot a ton of FTs.
vs IU we shot jumpers all game and barely went to the line
Go figure.

 

[G- RUnit]

vs MSU we attacked the basket and shot a ton of FTs.
vs IU we shot jumpers all game and barely went to the line
Go figure.

And yet MSU was at the bonus way before us…. Hmmmmm.
So was Indy. Kinda defeats playing differently argument.
Both Indy and MSU built leads in first half…. All three teams play same tight d.
Couldn’t possibly be a blue blood old school bias.

Nothing to see here. Coach notes players can’t cover the foul line and disparity but he’s really criticizing his own players. Nothing to see here. My misinterpretation. SMH.

 

[mildone_rivals]

Agree to disagree. “Disparity” Hard fought game two great teams. I think misinterpretation is on your end. If you don’t think there’s a message in there….

I'm not making any interpretation. I'm taking his words at face value. You are the only one trying to spin it as having some hidden meaning.

 

[G- RUnit]

I'm not making any interpretation. I'm taking his words at face value. You are the only one trying to spin it as having some hidden meaning.

I am also taking at face value. Disparity is disparity. Take that at face value. Players can’t defend the foul line. I’m not spinning at all. Wasn’t first time we heard that from coach either. Both times he has said that huge DISPARITY in fouls. Face value.

 

[MiloTalon13]

Every fan base thinks their team gets screwed
It’s a tough game to ref and B1G/NCAA seem satisfied with quality of officiating

 

[BankShotPodcast]

You can't complain about not shooting enough FTs when you're shooting 25 3s in game that you only take 58 shots. Indiana shot 24 FTs. 1 of them was for the flop. Rutgers only had 4 more fouls than Indiana, but Rutgers fouled more when Indiana was in the act of shooting.

 

[G- RUnit]

Every fan base thinks their team gets screwed
It’s a tough game to ref and B1G/NCAA seem satisfied with quality of officiating

See Ohio State. Officiating matters. Wouldn’t you want that stolen W now? I would. See St.John’s. Two of the most egregious I’ve ever seen. Common denominator?

 

[rudad02]

Pike subtly sending messages….

Hope people listening.

Forget the subtlety & putting the whole onus on your guys. Give the Zebras a loud, intense & passionate ear full.

 

[mildone_rivals]

I am also taking at face value. Disparity is disparity. Take that at face value. Players can’t defend the foul line. I’m not spinning at all. Wasn’t first time we heard that from coach either. Both times he has said that huge DISPARITY in fouls. Face value.

You are absolutely spinning. The moment you attempt to define what Pike meant, rather than what he said, you're spinning.

He said the players "need to do a better job of defending without fouling". That's all about the players. Pike doesn't coach refs; he coaches players. He's focused on what he can control rather than on what he cannot. 'Cause he's smart and his time is valuable.

If you take a disparity in foul calls at face value, all it means is one team got called for fouling more than the other team. It says nothing whatsoever about if those calls were an accurate representation of what happened or not. One has to apply spin in order to claim that the disparity is due to bad officiating. Because foul calls are subjective, they are judgement calls. It's always entirely possible, even likely, that one team fouls more than the other. Sometimes a lot more.

We are always free to disagree with the ref's judgement, I often do myself. But we are also making judgement calls and are unarguably biased towards seeing things our team's way. The refs, at least nominally, are not. If you disagree, then consider if you would prefer to have the opposing team's fans make the calls instead of the refs. No? Didn't think so.

Even if Pike WAS making the insinuation that you want to assign his words, it would be a total waste of his time and energy. It accomplishes nothing. It would be a 100% wasted effort. If you prefer to think of the coach as a time-wasting whiner, go ahead. I have too much respect for him so I prefer not to project that sort of mindset on him.

 

[RUJMM78]

Indiana went over 8 minutes without a basket and Rutgers offense failed to take the lead.The reason for the lack of Rutgers scoring was the tight Indiana man to man defense and the inability to create and make shots off the dribble.In some games Rutgers can overcome mediocre offense by holding opponents below their scoring average.Its really difficult ,however, to win only scoring 60 points.Indiana fans were ranting toward the refs during the game .Rutgers are ranting on a message board .

 

[RUChoppin]

We had the game tied at 38 a minute into the second half. We were down just 3 with 3:29 left.

Then McConnell missed a 3-pointer on a quick shot
Then Mulcahy missed the front end of a 1-and-1
TJD made a layup
Then McConnell missed a 2-pointer
We're still just down 5 points with 1:41 left
Indiana then gets 3 OReb and a layup on the next possession, which put us down 7 with 0:48
Then yet another McConnell missed 2-pointer

So, with 3:29 left and down just 3, over the next 3 game minutes....
- No shots from Spencer, Omoruyi, or Mulcahy
- McConnell goes 0-3 instead
- Gave up 3 OReb in a row leading to a 3-possession game

 

[RutgHoops]

I must have missed all the posts calling out the refs when we shot 34 FTs and MSU shot 14 FTs on Saturday.

 

[mildone_rivals]

I must have missed all the posts calling out the refs when we shot 34 FTs and MSU shot 14 FTs on Saturday.

But those refs were obviously perfect and totally fair!

 

[G- RUnit]

First half bonus?
2nd half how many fouls last three minutes?
How want fouls purposeful in last minute and half?

Not all foul calls alike…

 

[mjjoyce51]

That wasn’t the case yesterday. Both MSU and Indy opposing teams got to big leads because of big foul discrepancy in the first half. So hardly normal. MSU game only got close because MSU purposely started fouling at end. Remember Garden was our home game right so we got all the calls. SMH.

So quick to call T on Hyatt for flopping. Then call no T on Indy player who flopped and a foul on our best player during the 2nd half of a great comeback.

Free throw attempts were 22 to 14 in favor of Rutgers before MSU started intentionally fouling.

 

[G- RUnit]

Free throw attempts were 22 to 14 in favor of Rutgers before MSU started intentionally fouling.

Again first half. Bonus? I’ll wait. Panic mode when RU holds MSU scoreless. Then the fouls start coming before the obvious purposeful ones. Timing is everything.

 

[fluoxetine]

You are absolutely spinning. The moment you attempt to define what Pike meant, rather than what he said, you're spinning.

He said the players "need to do a better job of defending without fouling". That's all about the players. Pike doesn't coach refs; he coaches players. He's focused on what he can control rather than on what he cannot. 'Cause he's smart and his time is valuable.

If you take a disparity in foul calls at face value, all it means is one team got called for fouling more than the other team. It says nothing whatsoever about if those calls were an accurate representation of what happened or not. One has to apply spin in order to claim that the disparity is due to bad officiating. Because foul calls are subjective, they are judgement calls. It's always entirely possible, even likely, that one team fouls more than the other. Sometimes a lot more.

We are always free to disagree with the ref's judgement, I often do myself. But we are also making judgement calls and are unarguably biased towards seeing things our team's way. The refs, at least nominally, are not. If you disagree, then consider if you would prefer to have the opposing team's fans make the calls instead of the refs. No? Didn't think so.

Even if Pike WAS making the insinuation that you want to assign his words, it would be a total waste of his time and energy. It accomplishes nothing. It would be a 100% wasted effort. If you prefer to think of the coach as a time-wasting whiner, go ahead. I have too much respect for him so I prefer not to project that sort of mindset on him.

It seems like, by your own logic, you also need to apply spin to come to the conclusion that Pike is talking about the players and not the refs.

If face value doesn't extend past "one team had more fouls" then anything more than that is an interpretation. Your interpretation may be a more likely one, but it's still an interpretation.

 

[G- RUnit]

Disparity hard to dispute by same logic.

Both games Pike has made these comments there was significant disparity.

 

[nukem]

I must have missed all the posts calling out the refs when we shot 34 FTs and MSU shot 14 FTs on Saturday.

This can't be true because for months @G- RUnit told us this was an away game and the refs wouldn't treat it like a Rutgers home game.