Does anyone on here think Obamacare should remain unchanged?
- Thread starter DvlDog4WVU
- Start date
At least you are being honest with your personal opinions. I will. I think most Americans will. But your opinion and my opinion is bringing politics back into the conversation. That is my point. In order to FIND a solution, politics can't be part of it. Otherwise, it is a waste of time and everybody is focused on "winning" instead of fixing a problem.
Think it was estimated around 46 mil and the census (years later) pegged it at 42 mil.
Is that a serious question?
In case it is, affordable health care for all citizens without bankrupting individuals or the various states and federal government
Define affordable. Because it certainly isn't now for individuals or the government, and single payer won't be any better. The shell game as far as who pays for what will never change the cost of something. And here I thought you were an accountant or something.
It was serious. Thank you for answering it.
In short, I don't agree there is or was a problem.
The reason I point that out is how fundamentally separated the two sides are on the issues. As I said earlier, the whole premise of the discussion is based on the framing of there being a problem when I disagree that there is. I'm one of the few on the right willing to say the truth of their position though because I acknowledge how it sounds, I just don't care. Saying you don't care about your fellow man or their plight is not a popular stance.
I don't know if i can define it. It is a subjective term. Do you understand what that means? But developing something that the majority of citizens pay into and everyone gets equal treatment is the goal. Yes, that sounds socialism. But we our country is full of socialistic type principles with high success. We don't have to give up being a largely capitalistic society just because we have a universal healthcare system. But we do need to be honest and that is currently a problem in this debate and that is due to politics, imo.
Mine stance is a little different. I do care. But it shouldn't be mandated by the government that I help. That's not government's job.
You keep trying to spin that narrative. Many of us have seen no increases in our premiums and no increases in our deductibles. We had adequate insurance to begin with and still have adequate insurance. And we kept our doctors.
I certainly do. I understand that the government has subjected me to much higher deductibles, even on my personal insurance plan, because I make too much to get it all for free like half the country. The government is picking winners and losers, and are not caring too much about personal situations in doing so.
You are extremely lucky. I would guess you work for the governemnt which goes to show you who controls how much you pay. My deductible went from $500 to $6,000 in the last 8 years.I'm sure you wouldn't feel the way you do if that had happened to you.
Honestly, to me, it's either we end the ACA or we fix the ACA. The bills offered forth by the House and Senate don't seem to be much better than the current legislation in place....do they?
Who thinks it would be worse? I don't. Let the free market decide. Want to make costs go down, stop all the stupid regulations that healthcare has had to under go in the last 16 years, starting with Bush. Lower what people can win in malpractice claims. Loser pays in insurance cases.
If you ask me, a catastrophic health care expense might be one legitimate reason for bankruptcy. Not because you put too much on a credit card paying for beer and chips.
So, let's assume we end the ACA as you put it. How does that help the Dem initiative? It doesn't. It pleases me, but it doesn't help the Dems. Would it be better for them to provide input into the next revision or continue to obstruct assuming they could get some of what they want incorporated.
It's not a popular stance politically, but I doubt too many of your friends stop calls by you when they hear your take on helping your fellow man. However, you served, so by default you've helped your fellow man. If the right was honest (like you are being), they would simply kill the ACA and end the talk of this bs. You want The Senate to put partisan politics aside and work to a solution? That's not going to happen after a President like Trump gets elected bashing the opposition party's agenda to the degree he did. That's politics, handing the GOP a win would simply cement the midterms for them.
That being said, Democrats are absolutely willing to work to admend the ACA to find solutions....they need the fix just as bad.
But hey, it's your house right now. Kill it then. Get the GOP funk jiving through the joint and get everyone moving to the conservative groove. Stop trying to convince everyone is the better music without hearing it. Sorry, I rode that analogy right off the rails.
There's a number 3. A combination of both. Single payer catastrophic coverage, mixed with HSA's and personal payment. Insurance itself is the problem.
Where did you get that? I've made plenty of bad life decisions, and when I do, I deal with them to better my situation. I don't even understand your comment. I'm never satisfied with where I'm at, I'm constantly seeking improvement, mostly driven financially, but not always, and regardless, self improvement never stops for me. There is always the next challenge personally and professionally. I don't know what would cause me to ever stop and say I'm comfortable and want no changes. Are there people who don't?
Catastrophic is such a moving bogey though. What I can absorb and what someone else can are two entirely different numbers.
There are barriers for some. Sometimes, yes, it's race....but sometimes it's integrity, family, mental or physical limitations.
All I'm saying is that for some of us, it's easy to act like anyone in a poor condition is there because they don't make good decisions or work hard enough.
And we still have 31 uninsured. 11 were eligible for Medicare and ACA was able to get them covered by Medicaid after Obama won his reelection. Does that not account for 42 million uninsured at the beginning of this abortion?
When was health insurance a right? Highlighted before, but never settled that it is a constitutional right. If it has been accepted by the politically powerful, they are wrong to make such a decree without a way to finance it other than borrowing.
Money has been the root problem all the time. I do not think thee conservatives are that different from liberals. The difference is how to pay for all the extra goodies. I have no problem with all the goodies being provided to all the citizens. Very liberal for everyone to have good life. Finance is the difference. I do not think I am obligated to give to everyone. I hav o problem assisting family and friends. I draw a line when it comes to all people. Liberals want to give everyone the good life, but they are unwilling to pay the extra freight. Appears they are Ok with redistribution, or prefer it.
When Obamacare went into effect, i got hammered. Our company health insurance qualifying criteria were rewritten as part of the backroom deal with the insurance companies that enabled Obamacare to pass, such that we no longer qualified for company health insurance (they rewrote what contstituted part-time v. full-time employment at my wife's corporate employer, through whom we carried our health insurance). I had to go into the marketplace to buy health insurance for my wife, three kids, and myself. With a $5,000 deductible, i forked out just over $16,000 in premiums each year for two years, until we were able to meet the company's qualifying criteria again. Obamacare sucks.
Having said that, it stuns me that the ill-fated attempt to revise/replace/whatever Obamacare included a complete repudiation of Trump's campaign promise to not cut Medicaid. A new healthcare bill that eliminates care for the needy (and, yes, there are a lot of truly needy folks who should not be screwed because some other jerks abuse the system) and reduces benefits for the elderly is going to have a tough time getting through even a Republican-controlled Congress. People believed Trump when he repeatedly promised to not cut those programs. With Republicans controlling the White House, the Senate, and the House of Representatives, one would think a workable healthcare plan could be drafted and passed. Get it done, and get on with other business.
A real reason for bankruptcy law. Not too much beer, chips and bacon on your credit card
I acknowledge we all don't start on 3rd base, that doesn't excuse or relieve the need for betterment. You don't know where I started and or the life decisions I've made to get where I am. It's funny, I can see you've made some assumptions about me without knowing the details and decisions I've made in life. Maybe i started off life in a trailer park to two parents that didn't graduate highschool. Maybe I started life in a divorced home. Maybe I had parental involvement and maybe i had a network of folks who cared. Maybe my parents were wealthy by WV standards and maybe the weren't. Did any of that carry over when I shunned family directives and blazed my own trail enlisting into the Marine Corps at 17 and shunning the predestined silver spoon path and never looked back. Maybe all of that is true within my household and maybe it's not. To presume any of it is true without acknowledging I might have overcome some significant adversity in life to reach the clear air I'm in now or to discount it is amusing to me.
I also feel hardship is a relative scale depending on where you grew up. For instance 3rd base in WV might the equivalent of starting at 1st somewhere else. Educationally, I'd argue WV would put us at a disadvantage to many in the North East.
All of that though is irrelevant towards the character of men. My point in life made me but it doesn't define me. My path defines me. I've never accepted defeat in adversity at any point in my life. The process of accepting defeat is worse to me than being defeated.
I think an issue is that Medicare was expanded under the ACA from what it previously was. Not sure on that point though.
Come down off that soap box Johnny BA, you look like a fool up there. The ONLY thing I assume about you, is that you served. I think I remember something about a farm....could have been another winger I have respect for on here, I don't know. I don't care where you started.....wasn't my point. I have a good friend whose parents were extremely wealthy. His father was a ranking Dem in the House, and corrupt as all hell. He refused to take a dime. His gf got pregnant at a young age, he worked hard (no college) to provide.....did well with a small business of his own. Cancer struck, he went bankrupt taking care of her, not just medical bills.....but the inability to cover his business. Even with help from friends. He is now working as a bartender, so he can spend time getting his kid ready for school in the mornings, and switch shifts to be at her dance recitals. Hard working guy. Wouldn't have changed a large decision he's ever made, probably.....struggles every week financially.
Luck, decisions, starting points, attitude, integrity, health and mental barriers....they all play a role sometimes. Some stories like (maybe yours) my father's are inspirational, some stories like my grandfather's or my boy here....they're tragic, and a little help is something a country as great as ours can do.....and should.
And PLEASE notice I said A LITTLE HELP. I'm not trying to build a hippie dippy communist utopia here.