How could our football staff allow the Collins news to break before Mullen has a chance to set the record straight and do a formal announcement. By allowing the news to break before Mullen speaks, we have created a media nightmare and speculation that is unfounded and lacks evidence. Whatever happens here, from an outside perspective, our football building needs to do a better job of keeping this stuff under wraps. Speculation, especially this time of year, does nothing but hurt a program. This is the one time of year where your program must be perceived as being as strong and solid as possible.
How does the Collins news leak?
- Thread starter shotgunDawg
- Start date
Just speculating, but I'm sure it will get turned into a "Bear trying to put out false info" thread.
The move could be preemptive.
Wilson may want out. He has been demoted and dressed down by the coach, and more recently by the fans. It's the time of year for finding new work if you aren't happy.
Maybe Wilson is looking to get out. Maybe Mullen knows it and made a preemptive strike by promoting Collins.
My question is, if true, why can't you guys keep any continuity in your staff. This is something that has hurt you guys over the last few years. The staff has been musical chairs lately.
The move could be preemptive.
Wilson may want out. He has been demoted and dressed down by the coach, and more recently by the fans. It's the time of year for finding new work if you aren't happy.
Maybe Wilson is looking to get out. Maybe Mullen knows it and made a preemptive strike by promoting Collins.
My question is, if true, why can't you guys keep any continuity in your staff. This is something that has hurt you guys over the last few years. The staff has been musical chairs lately.
Because sans Wilson, people have actually wanted our assistants? It's really a good problem to have, we just got lazy on the Wilson promotion.
Good try troll. You DO realize that your team's ENTIRE staff was replaced last year right? And that your program will likely fire Freeze the first time he doesn't best his prior season. Good effort though. Our staff is fine...we just keep getting such great coaches that they are hired for head coaching gigs, etc.
No ****. How can having our coaches get promoted be construed as a bad thing? olemissbydamn is one of those passive aggressive 'objective' shitheads that DS lets hang around. Question him and he'll label you a sheep.
Coaches getting hired away is frustrating, but it's not a negative thing. Negative is having to fire coaches, which we've done what, once in Torbush since Mullen was hired? And hate to break it to anyone, but losing Diaz and Hud was not the reason we failed to sign Johnson, Singleton, Brassell and Whitehead. olemissbydamn will want to frame it that way, of course, to disguise the real reasons.
Coaches getting hired away is frustrating, but it's not a negative thing. Negative is having to fire coaches, which we've done what, once in Torbush since Mullen was hired? And hate to break it to anyone, but losing Diaz and Hud was not the reason we failed to sign Johnson, Singleton, Brassell and Whitehead. olemissbydamn will want to frame it that way, of course, to disguise the real reasons.
Maybe it got out there b/c our head coach had our SID tweet before the game that Collins would be calling the defense. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to put two and two together. Mullen let it be known right then that all was not hunky dory on the indian mound!
So you post that, then say that my post was trolling. Ok...
Yes, we replaced most of our staff last year. That typically happens when you fire the head coach.
It wasn't quite the ENTIRE staff, but I'll leave the hair splitting to you.
Are you going to sit hear and argue that continuity has been an issue for Mullen during his short tenure?
Yes, we replaced most of our staff last year. That typically happens when you fire the head coach.
It wasn't quite the ENTIRE staff, but I'll leave the hair splitting to you.
Are you going to sit hear and argue that continuity has been an issue for Mullen during his short tenure?
Ole Miss typically has way more turnover than State. That is just the facts.
You know that.
You know that.
So another school is going to hire Wilson as their DC after his ****-tastic job this year at State??
Your right, nightmare was a poor word. Just meant that leaving things open ended to the media usually isn't a great policy
well losing hud to a HC gig isn't really our fault. nor is losing diaz to the DC spot at TEXAS where he got paid ~3 times as much as we were paying him because TEXAS has a whole lot more $$ than we do. trust me, if ole miss conitnues to do well, yall we be lucky to hang on to any hot assistants too.
so you post in a thread injecting omu into it. Then complain in other posts about how we talk about omu too much?
We are talking about how staff changes may or may not affect OUR recruiting. We all thank you for your valuable contributions to the board. Really, bottom of our hearts type stuff.
We are talking about how staff changes may or may not affect OUR recruiting. We all thank you for your valuable contributions to the board. Really, bottom of our hearts type stuff.
his 2011 defense was the best we had in the last 12 years...I dont think ****-tastic applies
I dont agree with his style and thought he could have done some things differently in 2012- but the 2011 D was pretty damn good
My post has nothing to do with OM... others are injecting OM into it as usual.
I understand that other schools have come after some of your assistants. That's great. Many times it does mean that you had good assistants that got hired away. That doesn't change the fact that a lack of continuity can hurt you at this time of year.
I was waiting for you to make this about recruiting. I have an honest question for you. Why does Channing Ward choose Ole Miss with a brand new staff, but it seems if MSU changes a single assistant coach, we have 2 or 3 decommitments? I want your honest opinion.
WTF?
Coach34, I used to be indifferent toward you. But this statement has removed any credibility you had in my eyes.
Coach34, I used to be indifferent toward you. But this statement has removed any credibility you had in my eyes.
I go with the complete opposite of some. If you have (nearly) full coaching staff continuity @ State or OM, it generally means your coaches suck. We are always going to have the best and brightest picked off from us -- not often as lateral moves anymore -- but just the reality of it. Coaches that have success at their position @ State/OM in the SEC simply don't stay long unless they get promoted. We're seeing Collins get promoted at least to some extent in order to hold onto him(FSU was seriously looking at him as their DC, while FIU and others were looking at him as head coach). Mullen had to reason that he was more important to the longterm success of our program than Wilson was in order to make this move.
That said, State has GOT to get more competitive in assistant pay. See todd4state's article describing this. I like how Mullen has generally gone after the best and brightest -- even those with no ties to MSU. I'm ok with that, even if we lose them down the road.
This is Mullen's 5th recruiting year at MSU...Of the 8 original staff members, 5 are still in place. Diaz is the only person he's hired since putting together his original staff that left. Total lost coaches in those 5 years:
David Turner - left for a promotion @ UK. He was DL coach for us -- DL coach and assistant HC there
Carl Torbush - told to find something else. Ended up as DC on Turner Gill's terrible staff that lasted 2 yrs @ Kansas
Manny Diaz - left to be DC at Texas
Mark Hudspeth - left to be HC at ULL
Angelo Mirando - obvious
Melvin Smith - was told to look around and already has his 25 yr pension in MS
He hired Wilson to replace Turner -- as a DL coach/recruiter obvious upgrade.
He hired Diaz to replace Torbush -- obvious upgrade
He hired Collins to replace Diaz -- we will see, but his resume' is every bit as good as Mannys was when we hired him, Collins just had to wait his turn.
He hired Mirando to replace Hud -- Big 17 up. Nothing more to say.
He hired Brewster to replace Mirando -- Maybe his best overall hire to date.
Of course** No need to actually look at the statistics when you can blindly disagree though**
Well, if that's what floats your boat. The 2007 defense is statistically better than the 2011 defense - except for ppg.
Stats: ppg/ ypg/ total passing D / total rushing D/ INT
2007
2010
2011
Stats: ppg/ ypg/ total passing D / total rushing D/ INT
2007
2010
2011
Why are yards per game generally given more credence than points per game? I'm not disagreeing with your point. But usually when only one stat is talked about it will be yardage given up.
Giving up the least points, regardless of yards, seems to be obviously more important. The only downside to the bend but don't break defenses is they may not give their offense enough time with the ball. Just wondering out loud.
Giving up the least points, regardless of yards, seems to be obviously more important. The only downside to the bend but don't break defenses is they may not give their offense enough time with the ball. Just wondering out loud.
PPG is and will always be the single most important stat. YPG and the other stats are looked at to get a big picture opinion however. In PPG, Wilson's 11 defense was better than anything else we've had since 99. In other metrics that show "aggressiveness, etc..." not so much.
Our defense was bad this year after being good last year. No denial from anyone. I've been against firing Wilson all along -- but I'm absolutely good with demoting him from playcalling and giving Collins a chance. I know what I saw in the Gator Bowl was an improvement schematically from what I'd been seeing...
Everyone is excited about the coaching moves that are being made. I think we are going in the wrong direction. First, it was bush-league for the change in defense play calling to be made public in the manner that it was. I bet that most coaches around the country thought that it was handled with no class. We will never get a seasoned coach to join this staff, unless its someone with no other option and in debt up to their eyeballs. I will be shocked if Wilson stays on this staff, unless he is named assistant HC. Why should he stay and why should we want him? The concensus on this board is that he messed up the DL. If he leaves, we will not hold some big recruits. I have concerns about Collins. Our LBs were far less than stellar this year.
This notion that Co-coordinators is a good thing is false. Its a tool used by control freak HCs that breeds distrust and discord. A recent conversation revealed that the players feel that there was a lack of respect for some of the coaches. Some were being held to one standard and others to another. It was said that "some coaches are treated like Sh*t." This is a house warring against itself. Players tend to defend their coaches. I think this divisiveness showed on the field this year. I'm love MSU football. I appreciate what Mullen has done for our program. For the last few years, I have felt good about spending $ to support this program. But I'm concern that the program took a big step back this year. Pride comes before destruction, and an arrogant spirit before a fall.
This notion that Co-coordinators is a good thing is false. Its a tool used by control freak HCs that breeds distrust and discord. A recent conversation revealed that the players feel that there was a lack of respect for some of the coaches. Some were being held to one standard and others to another. It was said that "some coaches are treated like Sh*t." This is a house warring against itself. Players tend to defend their coaches. I think this divisiveness showed on the field this year. I'm love MSU football. I appreciate what Mullen has done for our program. For the last few years, I have felt good about spending $ to support this program. But I'm concern that the program took a big step back this year. Pride comes before destruction, and an arrogant spirit before a fall.
How?
How is that? Did Dan Mullen leak it? No. It leaked out first -- probably from players at practice -- and he was point blank asked about it in the pregame press conference. How was he supposed to respond? Lie?
Link? It's not "classless" to pull playcalling duties from someone if they aren't getting the job done. God forbid that coaches around the country know that we hold our coaches to a high standard and if they don't live up to those standards, we will move on. Keeping in mind that we have not YET point-blank fired a SINGLE COACH in Mullen's tenure. So, it's "classless" to basically help them find another job instead of point blank getting rid of them? Laughable!
Link? Oh that's right. We hired Collins -- a FINALIST for the Broyles Award for the NATION'S top assistant the year before. Then we hired Brewster -- Rivals' #3 recruiter of the DECADE from 2000-2010, a period of time in which he spent only 2 or 3 years in college. We are CLEARLYYY struggling to find any "seasoned" coaches that want to come here and coach in the nation's best conference.
Because he's a very good DL coach and excellent recruiter. Exactly what do you think his options are? He's making $350k here. He's not going to get another shot to be a DC anywhere else until he repairs his image. So, if he jumps, he does so for a lateral move elsewhere. He took a defense that was supposed to be top 15 and crapped the bed -- his image is tarnished and his stock is down. A few years molding the young talent we have on the DL allows him to get his stock back and look into other options. There's a reason he wasn't offered the DC job at aTm last year when his BEST friend Sumlin came calling, after all...
LULZ. Yeah, a first team freshman all-american was definitely less than stellar** This is laughable -- and shows you don't understand what you are talking about. Our linebackers were NOT the problem this year.
How? It's just a title that gives a pay raise and essentially establishes a pecking order. It does not "breed distrust and discord." It's simple. Get the job done when you get a shot -- keep your job. Don't, and you will lose that job. IF you are a co-coordinator at MSU, Dan Mullen has CONSISTENTLY PROVEN that he will give you your shot when the time comes. If anything, this is a great TOOL to get us excellent coaches that we otherwise couldn't lure.
Or maybe SOME of the coaches weren't doing their damn job -- and got their *** crawled about it. Sorry it hurt some widdle feewins among the players in that position group. Maybe if THEY had done their job, while their position coach did theirs, we would all be singing kumbaya right now. Let me guess -- YOU hate John Cohen and will never attend another MSU baseball game as well because he "likes to yell and curse".
Yet here you are on a message board in a very long-winded fashion BITCHING ABOUT THE CHANGES BEING MADE TO TRY AND FIX THE PROBLEMS. You can't have your cake and eat it to. So, which is it?
Good quote. How the heck does it apply here?
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Agreed. Can not imagine a worse poster that is actually a MSU fan...if he is, in fact, an MSU fan...
Well, just how the 17 do you think we need to go about fixing it then?
You bitched because we lost.
You bitched because we're making changes to fix problem.
So, what is your genius solution? Please enlighten the rest of us.
Not bitching that we loss. I have been a MSU fan long enough to stomach it. What gets under my skin is many say 8-5 is great; but in the next post say that all the assistants suck. People ***** about the defense but give Mullen a pass on the offense. UM would not have beat us if Mullen's offense was worth a ****. I know... he does not have the players to run his offense. I say BS. It must be Les's fault. No one talks about his best buddy being the least productive coach on the staff. Our biggest problem was team chemistry. Running coaches off will definitely fix that.
