EDIT: Losing because of Wimsatt

[Retired711]

Let's all hold hands and say together: WIMSATT's A SOPHOMORE! (he has two years of eligibility after this one). We shouldn't be surprised that he's playing like one.

The poster above talked about "another ART situation." Schiano is trying to use him in a way that prevents exactly that. Ash had Sitkowski throw a lot and Sitkowski was constantly intercepted. He lost his confidence, and it's no surprise he transferred out of here.

Wimsatt is playing because he's the best QB we have. If that's anyone's fault, it's Schiano's by failing to recruit or develop an upperclassman who can play while Wimsatt develops. It would help if we had more quality receivers. That's on Schiano, too. The only good thing this year is that we finally have an offensive line.

 

[RUforlife]

Would it surprise you if I told you his QBR was over 100 by the end of 3Q?

Aside from Howard and Akron, what games next year do you see us winning with Gavin as the starting QB? VTech, Michigan State, and Illinois are not a given and let's face it beating the other teams on the schedule would be a challenge even with a legitimate FBS QB.

 

[Jtung230]

Aside from Howard and Akron, what games next year do you see us winning with Gavin as the starting QB? VTech, Michigan State, and Illinois are not a given and let's face it beating the other teams on the schedule would be a challenge even with a legitimate FBS QB.

It’s not a given unless we beat them. LOL

Just like this year right?

 

[RUforlife]

It’s not a given unless we beat them. LOL

Just like this year right?

Schiano gets credit for beating the teams he should have this year, no doubt. However, a lot of things broke his way this year, playing NW the first game when they were still reeling, VTech early, they have improved, and MSU imploded on special teams. I don't know if he is going to be so fortunate next year, that is a tough schedule.

 

[Jtung230]

Schiano gets credit for beating the teams he should have this year, no doubt. However, a lot of things broke his way this year, playing NW the first game when they were still reeling, VTech early, they have improved, and MSU imploded on special teams. I don't know if he is going to be so fortunate next year, that is a tough schedule.

Did you see us last year? What was the O/U on wins before the season? Yesterday was a flash back to last year.

 

[Kbee3]

IMO if Gavin is the best quarterback we have then we need to bring in a transfer who can throw the ball. Next season is too crucial to waste on mediocrity.

 

[Doctorzit]

GW is playing with a lot of caution. I think that’s coaching. They don’t want him to take chances because we think the run game and D can keep us in it.

GW is a nice kid; he's very young; give him time; coaches want to limit him taking chances; etc. etc. The point is, this QB is a big failure, in his own right as well as in our own coaches estimation of his potential. How this issue is resolved by the coaches will depend on whether they are willing to admit their error and move on. The evidence for this failure of QB play has been presented ad nauseam. Here is what I see:
1. GW has lack of passing consistency-He can look so good and then so bad!
2. He has poor decision making-He is not a natural option QB
3. It seems he knows the routes of maybe 2 receivers at best and usually tries to
make the pass to the primary receiver on each play ( 99% of the time )
4. He lacks " passing touch"- How often can one overthrow flat passes, wide open deep receivers, or almost kill
Monangai in the game with OSU.
5. He is a very good straight line runner, but not quick to an open hole or a deceptive individual that would make
defenders miss tackles.
6. He may be limiting the ability of the OC to inject a lot of variation and new plays into the offense- Is it due to
fear of overloading him with plays and, therefore, making his mistakes more likely? I don't know. But don't you agree the offense is pretty vanilla, wth the same running and pass plays each game? Very little innovation has been introduced, to the offense, during the season.
7. Some QBs have it, and some don't; he DOESN"T!

 

[Knight Shift]

You’re simply parroting group think. None of that is why we lost yesterday. We lost because we couldn’t run the ball and took too many dumb penalties.

All of you are wrong. Wrong, wrong, wrong!!

We fans go WAY ahead of ourselves thinking yesterday was going to be a walk in the park and we were going to beat Iowa. Hell, even in the @mb5789 podcast with the Iowa analyst, he thought we would hammer Iowa.

Here are some sobering thoughts on Iowa (if true):






That second X post says a LOT. What did the analysts on TV keep saying? They kept saying how Brian Ferentz, the scourge of Iowa fans, simplified the Iowa game plan for their inexperienced QB.

So, going into the game, Deacon Hill was:

11/27 (40.7%) with an INT against MSU
6/21 (28.6%) with an INT against Purdue
6/14 (42.9%) against Wisconsin
10/28 (35.7%) with an INT again Minnesota

Yet yesterday, he managed to go 20/31 (64.5%) for 223 yards against RU.

Yeah, it's ALL Gavin's fault. Nah, the defense deserves none of the blame for letting a ****** QB carve us up like a Thanksgiving turkey.

But therein lies a point- their staff simplified the game for their QB, and he showed some major improvement. Our coaches did nothing of that sort yesterday, and our QB did nothing to help himself. They deserved to lose for that awful performance all around. A lot of this is on the coaching staff.

 

[Knight Shift]

Let's all hold hands and say together: WIMSATT's A SOPHOMORE! (he has two years of eligibility after this one). We shouldn't be surprised that he's playing like one.

The poster above talked about "another ART situation." Schiano is trying to use him in a way that prevents exactly that. Ash had Sitkowski throw a lot and Sitkowski was constantly intercepted. He lost his confidence, and it's no surprise he transferred out of here.

Wimsatt is playing because he's the best QB we have. If that's anyone's fault, it's Schiano's by failing to recruit or develop an upperclassman who can play while Wimsatt develops. It would help if we had more quality receivers. That's on Schiano, too. The only good thing this year is that we finally have an offensive line.

As I pointed out above, Deacon Hill is a sophomore, and had 5 starts under his belt.

20/31 (64.5%) for 223 yards yesterday. He was helped by his coaches.

Yesterday's QB performance falls equally on the coaches and on Gavin himself. Not sure he should get the start against PSU, but if he does, the coaches should be prepared to substitute Simon.

 

[Jtung230]

GW’s QBR in the 1st 3Q was 116. He played well enough but the OL and run game didn’t show up. We need a complete game (complimentary football) to win games like this.

 

[RU05]

. Nah, the defense deserves none of the blame for letting a ****** QB carve us up like a Thanksgiving turkey.

But therein lies a point- their staff simplified the game for their QB, and he showed some major improvement. Our coaches did nothing of that sort yesterday, and our QB did nothing to help himself. They deserved to lose for that awful performance all around. A lot of this is on the coaching staff.

The D allowed all of 3 points at half, and 15 prior to Wimsatt's 4th qtr pick.

We were shut out.

I can't lay an ounce of blame on the D.

 

[RU05]

IMO if Gavin is the best quarterback we have then we need to bring in a transfer who can throw the ball. Next season is too crucial to waste on mediocrity.

We have to at least have someone who can challenge him for the number one role.

If Gavin ups his game, great, if not, we have another option. But his lack of progression through this season makes bringing some ready now talent imperative.

 

[Knight Shift]

The D allowed all of 3 points at half, and 15 prior to Wimsatt's 4th qtr pick.

We were shut out.

I can't lay an ounce of blame on the D.

I'm sure everyone knows this, but you have to play well for four quarters. Letting an inexperienced sophomore QB who previously threw in the 40% range with 5 starts under his belt carve us up is totally on the D.

 

[RU05]

I'm sure everyone knows this, but you have to play well for four quarters. Letting an inexperienced sophomore QB who previously threw in the 40% range with 5 starts under his belt carve us up is totally on the D.

I have a hard time getting on a D when the offense does nothing but give the other team chance after chance.

Look at our offensive numbers. We threw for under 100. We ran for 34. We scored zero.

I can't point a finger at the D after this one.

 

[Knight Shift]

I have a hard time getting on a D when the offense does nothing but give the other team chance after chance.

Look at our offensive numbers. We threw for under 100. We ran for 34. We scored zero.

I can't point a finger at the D after this one.

I've lost track of all my rants here today. But fair take. Iowa had the ball for almost 39 minutes to Rutgers having it for 21 minutes. After a while the defense gets tired, and exasperated. They are human, after all. I get it. So I concede to you here it's not the defense, but I'm still smarting over their QB and the simple play designs they used.

 

[rudad02]

GW is a nice kid; he's very young; give him time; coaches want to limit him taking chances; etc. etc. The point is, this QB is a big failure, in his own right as well as in our own coaches estimation of his potential. How this issue is resolved by the coaches will depend on whether they are willing to admit their error and move on. The evidence for this failure of QB play has been presented ad nauseam. Here is what I see:
1. GW has lack of passing consistency-He can look so good and then so bad!
2. He has poor decision making-He is not a natural option QB
3. It seems he knows the routes of maybe 2 receivers at best and usually tries to
make the pass to the primary receiver on each play ( 99% of the time )
4. He lacks " passing touch"- How often can one overthrow flat passes, wide open deep receivers, or almost kill
Monangai in the game with OSU.
5. He is a very good straight line runner, but not quick to an open hole or a deceptive individual that would make
defenders miss tackles.
6. He may be limiting the ability of the OC to inject a lot of variation and new plays into the offense- Is it due to
fear of overloading him with plays and, therefore, making his mistakes more likely? I don't know. But don't you agree the offense is pretty vanilla, wth the same running and pass plays each game? Very little innovation has been introduced, to the offense, during the season.
7. Some QBs have it, and some don't; he DOESN"T!

Trying to fit a square peg into a round hole.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

Would it surprise you if I told you his QBR was over 100 by the end of 3Q?

No it wouldn't because all the throws were carefully scripted even though he was 0-3 in the 3rd quarter.

However, once they fell behind and NEEDED Gavin to throw the wheels come off quickly and the overall QBR rating tanked from over 100 to 26.7 in a quarter.

And therein lies the problem, unless you have a solid lead he's a total risk if you need to rely on him throwing. As a redshirt sophomore this is a major red flag if you want to beat competitive teams.

 

[Kbee3]

Anyone who was around for Mike McMahon has to know that it isn't all about the quarterback.
And anyone who was around for Terry Shea has to know it's not all about the qb coach.
But anyone who has been around for more than five minutes has to know that we desperately need an upgrade at the quarterback position.

 

[Shelby65]

It’s ridiculous and asinine to blame the loss on an ineffective running game. Iowa’s sole focus was on stopping the running game because it’s no secret GW can’t pass. They did shut down our running game, and GW couldn’t make a single key play. Not one.

The 21 yard first half pass to Strong via the DB misplay was as much luck as anything.

Good coaches and teams can scheme and take away one player’s production. Then other players need to step up and produce and GW can’t.

It’s impossible to beat good teams without any credible passing game.

 

[Pils86]

I'm sure everyone knows this, but you have to play well for four quarters. Letting an inexperienced sophomore QB who previously threw in the 40% range with 5 starts under his belt carve us up is totally on the D.

He did have 39 minutes to get those yards and their OL looked pretty good, he had time on most of his passes and we did not record a single sack. Without the pickalmostsix we probably lose the game 15-0 and you can't blame the D.

 

[Morrischiano2]

Wimsatt is an adequate college run first QB but he is an inaccurate soft-tosser.

He just doesn’t a rocket arm and he’s consistently inaccurate. That will lead to tons of picks v the upper half of the BiG.

Hopefully Surace is the answer next yr.

Bump.

 

[RUforlife]

Anyone who was around for Mike McMahon has to know that it isn't all about the quarterback.
And anyone who was around for Terry Shea has to know it's not all about the qb coach.
But anyone who has been around for more than five minutes has to know that we desperately need an upgrade at the quarterback position.

Wimsatt plays as he practices. If you have ever been fortunate enough to watch a few practices over the course of his brief career you will notice that he is very consistent, the same throwing issues that challenge him in practice, challenge him in the games. Schiano is not stupid, he sees the same thing every day and he still believes Wimsatt gives him the best chance at a win. If there isn't a new starting QB next year, except the same results.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Anyone who was around for Mike McMahon has to know that it isn't all about the quarterback.
And anyone who was around for Terry Shea has to know it's not all about the qb coach.
But anyone who has been around for more than five minutes has to know that we desperately need an upgrade at the quarterback position.

pin this

 

[Morrischiano2]

Wimsatt plays as he practices. If you have ever been fortunate enough to watch a few practices over the course of his brief career you will notice that he is very consistent, the same throwing issues that challenge him in practice, challenge him in the games. Schiano is not stupid, he sees the same thing every day and he still believes Wimsatt gives him the best chance at a win. If there isn't a new starting QB next year, except the same results.

I went to a couple of practices for the 2022 camp. Wimsatt’s passes don’t have that “sound” that rocket arm QBs make. Hard to describe it but you can hear the ball cut through the air when it is really thrown hard. Gavin doesn’t have that. That’s what I remember about those practices.

 

[RUChoppin]

Looking at season completion percentages for RU QBs with over 100 attempts dating back to 1997:

65.1% - Hart (Jr)
61.4% - Vedral (Jr)
61.4% - Teel (Sr)
60.9% - Laviano (Jr)
60.8% - Hart (Sr)
59.4% - Vedral (Sr)
58.8% - Hart (So)
58.2% - Teel (Jr)
57.7% - Simon (So)
57.6% - Schwenk (Fr)
57.2% - Nova (Sr)
57.0% - Nova (So)
56.7% - Dodd (So)
55.4% - Teel (So)
55.2% - Dodd (Fr)
54.9% - Bolin (Sr)
54.9% - Dodd (Sr)
54.5% - Nova (Jr)
52.8% - Rescigno (So)
52.3% - Savage (Fr)
51.9% - Edmonds
51.8% - McMahon (So)
51.1% - Nova (Fr)
50.5% - Teel (Fr)
50.3% - Langan (Fr)
49.7% - McMahon (Sr)
49.1% - Sitkowski (Fr)
49.1% - McMahon (Fr)
48.3% - Laviano (Sr)
47.8% - Wimsatt (So)
47.0% - Rescigno (Jr)
45.9% - Hart (Fr)
45.8% - Trump (Sr)
45.2% - McMahon (Jr)
45.4% - Cubit (So)
44.8% - Wimsatt (Fr)
44.8% - Cubit (Fr)

 

[Samson1975!!!]

Simon at 57.7 with juggling OCs and a brutal offensive line situation.

 

[RUTGERS95]

Simon at 57.7 with juggling OCs and a brutal offensive line situation.

overlay that chart with hurries, sacks and avg rush per game (team) and you'll see that Gav has a very good oline comparitively

 

[RU#1fan]

IMO if Gavin is the best quarterback we have then we need to bring in a transfer who can throw the ball. Next season is too crucial to waste on mediocrity.

Mediocrity? Joking right? If we had a mediocre QB everything would be fine for Rutgers football this year and next. If the reigns of the QB position are foolishly again handed over right away to our current QB look for a rapid decline in offense in game 3 and no chance of getting to 6 wins. Bring in a real QB or start to groom one of your recruits.

 

[Samson1975!!!]

This is an unpopular view but Simon was only a sophomore when he played. He didn't have fans defending him or his age. He didn't have a coach backing him and validating him. He was inserted and yanked and blamed for a dysfunctional program. The turnovers resulted from having no time, a problem GW has not faced this year but does no better with.

Objectively speaking, Simon outperformed GW as a QB in their sophomore seasons. GW gets a bit more on the ground but plays in a different offense. I bet Simon would contribute more than people think while rushing in this offense. He isn't exactly slow.

If the young qbs need time to develop more, I hope Simon gets a fair chance at the job next year.

 

[Jtung230]

This is an unpopular view but Simon was only a sophomore when he played. He didn't have fans defending him or his age. He didn't have a coach backing him and validating him. He was inserted and yanked and blamed for a dysfunctional program. The turnovers resulted from having no time, a problem GW has not faced this year but does no better with.

Objectively speaking, Simon outperformed GW as a QB in their sophomore seasons. GW gets a bit more on the ground but plays in a different offense. I bet Simon would contribute more than people think while rushing in this offense. He isn't exactly slow.

If the young qbs need time to develop more, I hope Simon gets a fair chance at the job next year.

It’s not a popularity contest. Coaches make the decision. He lost the job to GW. Maybe he got unlucky with the new OC.

 

[Shelby65]

It’s not a popularity contest. Coaches make the decision. He lost the job to GW. Maybe he got unlucky with the new OC.

The OC doesn’t decide the philosophy, genius. On top of that, it’s the philosophy that decided QB1, not an honest competition. No matter how fantastic a doctor is, he’ll never make a best lawyer list. Simon never had any chance at all.

Post after post after post it’s clear you don’t understand the game.

 

[RUTGERS95]

This is an unpopular view but Simon was only a sophomore when he played. He didn't have fans defending him or his age. He didn't have a coach backing him and validating him. He was inserted and yanked and blamed for a dysfunctional program. The turnovers resulted from having no time, a problem GW has not faced this year but does no better with.

Objectively speaking, Simon outperformed GW as a QB in their sophomore seasons. GW gets a bit more on the ground but plays in a different offense. I bet Simon would contribute more than people think while rushing in this offense. He isn't exactly slow.

If the young qbs need time to develop more, I hope Simon gets a fair chance at the job next year.

Simon is the better qb but Gav, not sure how, was higher rated

 

[RUTGERS95]

The OC doesn’t decide the philosophy, genius. On top of that, it’s the philosophy that decided QB1, not an honest competition. No matter how fantastic a doctor is, he’ll never make a best lawyer list. Simon never had any chance at all.

Post after post after post it’s clear you don’t understand the game.

I already told the board it wasn't an open comp and it's fine if people think otherwise but it was not

 

[KK1827]

This is an unpopular view but Simon was only a sophomore when he played. He didn't have fans defending him or his age. He didn't have a coach backing him and validating him. He was inserted and yanked and blamed for a dysfunctional program. The turnovers resulted from having no time, a problem GW has not faced this year but does no better with.

Objectively speaking, Simon outperformed GW as a QB in their sophomore seasons. GW gets a bit more on the ground but plays in a different offense. I bet Simon would contribute more than people think while rushing in this offense. He isn't exactly slow.

If the young qbs need time to develop more, I hope Simon gets a fair chance at the job next year.

Simons gone. He’ll be starting at a lower level d1 and i think he’ll do pretty well

 

[Samson1975!!!]

That's too bad, though understandable of course. I hope he finds the right program to make his mark!

 

[Knight Shift]

Simons gone. He’ll be starting at a lower level d1 and i think he’ll do pretty well

I agree with you on this. He would be wise to leave.

 

[Retired711]

I agree with you on this. He would be wise to leave.

If I were he, I wouldn't leave until I was beaten out by someone else. That means either Surace or Sheppard have to develop very quickly or that we find a portal QB who really can do the job. (We all know that our history with transfer QBs is mixed.)

A lot of good criticisms have been made of him in this thread. He needs better passing technique, particularly footwork, and he needs to be coached to maintain his technique even under pressure so that he doesn't throw at his receivers' feet or ten feet over their heads. He needs to be able to see the field better. He needs to run the RPO option. He's got two years left. Things aren't hopeless for him, but we do need a Plan B between now and next year.

 

[RUTGERS95]

If I were he, I wouldn't leave until I was beaten out by someone else. That means either Surace or Sheppard have to develop very quickly or that we find a portal QB who really can do the job. (We all know that our history with transfer QBs is mixed.)

A lot of good criticisms have been made of him in this thread. He needs better passing technique, particularly footwork, and he needs to be coached to maintain his technique even under pressure so that he doesn't throw at his receivers' feet or ten feet over their heads. He needs to be able to see the field better. He needs to run the RPO option. He's got two years left. Things aren't hopeless for him, but we do need a Plan B between now and next year.

he won't learn it

he was barely touched this year and had plenty of time to be effective and struggled. He's not even that good in practice

there is something else at play here

 

[Shelby65]

He’s been in our program three years and still can’t complete a wide open 5 yard screen pass or be allowed to throw between the numbers. They only let him throw outside the DB where the only other person with the opposite uniform is the other team’s trainer or special teams coach. There are no reads, only predetermined targets.

It’s not experience, mechanics or anything that more time will fix. He is not a college level passer, period. He’s a great athlete with who has had enough opportunity to become a serviceable college QB but hasn’t. We’re past the point of debate. It’s time to cut our losses and start over at the position.

Instead, he’s the #2 running option on a team that can only win on the ground, a certain failure against all good teams.

 

[Knight Shift]

If I were he, I wouldn't leave until I was beaten out by someone else. That means either Surace or Sheppard have to develop very quickly or that we find a portal QB who really can do the job. (We all know that our history with transfer QBs is mixed.)

A lot of good criticisms have been made of him in this thread. He needs better passing technique, particularly footwork, and he needs to be coached to maintain his technique even under pressure so that he doesn't throw at his receivers' feet or ten feet over their heads. He needs to be able to see the field better. He needs to run the RPO option. He's got two years left. Things aren't hopeless for him, but we do need a Plan B between now and next year.

I had suggested that Simon should leave, not Wimsatt.