Do we want the winning coach or losing coach? If Elko loses, booooo on him. If Drink wins, Missouri may lock him up immediately.MIZZOU.plays a&m today. Drunkwitz vs. Elmo. Difficult decision for Kraft today. Does he attend our game to put the moves on Ciggie or does he head to MIZZOU.
New coach
- Thread starter NOYDB
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If Mizzou can consistently run the football leading to scoring then they have an opportunity. Then, Mizzou must find a way to limit A&M QB Reed; if not this could be over quickly.
A & M is one of the most penalized teams in the country. They average nearly 8 penalties per game. That is going to bite them at some point. Missouri is very good at just under 4 penalties per game.
College Football Stats - College FB Team Penalties per Game | TeamRankings.com
College Football penalties per game, by team.
www.teamrankings.com
Could this be that day? Upsets happen and it would be Mizzou with them playing Zollers @ QB, who replaced the injured Pribula. How Mizzou is able to give Zollers less risky opportunities is also a key beyond their strong running game.A & M is one of the most penalized teams in the country. They average nearly 8 penalties per game. That is going to bite them at some point. Missouri is very good at just under 4 penalties per game.
College Football Stats - College FB Team Penalties per Game | TeamRankings.com
College Football penalties per game, by team.
Missouri will be demolished. They’re down to their third string, freshman quarterback.
I thought the same exact thing. He’s right, Franklin did put us top 8 for a decade.
But then that whole point nullifies the “Penn State is living in a Golden Age that doesn’t exist anymore” line of thinking.
Unless one thinks that James Franklin is the second coming of Lombardi, I can’t understand why some think we’re just so far removed from being annual contenders with a good hire. Last guy was average and the program was top 7-8.
So average coaches win 10 games a year and put their teams in the top 7-8 annually? Interesting perspective. So, does that mean there must be about 124 below average coaches in CFB? I don’t think Franklin was great. He had a lot of faults, but he put PSU back in the conversation every year after crippling sanctions. People need to put aside their bias against him and look at the numbers.
No bias here.
Average coaches have seasons where they’re top 10 at some point and finish with losing records, or finish 7-6 after falling off a cliff.
Average coaches make Micah Parsons wait 12 games to start out of “loyalty” to Koa Farmer. Franklin got I believe 16 college starts out of Micah.
Average coaches call zone read on 4th 6 against Ohio State, or power read with Drew Allar at UCLA. Or hire coordinators who would.
Average coaches declare a year to be their most talented team with the best staff they’ve ever had then start 3-3 including a loss to a team without coaches.
Could go on. If any other school’s coach did these things, you Franklin homers would laugh and insist we’d never want to hire them. But you excuse it for Franklin.
124 worse? No. I don’t look at records of coaches, I watch games and judge decisions made. Franklin is average. Just a guy. Lots of them.
Yup. No bias. lol.
Ho many games did Joe make LaVar wait? Kerry Collins? Darryl Clark? MRob?
Do average coaches call the goal line calls against Bama in the 79 Sugar Bowl?
Do average coaches let nepotism torpedo their program? Or stay too long and drag the program down?
Nobody thinks Joe was an average coach but he let all those things happen. Bad examples on your part if you were/are a Paterno loyalist. If any other coach did that, you would laugh and never want to hire him, but you excuse it for Joe.
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I don’t know about those guys. I was here for James Franklin discussion, and could dig that up, not get into straw man arguments over Joe Paterno.
We can start an “old coach” thread if you want to talk about Joe’s shortcomings.
This is actually the illogic loop the never-Frankliners find themselves in ... they complain about everything that happened under him ... his recruiting wasn't up to snuff ... his in-game decision-making wasn't up to snuff ... his hiring of coordinators wasn't up to snuff ... he couldn't develop players ... pretty much, you name it, and a never-Frankliner would bash it.
So how'd he do so well?
Apparently, despite having somewhere from a woefully mediocre, to a historically bad coach who couldn't figure out how to tie his own shoes (we had some turd nugget claiming he doesn't even know football!), the program rebounded to the point where it was a top 10 program.
Magic! The aura of PSU's awesomeness willed itself to win, apparently, DESPITE the foolish incompetence of Franklin.
The reality is, this alleged "golden age" barely existed at all ... it was fleeting ... and it WAS in a much different landscape, wherein roster management could be handled much differently (stockpiling of talent was easier), our recruiting grounds were much more fertile and, generally speaking, just about everything was less developed and competitive. So, getting PSU back to Top 10 status WAS a huge undertaking and a success.
But the Veruca Salts determined this wasn't good enough, and they wanted Nattys NOW! Don't care how, they want it NOW!
And here we are, on our Golden Goose search ... and even that search is taking too long. They want it NOW!
I love you guys that cry strawman and refuse to admit Joe’s shortcomings and redirect the conversation. For the record, I don’t completely disagree with Franklin being let go. I do question the timing of it though and if there was a plan or was it a knee jerk reaction over personalities. I also question some of the fan bases hypocrisy and bias. It’s laughable
I said average. Not foolishly incompetent. Just average. If you need to change words to make a point, you’ve lost the point.
THAT'S your only retort? Picking something out that isn't even at issue and trying to focus on THAT?
First, I took that opportunity to discuss the general grouping of "never Frankliners" and other critics ... it wasn't just about you.
Second, I referenced characterizations ranging from "woefully mediocre, to a historically bad coach" ... so, yes, your "average" characterization would fit right in there at "woefully mediocre."
That’s not what average means to me as a coach though.
I don’t just look at records, though they’re part of the equation.
I am looking at the numbers and I am not seeing top 7/8. Certainly nothing along the lines of "top 8 for a decade". He has 4 years of being unranked, and if you assign a ranking of 25 for each of those seasons, his average is around 15. That is being very generous.
Agree to disagree.
It’s not though.
If that were the case, we can conclude that James Franklin was the worst coach in the Big Ten this year. We know he wasn’t.
Looking at the real numbers of your claim:
Franklin finished in the top 8: 4 of his 12 total years, and 2 of the 6 years in the 20s.
Franklin won 10 games: 5 of his 12 years and 3 of the 6 years in the 20s.
He did not have good years annually.
You neglected to point out Joe won two national championships and the case could be made for 3 more. So there's that. JF was never close to JP!
It's absurd to compare JVP and CJF. Joe coached in the era of college football. James coached in whatever it is today.
Every Franklin discussion will have Paterno pulled into it by one side or the other. Comparing them in some ways then saying you can’t compare them in others.
As far as bias, fans used to absolutely hammer Paterno for some of his decisions and there were lots of years when the calls for him to retire or be fired got pretty loud. It’s not going to take long after our first loss next year under the new coach for there to be calls to fire him. It’s not bias, it’s fans being fans.
As far as bias, fans used to absolutely hammer Paterno for some of his decisions and there were lots of years when the calls for him to retire or be fired got pretty loud. It’s not going to take long after our first loss next year under the new coach for there to be calls to fire him. It’s not bias, it’s fans being fans.
The irony is that the 2 best coaching jobs at Penn State this century were by neither Joe nor James.
I’m not the one who originally posted that. It was a Franklin hater. Reread the thread.
We've all seen it then wanted to burn our eyes out.
MD is a whole other ball of wax when it comes to donor support at this point. At IU new donors are showing up all the time. IU has always had enough money as in more so than MD but it never went to football until now. That's my take anyway.
Look at the bright side, no matter who we hire they should win at least 10 games next year because it’s so easy to win 10 games at Penn State just by wearing a Penn State uniform. So a NC by year two should be the expectation because we’re Penn State and 10 of our opponents are so horrible we just need to show up and they’ll give in.
It’s not a straw man argument, it’s applies to the discussion about Franklin. He gets criticized for being loyal to his guys, but all coaches are and that goes back to Paterno, Bryant, and all the others.
I bring up Paterno to point out the hypocrisy and ignorance of those that crush Franklin for many of the same things Paterno exhibited also. Paterno was by far a better game day coach and was, in his prime, one of the best at preparing a team for a big game. However, he had his faults and many were similar to what Franklin’s are also. Loyalty to certain players, record vs higher ranked opponents etc. On the other hand, they also had many similar good attributes like being a good ambassador for the school, being a proponent of a student-athlete first, developing their players into good young men, etc. Many who bash Franklin here, celebrate Paterno. Paterno is to be celebrated, but I don’t understand the bashing of another human being to make yourself (not you specifically) feel better.
I’m hypothesizing here, but I would guess Paterno would have been loyal to his own guys over raiding the portal also.
I believe that once seeing what's become of CFB, he would have gotten out.
Wait until some here realize that this is going to take a few years to rebuild to where PSU was recently. Will the new coach get a few years to do it or will the Fire Franklin crowd run him out of town also. I hope it doesn’t take long to rebuild but common sense says it will.
Oh absolutely. He also wouldn’t have been a proponent of throwing bags of cash at high school recruits over the guys on his own roster.
Many of these posters are going to learn that 10 wins is not easy to accomplish and they don’t happen just because you have a bigger “name” than many of these teams you’re playing.