This is why I wanted Cal to go somewhere like Syracuse or even like Oregon or something . Some where we could still pull for him a bit and not have to freaking compete with the "Told ya so" crap.
Duke vs Arkansas
- Thread starter JimboBBN
- Start date
Never cheered for an SEC team harder in my life. I wasn't a big Nolan Richardson fan, but I was that day.
Same business model as Kentucky who is on a dry spell. Surely everyone mostly agrees by now that OAD is a poor business model for National Championships? You can’t win it all with skinny high school teens. Just ain’t gonna happen, that fantasy peaked in 2015 after Duke and Kentucky’s run to the F4.
They’ve been to 5 Elite 8’s in the last eight seasons and went on to two Final Fours. That would be pretty awesome for most programs but not for a Duke or a Kentucky based on the yearly recruiting rankings which both schools dominate with all the recruiting trophies.
I dont disagree with most of that, but I’ll say sometimes as fans we actually create a little bit of a self fulfilling prophecy. Our insatiable desire to be champions or bust probably has the biggest hand in why we are going to struggle to find the next elite, elite coach. Take Nate Oats for example. Right now, he isn’t our coach, so most of our fans fawn over him. If he were our coach, we’d fry him at the stake. Here’s a few of his recent records:
28-9
25-12
19-14
I won’t count the 16-15 record in year one, because that was year one.
Here are his defensive efficiency ratings in KenPom since 2022:
37th
28th
111th
3rd
92nd
That’s an average rating of 54th. Conventional wisdom is you need to at minimum be top 25 to be a national title contender. We have also shown little patience to allow coaches to build. I think we are killing ourselves right now. Genuinely. Some of our fans are making us look like ********* in front of these recruits and prospective coaches. I didn’t realize it had gotten THAT bad until I saw parents doing interviews begging us to chill. Even when I quoted Nate Oats himself saying he took his own name out of consideration for the Kentucky job BEFORE there was even a discussion of an offer, fans won’t hear it. We no longer listen to reason.
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I don’t agree. There are fringe fans in every fanbase, but there was no world where K was getting canned in late noughties.
Why would we ever pull for Cal????
I guess when you have cal in your username you feel obligated?
He's an apologist for the dog walker. Unfortunately, Arkansas looks like they will be very tough match for us.
I don't hate the man. Do you?
But since he's in the same conference I hope he loses every damn game.
Try again. I spent his last two years saying it was time to go. But I don't hate him. The man did bring a title here. Should've had more, but that's part of the reason it was time to go.
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I made an observation about the game that's the very subject of the thread. Stop trying to be a Karen.
It wasn’t going to happen I would say, but yes their boards were lit up with wanting to move on from him. Also, the student newspaper took a shot at him hardcore during that time. It was common knowledge that the fanbase wanted a change, then he adapted and of course went on that run. But it was being widely said that he was past his prime and Duke needed to move on. I went to Durham in 2008 or the beginning of 9 and spoke to a lot of Duke fans that said he was past his prime and they wanted a change. A good friend of mine is a Duke fan and he was saying K won’t be there much longer.
This was also around the time that coach K went the hell off on the students because they weren’t showing up to games. This was also in the student newspaper. There was a lot of tension between Duke / fans / coach K during those years. The game we went to we were shocked because the bleachers in the corners were bare. Dukes fan base is largely a myth tbh.
I don’t think he was going to be fired he had way too much control. But the fans around Durham and online were definitely ready for him to go and coming at him a lot. When the student newspaper is calling you washed that’s pretty much definitive proof especially during those times.
Scheyer still recruits Rippey
But yes seems that he mostly only recruits tall players now
Well he’s at Alabama, so Oats is doing as well as you can there. His record at Alabama pretty much seals the deal with UK brand and resources I think he’d kill it here. Not to say that’s 100% because sometimes the fit isn’t there. But he’s doing there what you look for if you’re UK. I would say if Mark doesn’t work you have to throw the bank at Oats. He’s got a final four at an average program, sometimes a really bad one. He built it from scratch too. And he’s consistently winning there. Looks like a possible final four team there this year.
It’s really tough to say he can do that there but not here. He’s also in our conference and knows the league. He’s primed for the UK job at this current pace.
Having said that we don’t know yet how this will go. Mark isn’t dead in the water, he’s still adapting and trying to find his footing. The problem is this is the NIL era where we should not be Stumbling to this degree. He needs to build on last season not go backwards. Injuries and a bad season in year 2 have derailed good coaches. It’s not fair, but that’s the nature of the beast.
I’m not sure anyone looks as good for this Job as Oats if it goes south. And the numbers don’t really matter to me because he’s doing this at Alabama from scratch. The UK brand with his abilities I’m sure he’d do really well here. Having said that, it’s just to say why people are seeing it. I get that, but throwing Mark out this quick no I don’t think that’s smart or productive. At least wait a second damn.
Again, with Duke talent, they are underachieving definitely
Cal went to final four four times in five years with top talent
Even count 2015, to now, Duke with one championship + two final four in 10+ years...
Cal team is out talented by Duke
We have seen this before
We have seen this before
Always said this and it’s still true. Calipari recruits pogo sticks that are going to beat you in long jump. Duke has basketball players. It’s the same story over and over and the guy just doesn’t get it and never will.
Arkansas right now is doing what we did for years I guarantee you they are. “This team is gonna be great in march”.
Yet here we are again and the facts in your face are, he lost. And Kentucky allowing that losing year after year hurt our brand bad. People are used to seeing us lose now. And for what? He never saw another final four here. Can’t believe how many Kentucky fans backed that nonsense year after year.
My God what is Calipari’s record against top 10 teams since 2015? 5-50? It’s unreal how bad he’s been and it’s not ever talked about. The media started liking him around 2015-17ish and boy do they cover his record.
5 SEC titles, a final four, #1 overall seed, 2 elite 8’s.
Yea and I mean he’s at Alabama. It’s like Beard, my God the guy was an overtime away from a title at Tech, and then a few minutes from another final four. Now he’s built Ole Miss into a final four contender. lol. How people don’t understand not all programs are created equal I don’t know. They’ll look and say “see, he went out in the second round at ole miss”. Umm yea, that means he’s got a doormat in tournaments a few steps from knocking on the final four door. After being tied in regulation for a championship at Tech lol. This doesn’t seem this hard to me. Oats is at Alabama knocking on the door for championships. Okay? This is Kentucky.
You put those guys in the Kentucky seat and it instantly improves them to final four/ championship level coaches. Beard might win way more than one here. I still get terrified thinking about him at Kansas. I promise this base, you absolutely do not want that. And you don’t want Oats at UNC.
I think what the village idiot is doing is saying it’s not a sure thing and no it’s not. The fit still has to be there. But what Oats is doing is exactly what you’re looking for if you’re Kentucky. That’s if Mark doesn’t work.
Arky made a nice run when they doubled Boozer in the paint! He has a high dribble and does not easily find the open player with a pass. This stifled the Duke offense for a bit- and then just like magic Arkansas stopped the double team- why?
The Fox, Monk & Bam season was probably the last year he had more talent.
And even then, I think Duke still had the #1 Ranked class with Tatum and Giles (Who didn't pan out due to multiple knee injuries in HS)
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It was my first time watching either team this season.
Both teams have some size. Hogs looked more athletic, but, as usual, couldn’t make shots down the stretch.
Glad Duke won, but, they didn’t humiliate them like I had hoped.
Both teams have some size. Hogs looked more athletic, but, as usual, couldn’t make shots down the stretch.
Glad Duke won, but, they didn’t humiliate them like I had hoped.
Glad Duke won?????? Huh????? It was time for Cal to go, but you rooted for Duke over a former coach who won a title at UK???? What???
Many UK fans hate Pitino and now Calipari. I honestly don’t get it. Not saying you have to root for them while elsewhere but the outright disdain and wanting to root against is strange. Both coaches provided many UK fans with some of the best memories they could have. Curious how yall feel about Tubby.
As for Scheyer, most Duke fans I know had some questions early on and still do to some extent but with the way college basketball has changed, most could not be happier with him and how he has navigated the task of taking over for a legend. Very happy with him and what he has done. He is winning a lot of basketball games, ACC Championships, already a Final Four appearance in his young career. I think he is over the hump in terms of building his own program with his own guys without K and still winning. Duke fans are very realistic in my opinion. National Championships are hard. Best team doesn’t always win. I am just happy to be in contention most years.
As for Scheyer, most Duke fans I know had some questions early on and still do to some extent but with the way college basketball has changed, most could not be happier with him and how he has navigated the task of taking over for a legend. Very happy with him and what he has done. He is winning a lot of basketball games, ACC Championships, already a Final Four appearance in his young career. I think he is over the hump in terms of building his own program with his own guys without K and still winning. Duke fans are very realistic in my opinion. National Championships are hard. Best team doesn’t always win. I am just happy to be in contention most years.
The Pitino dislike from me was about going to Louisville. Imagine a Duke coach going on to coach North Carolina. Wouldn't that piss you off?
Not what I’ve heard. Know of many Duke fans who think he’s an average floor coach at best and sometimes not even that. He’s being gifted great recruits he’s got nothing to do with. Foreign money is pulling them in with Nike continuing this unfair trade, and he’s looked pretty meh. To take that Duke team and lose to Houston is unbelievable. I’m not sure even Calipari could do that.
Duke is headed for the mid major ranks soon and I’m not sure Nike is going to continue the efforts to these levels. UK / UNC will be the premier game in the conference and county in the foreseeable future, Duke looks likely headed to the BigEast. Gonna be hard to keep this up without being attached to the UNC rivalry (which elevated Duke) and a power conference. We’ve seen UConn do well but it’s really early in the new conference shuffling. I don’t think that will keep up long.
Duke is headed for a crossroads that many of their fans don’t understand and won’t until they cross it. Scheyer is not a good floor coach by any means he’s looked pretty bad in some key games. I think the fake Duke stuff has just about run its course. We’ll see.
One thing is for sure, Duke had amassed the most talent in history since 2015 and hasn’t so much as played for a title at all. That’s alarming. The are the biggest chokers in sports history with that title. Add that talent, 0 title game appearances. I realize there’s a final four or 2 in there, but when we’re talking how much the were allowed to get away with (illegally recruiting Zion) and guys like Flagg, not to mention a slew of absolute beast throughout and top recruiting classes? No title games? It’s embarrassing, and it’s something that is hard to fathom when you add all of that talent. Calipari was much better with freshman than K and worlds better than Scheyer with them. He at least played for a title with a dominant freshman team.
I thought Arkansas looked like they were playing street ball last night. Totally disorganized.
Yep, and sadly there were some UK fans who thought he'd go to Arkansas, rejuvenate, and kill it there. lol
he def revived their brand no question
My point about Oats isn’t that I’d be dissatisfied. I love Oats and I think he builds rosters in a way that would satisfy me for sure. I’m just saying our fans would need to show some level of patience no matter who our coach is. Right now, with Pope we have people who are begging to fire the man 7 games into year two. Simply cannot have that. I want to see this thing out and if after year three, Pope hasn’t produced an elite eight and there’s no sign we are back to Kentucky level standards, you potentially move on. Last time Oats turned us down by removing his own name from consideration. It’s no secret that I’m a big Oats guy and if he ended up here, I have no doubt he’d meet my own expectations. Huge, huge Oats fan.
They’ve been to 5 Elite 8’s in the last eight seasons and went on to two Final Fours. That would be pretty awesome for most programs but not for a Duke or a Kentucky based on the yearly recruiting rankings which both schools dominate with all the recruiting trophies.
I love my Kentucky, but you must be still thinking about those Cal recruits, when you wrote this. If Pope can start getting a few of these studs, like Stokes or Collins, I believe he can get us back in the talk for sure. And the Love that man has for Kentucky basketball, is real. But I don't think this fan base will ever give him a chance, way to damn impatient.
I love my Kentucky, but you must be still thinking about those Cal recruits, when you wrote this. If Pope can start getting a few of these studs, like Stokes or Collins, I believe he can get us back in the talk for sure. And the Love that man has for Kentucky basketball, is real. But I don't think this fan base will ever give him a chance, way to damn impatient.
Arkansas was good since 20
Multiple s16/ee appearance under coach muss....
No way Cal "revived" the brand with s16
It is insane that posts like this are even allowed to be on the internet.