I know it makes the rivalry better and more interesting. But is it good for MSU and Ole Miss individually?
Buy/Sell: This Pure Hatred between us and OM is good for both programs.
- Thread starter CadaverDawg
- Start date
It will eventually destroy both programs...
..I don't do Twitter or Facebook, but it seems those 2 devices alone now allow every nutjob & crazy bastard to stick his/her nose where it doesn't belong. Either both programs place restrictions on how "social networking" is currently being used in conjunction with MSU/Ole Miss athletics, or the NCAA/SEC & everybody else you can think of will end up turning our sports programs into church league-level afterthoughts.
..I don't do Twitter or Facebook, but it seems those 2 devices alone now allow every nutjob & crazy bastard to stick his/her nose where it doesn't belong. Either both programs place restrictions on how "social networking" is currently being used in conjunction with MSU/Ole Miss athletics, or the NCAA/SEC & everybody else you can think of will end up turning our sports programs into church league-level afterthoughts.
In the end, I think it's worse for us, and always has been
Simply put, they have people that are much better at the whole "all in" thing, and they are relentless at uncovering every minor discrepancy in our program.
Simply put, they have people that are much better at the whole "all in" thing, and they are relentless at uncovering every minor discrepancy in our program.
Easy sell- we are going to tear each other down
After what they did to Jackie, and then Taco Man and his OL coaching wife paying off Devinner has forced State fans to get organized like never before. There are alot of people way above my paygrade pissed off right now and finally organized to do something about it.
I dont see this ending well for either side
Sell. It's past stupid. Sports is supposed to be fun, and it's not much fun the way the "fans" are acting. It can only hurt both schools with our small population and limited funds.
Yep, they have more true believers in their corner than we do...
...they have a relatively large segment of true believers who will always see Miss. State as being illegitimate, especially when it comes to football. And when they see Miss. State do things that adds to MSU's legitimacy (like win 3 Egg Bowls in a row, for instance), they are going to do what it takes to make that stop. By any means necessary, they will make it stop.
...they have a relatively large segment of true believers who will always see Miss. State as being illegitimate, especially when it comes to football. And when they see Miss. State do things that adds to MSU's legitimacy (like win 3 Egg Bowls in a row, for instance), they are going to do what it takes to make that stop. By any means necessary, they will make it stop.
Sell. Many State and Ole Miss fans tend to be mildly retarded when it comes to the other side. It won't end well for either side in the long run.
Agree. Neither side can get too high before one side tears the other down.
i thought it was over with Jackie. Then comes De Vinner slandering our people the week prior to him having a cush weekend in Oxford for Texas week. Him and LeAnne Touhy had been cozy on twitter too. Hmmm...
So now its on.
And not just with us. Tennessee hates Freeze too. There has been talk on UT boards of folks wanting to out Hugh Freeze for having an affair with an underaged girl. Wow.
Ole Miss is carrying a big bullseye from multiple places. This won't end well for them.
After filling up emergency rooms from Jackson to Memphis even way back in 1926, I doubt we could ever co-exist peacefully.
http://eggbowl.rivals.com/content.asp?SID=1059&CID=88400
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http://eggbowl.rivals.com/content.asp?SID=1059&CID=88400
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Buy: The competition makes both schools work harder at not only Athletics, but I think it helps improve academics as well. If somehow we all got together, sang KumBayYa, and became the Ole Miss State BearDogs, we'd immediately fall into 6-6 mediocrity for years.
Grew up ...
In the Johnny Vaught era. Even though its been well over a half century ago, Ole Miss still harkens back to those 'glory' days with a grandiose sense of entitlement.
They simply refuse to understand that the rest of the SEC and a majority of Mississippi have 'moved' on. Thus, they want to recall those 'glory' days without mentioning the riots and strife that were also present.</SPAN>
In the Johnny Vaught era. Even though its been well over a half century ago, Ole Miss still harkens back to those 'glory' days with a grandiose sense of entitlement.
They simply refuse to understand that the rest of the SEC and a majority of Mississippi have 'moved' on. Thus, they want to recall those 'glory' days without mentioning the riots and strife that were also present.</SPAN>
Someone has gotta post a link to the discussions about the rape/affair allegations.
A rivalry is healthy, but one school calling the other "rednecks" or "racists" doesn't do anyone any good. As far as 90% of the people out of state are concerned "Mississippi is Mississippi." Even sports announcers confuse MSU and OM. Crying "racism" is an area-effect weapon, and we probably take 90% of the damage they get when we use it, because it just makes the state look bad. Ditto for "rednecks" from them. Anyone see "Django"? It tries to paint Mississippi as the sorriest POS state ever. Green-teethed rednecks and sadistic plantation owners. Absolutely awful depiction of Miss.
Well, maybe the redneck racists from up north need to learn their place and stop trying to bring down the only true SEC program in OUR State.
Buy, buy, buy! First we need to thank them for blowing us out in 08' 45-0. After that we got alot more chirpy by hiring Mullen and him walking around with his chin up high begging a bear to knock it off. After smashing every Mutt team he put on the field (even the SI cover Cotton Bowl team) they wanted to up the anti by hiring Bucky. Regardless of what they say they should be thankful for Dan pumping up a game that had somewhat lost it's luster. Then they slid the chips across the table going "all in" on Bucky. He popped Dan right in the chin and I think it'll be a good thing in the end. It'll make Dan work harder as a coach especially as it pertains to a game that NOW means a whole heck of a lot! I know we are hating on Bucky right now but either way it's gonna show us what we need to know about Dan. Recruiting wise we have already shown more aggressiveness and now we have shown we are getting us some sure fire coaches/recruiters in Brewster and DT. It ain't over guys......it's just about to start to get "saucy".
Soft Buy.
It can be a good thing. Neither school will accept being passed by the other for a large period of time. As long as the results of this are to bring the trailing school up to the level of the leading school, then it's a very good thing. The problem we've seen in the past is that in order to "catch" the school in the lead, the schools have resorted to bringing the other down to their level. Our two schools can't afford to engage in activity that ensures neither will rise above mediocrity, as happened in the 90's and early 2000's. But if one school's success results in the other school demanding more, then it's a very good thing.
It can be a good thing. Neither school will accept being passed by the other for a large period of time. As long as the results of this are to bring the trailing school up to the level of the leading school, then it's a very good thing. The problem we've seen in the past is that in order to "catch" the school in the lead, the schools have resorted to bringing the other down to their level. Our two schools can't afford to engage in activity that ensures neither will rise above mediocrity, as happened in the 90's and early 2000's. But if one school's success results in the other school demanding more, then it's a very good thing.
Sell. Competition is good, but there's too much work towards sabotage.....
If we'd spend that much time and effort towards building our programs, we'd get that much better. It's well documented the depths that Ole Miss fans will go, but we do it too. Like putting one of our billboards in Oxford. Hopefully our organized efforts, as Coach34 says, are going towards promotion of our program.
If we'd spend that much time and effort towards building our programs, we'd get that much better. It's well documented the depths that Ole Miss fans will go, but we do it too. Like putting one of our billboards in Oxford. Hopefully our organized efforts, as Coach34 says, are going towards promotion of our program.
This is a good point, especially in their older generation. They've seen themselves as an elite program, so they still think it can be accomplished. Until MSU wins at that level, I don't think we'll develop that 'all-in' deal. However, we have to somehow come together as a fanbase to ever get it done, instead of jumping off the train at every opportunity, like a portion of our fans did this year with Tyler Russell.
**Newsflash** There is not a fan base anywhere that don't have a group that bashes a player, coach, AD, etc at some point. That's part of it. This is not exclusive to State. I guaranty you there are people out there calling for Miles' head for his time management screw up in their bowl.
it is my considered opinion that our rivalry has gotten
unhealthy. i won't argue with coach 34 or anybody about "who started it" but i think its gotten to the level of being personal. i note the post below about some supposed affair freeze had? seriously? and this supposedly from a tenn board? i'm not exactly sure what tn's problem with freeze is. we haven't played them and haven't really gone head to head with them in recruiting this yr to any great degree. but it seems to me that when the vitriol is this intense, it ends up badly for both parties. i would hope that we can ratchet it down a notch or two but its hard for me to see. mullen has definitely stoked the fires and us playing his video statement at the end of the eggbowl probably didn't do anything to encourage a settling of the emotions. its unfortunate.
unhealthy. i won't argue with coach 34 or anybody about "who started it" but i think its gotten to the level of being personal. i note the post below about some supposed affair freeze had? seriously? and this supposedly from a tenn board? i'm not exactly sure what tn's problem with freeze is. we haven't played them and haven't really gone head to head with them in recruiting this yr to any great degree. but it seems to me that when the vitriol is this intense, it ends up badly for both parties. i would hope that we can ratchet it down a notch or two but its hard for me to see. mullen has definitely stoked the fires and us playing his video statement at the end of the eggbowl probably didn't do anything to encourage a settling of the emotions. its unfortunate.
I think a good in-state rivalry is good, but not with the nastiness that has been displayed lately. It will make both teams fall.
However, while I think the nattiness of the current rivalry is unhealthy, I think that the way Freeze recruits has forced Mullen to adapt and get better. Getting old guys Melvin off the staff is a great move. We not have coaches that will actively pursue and recruit the entire country. So in a way, I do think that Freeze's style of recruiting, illegal or not, has forced Mullen to get better. And while that my hurt us against OM, I think it helps us against everyone else.
However, while I think the nattiness of the current rivalry is unhealthy, I think that the way Freeze recruits has forced Mullen to adapt and get better. Getting old guys Melvin off the staff is a great move. We not have coaches that will actively pursue and recruit the entire country. So in a way, I do think that Freeze's style of recruiting, illegal or not, has forced Mullen to get better. And while that my hurt us against OM, I think it helps us against everyone else.
I'm with you. And even more, I think it represents the way MS does things.....
.....just constant turmoil at the center. So many groups vying for control of the state, much less the state actually competing against other states. But I don't see it changing.
If anything, MSU and Alabama have the real little brother big brother deal going on. Close in proximity, many fans share allegiance (well, they go to MSU and root for Alabama) and territories, and live amongst each other. I spent plenty of time in Alabama, and I guess the state's just bigger because I don't see the hatred near as much. It's bigger picture thinking, while MS is small time thinking. They are proving their might on the big stage, while Mississippians just want to see how cool they can be in the Delta and Jackson Country Clubs and **** like that.
.....just constant turmoil at the center. So many groups vying for control of the state, much less the state actually competing against other states. But I don't see it changing.
If anything, MSU and Alabama have the real little brother big brother deal going on. Close in proximity, many fans share allegiance (well, they go to MSU and root for Alabama) and territories, and live amongst each other. I spent plenty of time in Alabama, and I guess the state's just bigger because I don't see the hatred near as much. It's bigger picture thinking, while MS is small time thinking. They are proving their might on the big stage, while Mississippians just want to see how cool they can be in the Delta and Jackson Country Clubs and **** like that.
Definite Sell.
To find out how bad it is just say something about the Ole Miss Black Bears in mixed company and see the reaction. They are more sensitive right now than in my entire time as a state fan. If one of their fans does something similar, many of our fans' reactions are equally as bad. I like the rivalry, but with such a large percentage of people taking it this personally you end up having silly investigations, ridiculous articles about Uncle Toms and such, emails from fans to the SEC office to look at violations, etc. We will end up killing each other before we get a chance to really compete.
On the message board it is pretty easy to find out who is in the crazy group. Just look at the responses to guys like C34 on our side and a number of OM posters on their side.
I actually do have a question for the OM fans reading this: At what point do you think the fanbase will support the Black Bear? I am being serious with this question. It seems to me that if a decade or so go by, then it is time to revisit the decision. You were better off without a mascot in my opinion.
To find out how bad it is just say something about the Ole Miss Black Bears in mixed company and see the reaction. They are more sensitive right now than in my entire time as a state fan. If one of their fans does something similar, many of our fans' reactions are equally as bad. I like the rivalry, but with such a large percentage of people taking it this personally you end up having silly investigations, ridiculous articles about Uncle Toms and such, emails from fans to the SEC office to look at violations, etc. We will end up killing each other before we get a chance to really compete.
On the message board it is pretty easy to find out who is in the crazy group. Just look at the responses to guys like C34 on our side and a number of OM posters on their side.
I actually do have a question for the OM fans reading this: At what point do you think the fanbase will support the Black Bear? I am being serious with this question. It seems to me that if a decade or so go by, then it is time to revisit the decision. You were better off without a mascot in my opinion.
Most I know already are fine with it, and those that aren't have accepted it isn't going back. It's the dumb loud ones who get the attention. Kids are already taking to it. Mascots are for children and any adult who is mad is an idiot. And being the Rebels with a bear mascot is no dumber than the Tarheels having a ram or the Crimson Tide having an elephant. The Hurricanes have a bird. In my opinion, it could have been much worse than a bear, so I'm fine with it.
It's the "tradishuns" crowd who won't let it go, but they're dwindling, just not quick enough. Today's freshmen were 7 when we ditched the floppy shoed goofball. A few more years and it will be the norm. I'd say bear acceptance has drastically increased in the last year. Maybe when you aren't getting skull drug for 16 straight SEC games people have better things to discuss, I don't know.
It's the "tradishuns" crowd who won't let it go, but they're dwindling, just not quick enough. Today's freshmen were 7 when we ditched the floppy shoed goofball. A few more years and it will be the norm. I'd say bear acceptance has drastically increased in the last year. Maybe when you aren't getting skull drug for 16 straight SEC games people have better things to discuss, I don't know.
I would buy Ole Miss Merchandise with the bear on it, assuming they don't totally screw up the logo (and I feel pretty good about our current marketing direction).
I'm at the point where I kind of like it, actually, and one of the main reasons I went from apathy to liking it is interacting with the vocal minority of fans that are still mad about it. I want what's best for the University; many of them do not. Winning solves everything and I think people are becoming much less vocal about it. Most of the people who matter already do. It hasn't hurt fundraising much if at all, and that too will improve if the team keeps winning.
I'm at the point where I kind of like it, actually, and one of the main reasons I went from apathy to liking it is interacting with the vocal minority of fans that are still mad about it. I want what's best for the University; many of them do not. Winning solves everything and I think people are becoming much less vocal about it. Most of the people who matter already do. It hasn't hurt fundraising much if at all, and that too will improve if the team keeps winning.
I thought my twitter and Facebook timelines were going to explode last night with all the comments and retweets about Brewster. The rivalry is fun but also gets extreme. I have friends that are Rebel fans and I can talk recruiting/football with and be civil and I have others that will only bash Mississippi State and our exchanges get heated. I wish I could develop the pro state of Mississippi mindset when it comes to sports but I can't pull for them and I think it's because of the ones that take it to the extreme
I had no problem selling a few hundred visors I had made with a bear on it. It was in profile, similar to the Jack Nicklaus logo, but black. Frattastic.
Translated
The Mississippi State University has won 3 of 4 and dominated the past 20 years, and Bear fans don't like it. So, instead of working to improve your own program, you've gone the "Auburn route", where you say and do anything to stay with the obviously superior school in the State.
The Mississippi State University has won 3 of 4 and dominated the past 20 years, and Bear fans don't like it. So, instead of working to improve your own program, you've gone the "Auburn route", where you say and do anything to stay with the obviously superior school in the State.
After more than 10 years of relative peace, Byron DeVinner was paid to slander MSU and kickoff a longer NCAA investigation than the wrist slap we were getting.
There's no coincidence that this was done to make MSU backpedal at a time that the Ole Miss crootin machine was cranking up to levels unprecedented within their history.
I see great credibility in your stated desire for things to ratchet down a bit now that enforcers of Mississippi and NCAA law have been turned on to the Sunday Kimdeechy quid pro quo at UMC. I also find your olive branch credible in light of rumblings of a Hugh Freeze statutory rape rumor which is contrary to his King James Version colloquialisms and crootin image.
But Mullen (actually, it was Keenum) started it by telling his football team in a private locker room that we would never lose to Ole Miss again. OK, gotcha. Don't argue who started it. But say who started it.
There's really nothing to debate here. 10+ years of relative peace and then Rebel boosters went Byron DeVinner on us. That was a nuke. And now OM deserves whatever comes next.
PS: I am officially of the live & let live school of thought. Both schools would do best just leaving each other alone. Sure cheat your hearts out like everybody else does. Just don't bust us when we do the same.
Huge sell. It's bad for both programs. I have an aunt in North Carolina. She's told me forever that UNC pays Duke's players, Duke pays UNC players. Thus neither school has boosters paying players to go to THEIR school. They don't work off the court to tear each other down. Their results speak for themselves.
So, uh, who decides who is whose players? What happens if Duke and UNC recruit the same player? You know, like OM and us do non stop
A big reason why Duke/UNC are both successful is because they picked a sport that you can both be successful at given the population. And even still, NC is much bigger than Mississippi. We should stick to baseball honestly.
yes freeze's recruiting has probably motivated mullen and msu's kicking our butts 3 yrs in a row certainly got our attention. rivalry is good for both of us. just needs to be calmed down a bit imo.
judging from the responses to this thread and my rather benign post in particular, i'd say no truce is imminent. LOL. some of your friends need help. seriously. of course some of mine do too. nuttcasesku