Ok the reason I ask is I wanted all your opinions in numbers. Not just names. If these were actual accurate salaries the total of those 13 are 6.65mm. If we found a 2.35mm center you can keep the team and just add that desperate true c we need so much. But that’s 9mm. So by some’s thinking we have to keep it at 8mm. So say that’s Grant. If Grant goes and and we got a C we pay a total of 13 for 8mm. But that’s not a bubble team. So please have fun with it, using actual numbers AND names where are you cutting and adding. I’ve been fiddling with it and it’s harder than it looks at 8mm. I’ll hold my opinion until others have chimed in. And I know many will say “it’s useless as these are the real numbers and we don’t know the true cap”. So true. I don’t know $hiz about the real numbers but it’s just a fun exercise.
Keepers for next year
- Thread starter RUdepressed
- Start date
You're not keeping all of them. Multiple don't belong on the roster next year (Ware, Fall, Dortch, Badalau, Ogbole); one has yet to qualify (Jones) so unknown if they will be here and as always there will be others that leave that you maybe wanted to keep.
The only starter level player on the roster is Francis so they are looking for 4 starters and that will cost approximately $5-5.25m IMO if they get the right level of players. Everyone else is a bench piece and will be paid accordingly.
Of course. Good point. Please flesh it out for me in your opinion. How are you dividing that 5.25mm up among the 4 starters? Agree on 1.5 for Francis? When you say bench player paid accordingly how much per? I’m guessing 6-8 or 9 has to be worth a little more.
C - $2m
PG - $1-1.25m
SF - $1m
PF - $1m
Francis - $1m
Backup C - $800K-$1m
Some of your larger valuations seem a bit high to me but it's all a guesstimate no matter how you slice it since the portal isn't open yet. The others are in the neighborhood with what I had when I did this on the RT over a week ago.
Lots of rumors out there as to who is staying and going so hard to put a finger on how many portal additions there will be but that will clear up after the B1G tournament and that may alter how much is spent on certain positions. I don't expect a paid roster of more than 12-13 players.
Thanks for engaging. So your total for 6 players there is $7mm. Not being a jerk, just clarifying, you’re sprinkling your last $1mm for players 7-12? Or are you counting on there being more than $8mm. No joke though, that starting five could be very good.
As they've mentioned in the podcasts, Zinn has raised money above the original $8m target.
Forgive me if posted elsewhere but during the midcourt “interview” post game - Francis said “see you next year”
That seems very worthy of discussion
That seems very worthy of discussion
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I only heard her say, multiple times, they’ve met their goal. But not what the goal was.
This. 1000%. We get way too attached to guys who are bad to mediocre and talk about their development. The heck with developing them an go get a real player instead.
Exactly, none of us knows how much they raised or what the target goal was. May have been $6 Mil, $8 Mil, $11 Mil, who knows. Only thing she said was they met the goal like you said. Pike may be working with a bigger war chest than we think or even smaller than we expect. Who knows, but considering it’s Rutgers I am going to say it’s likely smaller than expect.
I posted this on the premium thread…
This year …approx 25 teams hit 8 digits , 6-7 from the big ten
That was last year
Of the 78 power 5 teams …expecting 50-60 to hit 8 digits ….
last years nunbers are going to be lower than this years nunbers with more money available
my hunch …is that it will take 7.5-8M to retain the following (including he frosb )
Francis
Grant
Mark
Powers
Buchannan
Jones
Wooten
Nuwuli
Jmike
Dortch
that leaves us 2-3 million to make a run at a legit center ….
If we had the next notch (12-13M) …I think we would have the money to “trade up on certain salary cap spots “
but I don’t think we will have that much …so I think it’s retain and add a center
which of itself….keeping our core intact and adding a legit center , plus jones and Wooten …should have us taking a step forward
…..
This year …approx 25 teams hit 8 digits , 6-7 from the big ten
That was last year
Of the 78 power 5 teams …expecting 50-60 to hit 8 digits ….
last years nunbers are going to be lower than this years nunbers with more money available
my hunch …is that it will take 7.5-8M to retain the following (including he frosb )
Francis
Grant
Mark
Powers
Buchannan
Jones
Wooten
Nuwuli
Jmike
Dortch
that leaves us 2-3 million to make a run at a legit center ….
If we had the next notch (12-13M) …I think we would have the money to “trade up on certain salary cap spots “
but I don’t think we will have that much …so I think it’s retain and add a center
which of itself….keeping our core intact and adding a legit center , plus jones and Wooten …should have us taking a step forward
…..
That's because that information doesn't get mentioned here unless it's in a podcast.
My point is we don’t know if it’s 10,6,7 etc. so for my exercise I just made it 8
Really , as much as I would love to know …I think we are broadcasting too much already on what have . Can be used against us …..
What I do get a sense for ….is that the market is moving up a lot. Same player value will
Be a lot higher for 2026-2027…
we shall see ….
I don’t think any other good team is really worried about our total budget
And the exercise was for 8m as a cap. If you want to cheat it with 10m you don’t get to see the tough choices that might have to be made if it’s indeed closer to 8. It was just for fun not about what’s going on on the premium board. Is Zinn on that board? Sullivan? Don’t folks say the premium boards always say Mark has one foot out the door but then you hear that you can’t always believe what’s on the round table? What if it’s not ten? Does Pike get a pass and Zinn get blamed because she only doubled the NIL and didn’t get it to 10m?
As of today, keep Tariq, Lino, Kaden, Nwuli, Darren, Jones, Wooten. Go get a center, a 3 who can shoot, and a 4 like Washington on Maryland who is a beast on the boards. A tall combo guard would be nice.
We’re not recruiting a playable back up center from the portal so we MUST keep either Ogbole or Dortch (preferably both for match up versatility).
Anyone who entertains debating this need, just doesn’t understand the reality of our situation. To convince a remotely playable center to pick up and transfer into RU to back up the clear and away starter that we MUST land, would cost us what Washington paid Lathan. We have nothing whatsoever attractive to sell an incoming prospect about this role. We have to hope Ogbole / Dortch like it here and are comfortable staying put with a fair offer.
My haphazard financial analysis:
1. Mid-tier B10 starter money: Francis
2. Low-tier B10 starter money: Mark
3. High-end B10 backup money: Buchanan, Powers, probably Davis?
4. I have no idea what you do with these guys: Grant, Zrno
5. Mid-tier B10 backup money: Nwuli, probably Dortch
6. Fill out roster money: Jones, Ware, freshman
7. Gone: Badalou, Fall
1. Mid-tier B10 starter money: Francis
2. Low-tier B10 starter money: Mark
3. High-end B10 backup money: Buchanan, Powers, probably Davis?
4. I have no idea what you do with these guys: Grant, Zrno
5. Mid-tier B10 backup money: Nwuli, probably Dortch
6. Fill out roster money: Jones, Ware, freshman
7. Gone: Badalou, Fall
Tariq - yes middle tier B10 starter (high end for guard but centers clearly at the top so middle sounds right). Buchanan will get paid to be a “more than half the game” type player - would think it’s not really “starter” non-starter. Versatility matters in projected average PT which figures to be what negotiations would be based on generally. I think he and Mark will be priced similarly for different reasons. There’s a large enough sample size to comfortably conclude that playing TF and Mark together for 15 or so mpg on average is not a major problem which means the projected path for Lino, like Buchanan, would be “more than half the game” player.
If EO gets the extra year, he should be paid the going rate for utility back up and if we have to give him 50K extra to seal him in we ought to do it early. Same with Dortch. We would end up with Agee / Fall types unless we are prepared to shell out 800k+ for a better one. If we can spend 600K total and keep these 2 depth pieces whose effectiveness varies based on match up, we’re almost certainly going to be better off what we would be overpaying for to land one 600K low major big. The role just isn’t desirable at Rutgers right now.
After - these guys - retention negotiations get more dicey. Denis, Ware, and Fall are not worth paying. If they want to stay for free (or scholarship coverage now that this doesn’t matter - fine). The other guys are harder to figure. I can’t see offering more than 500K to Grant and even that seems high. I’d rather take my chances on Nwuli for 350K to be honest and Grant probably can get 750K plus from an A-10 team that will see 10 ppg BIG player.
SGs are a dime a dozen and the 2 we have are shooting 35% from the field and under 33% from 3 on the season. I can’t see how that’s worth more than 350K in either case but maybe we bump that to 400K for one of them for the value of development within the program va starting over with a midmajor sharp shooter. Also - J Mike might be 2 inches shorter than Kaden but it’s worth noting that he grabbed more RPM, shot better than him, can handle the ball and plays better defense.
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@RUFAN4LIFE - exactly what type of proven center do you think a 12 mpg utility role at RU is going to appeal to? The strong hope is that we will be shelling out the money necessary to land a clear starter at this position.
We really have nothing to sell to entice a big man to pick up and move to NJ for a back up role (even Agee did it for his son / the degree if I recall). And that was also a year we were projected to make March Madness. Getting an opportunity to be a part of that is a selling point for some kids too. We don’t have any of these things to offer. All we have is whatever money we can shell out, but the bottom line is anyone materially better than Ogbole would likely be able to start a mid major and make the same if not more than we can offer. Theres nothing more appealing about riding our bench vs that. We can roll the dice with another late cycle frosh like Ware but it’s very risky to do this. Ware clearly cannot help us considering he doesn’t see the floor.
We really have nothing to sell to entice a big man to pick up and move to NJ for a back up role (even Agee did it for his son / the degree if I recall). And that was also a year we were projected to make March Madness. Getting an opportunity to be a part of that is a selling point for some kids too. We don’t have any of these things to offer. All we have is whatever money we can shell out, but the bottom line is anyone materially better than Ogbole would likely be able to start a mid major and make the same if not more than we can offer. Theres nothing more appealing about riding our bench vs that. We can roll the dice with another late cycle frosh like Ware but it’s very risky to do this. Ware clearly cannot help us considering he doesn’t see the floor.
Thanks do this can’t see the forest through the trees like post where there are so many obstacles we have to keep Ogbole.
Paying in the range I put out there gets you someone better than Ogbole. He’s not even getting what Sommerville got from UW because he’s not good.
The 2nd portal center just needs to be someone serviceable that can give you some quality minutes at either end. We don’t get that from Ogbole other than some fits and spurts.
If you want to have a chance at a winning record next year you have to cut the cord. Hanging on to Ogbole like Linus and his blue blanket is small time thinking.
Edit - Ogbole is technically not eligible not year without a waiver from the NCAA. So are you going to take that risk of the ruling is delayed…never mind you wait at the altar to marry this guy and have his kids too.
I tend to lean in this direction too, not as a preference but as a likely scenario based on loyalty, continuity, and budget.
One litmus test on the impact of only bringing in a legit two-way center is, what would our record have been this year with such a player?
I tend to think we would have won 4 more games with a great center.
Add to that another year of development for our best freshmen (Lino, Powers, Nwuli, Zrno), plus the improved chemistry of all the returning players, and next year you could be looking at a legit bubble team.
Thanks do this can’t see the forest through the trees like post where there are so many obstacles we have to keep Ogbole.
Paying in the range I put out there gets you someone better than Ogbole. He’s not even getting what Sommerville got from UW because he’s not good.
The 2nd portal center just needs to be someone serviceable that can give you some quality minutes at either end. We don’t get that from Ogbole other than some fits and spurts.
If you want to have a chance at a winning record next year you have to cut the cord. Hanging on to Ogbole like Linus and his blue blanket is small time thinking.
Edit - Ogbole is technically not eligible not year without a waiver from the NCAA. So are you going to take that risk of the ruling is delayed…never mind you wait at the altar to marry this guy and have his kids too.
Lathan reportedly got over 800k. We’re not paying anything close to that for a second center. Our budget is maybe half of that for this particular role. In all likelihood we’ll pick up another frosh / tall Euro and hope that guy fares better than Ware if Ogbole doesn’t get an extra year or leaves. Could we get lucky? Sure. But that’s the only way we will have a better back up center on our roster next year than Ogbole would be. Under no circumstance will we be buying one who has already proven himself to be better.
So you have one example from a team that is known to overspend and that means it's not possible.
Then you continue to double down on why it has to be Ogbole. Meanwhile Ogbole doesn't even get near that amount and won't even with the larger pot that Pike has because he's not a backup center.
I also see you ignored how Ogbole is also out of eligibility pending a waiver that the NCAA has to approve.
Use some strategic thinking, are you going to wait on the NCAA to approve this waiver and if it's delayed and then denied, what's your plan? You're left picking up scraps like Fall or Ware as your backup.
Agree to disagree, you just seem to want to argue endlessly which explains why threads on this board get so long.
Grant is only worth half that, IMO. Enough talent to keep around - but not enough to break the bank. I’m hoping we can keep Francis for 1M. Think we need to be able to spend 5-6 on transfers, with a 5 probably taking 50-60% of the funding.
So you have one example from a team that is known to overspend and that means it's not possible.
Then you continue to double down on why it has to be Ogbole. Meanwhile Ogbole doesn't even get near that amount and won't even with the larger pot that Pike has because he's not a backup center.
I also see you ignored how Ogbole is also out of eligibility pending a waiver that the NCAA has to approve.
Use some strategic thinking, are you going to wait on the NCAA to approve this waiver and if it's delayed and then denied, what's your plan? You're left picking up scraps like Fall or Ware as your backup.
Agree to disagree, you just seem to want to argue endlessly which explains why threads on this board get so long.
It is expected that Ogbole will get the waiver. Obviously if not - this is all for mute though the same logic applies for Dortch.
In terms of “one example” - more are not needed. The issue I described is not unique to Rutgers. Teams like RU and Washington are not selling portal recruits on an automatic NCAA appearance. When it comes to shopping for utility players to convince to pick up their lives, change schools and move to NJ - money is what we have to sell. It would have to be more of it than what others are offering - and not just a few dollars. It would take a lot to make it worth it to sit on our bench vs be the main center on a middle of the road or weak A-10 team (and anyone weaker than this level isn’t going to be any better than Ogbole or Dortch). It’s really that simple and there’s plenty of history to support this now - Fall, Agee, Ware - that’s what we are getting in open market. Remember Agee started for a bad MWC team.
I agree Francis isn’t an elite player but he’s a bucket getter and do improve. Every team needs a guy who can get his shot off against just about anyone. He has also improved on the defensive end and averaged over 4 assists per game the last 8. I was ok with him moving on 10 games ago but I really think we need him back next year.
I assume JMike and Dortch don’t cost much. No reason to chase them off. They’ve been good soldiers and usually give effort. I fully expect Buchanon back. I’d also be surprised if Jones hits the road. You don’t carry him for the year just to let him walk when he can play. That’s four.
Beyond that who knows but if Powers and Zrno aren’t breaking the bank they’re they types of guys you want to develop. If they stick around in think in 2 years they could be very effective. Now we’re at 6.
Francis and Lino? A lot of moving parts but they work as keepers assuming we can still pay for two impact starters.
Beyond that who knows but if Powers and Zrno aren’t breaking the bank they’re they types of guys you want to develop. If they stick around in think in 2 years they could be very effective. Now we’re at 6.
Francis and Lino? A lot of moving parts but they work as keepers assuming we can still pay for two impact starters.
Agree on JMike, I'd also be curious to his academic standing/major. Is it in his best interests to get that RU degree?
If we have 10M to spend - I want half of it spent in the portal on 3 high caliber/ elite defensive players. Portal mission should be to upgrade the defense in the places it is most deficient. I’m optimistic that 5M could be enough to “purchase” this.
I’d then be content with using the other 5M to retain Tariq, Buchanan, Mark, either Ogbole or Dortch to play back up center, and whoever else Pike can afford to pay in that price range in addition to the 2 frosh. Then pick up bodies at the end to fill out 12 spots.
Noteworthy - this is Rutgers second best offensive efficiency rating in the entire history of KenPom (Aaron reported that on his podcast). Dylan/Ace team of course was the best. This team also rated second to last of all Rutgers team in defensive efficiency (only ahead of the last Eddie Jordan team). Strategy must be to focus on fixing the defense.
I’d then be content with using the other 5M to retain Tariq, Buchanan, Mark, either Ogbole or Dortch to play back up center, and whoever else Pike can afford to pay in that price range in addition to the 2 frosh. Then pick up bodies at the end to fill out 12 spots.
Noteworthy - this is Rutgers second best offensive efficiency rating in the entire history of KenPom (Aaron reported that on his podcast). Dylan/Ace team of course was the best. This team also rated second to last of all Rutgers team in defensive efficiency (only ahead of the last Eddie Jordan team). Strategy must be to focus on fixing the defense.
Think continuity is part of the fix for the defense. The more guys we bring back, think it’ll give us a good foundation.
More noteworthy - this Rutgers offense is #141 best offensive efficiency rating in KenPom.
More more noteworthy - this Rutgers offense is last in offensive efficiency rating in the B10 in KenPom.
Strategy must be to focus on fixing both.
Yes - and that’s 3rd best ranked of all 10 Pike coached teams we’ve had. He’s back. That’s already a given. So knowing that, the far and away best way to improve is to build on the offense we have. Not start over.
Can’t spend money on everything. Pike couldn’t even field a top 50 ranked offense with Dylan and Ace on the roster. Have to fix the historically poor D and hope the offense improves via player development, offensive rebounding and converting more defense to offense.
Yes - in the backcourt for sure. Every one of the guards has improved notably from the beginning of the season (except J Mike but he wasn’t a problem on D to begin with - he’s kind of status quo). At this point - I’d sign on the dotted line to keep the guards mostly intact and focus on upgrading the frontcourt.
The frontcourt D cannot be fixed with what we currently have on the roster. It can only be described as a black hole except Buchanan who is basically covering 3 positions at once back and forth. I think it’s time for Dylan Grant to move on and don’t think we lose that much on offense from this. His D just isn’t good enough. The rest of the pack play only 10-18 min and don’t score so whether they stay on as back ups it won’t impact the offense much at all.
Dortch Grant Big E and Jmike need to go. We need a couple of tall guards...like one to be Powers. Jmike ain't tall.
No one on the roster is a must keep!
Francis the obvious offensive player. On a good team is a 6/7 man so we could offer him 500k.
We need to use the bulk to get 3 starters.
Center
PF
PG
Utilize the leftover on some of the freshman or identify other portal targets to fill out the roster.
Yes they have gotten better but still another year away from being difference makers
Francis the obvious offensive player. On a good team is a 6/7 man so we could offer him 500k.
We need to use the bulk to get 3 starters.
Center
PF
PG
Utilize the leftover on some of the freshman or identify other portal targets to fill out the roster.
Yes they have gotten better but still another year away from being difference makers