Not the year to be looking for a coach
- Thread starter Caliknight
- Start date
Agree with you on Babers, but if you read my post then you see Fuente has delivered on the defensive side of the ball too during his career at Memphis. It's slipped this year because of a lot of losses but at least he's shown it's taken into account.
He was getting better but I don't know how far he would have gotten with Robinson. I don't know what on earth possessed him to hire him as his DC and keep him no less. While I like Rich Rod as a coach and think he can be successful in certain jobs, the defense is a caveat to me just like many other spread coaches.
Look at Dabo, he's not a spread coach but they've used the spread with Morris and now their new OC. However his DC Brent Venables has been steadily increasing their defensive numbers over his time there to the point where they're in the top 10 the last couple years on defense. That's like the ideal situation, I'm willing to settle for top 50-65. If Venables had a little better demeanor, supposedly known to be a hot head, I wouldn't have cooled on his as candidate otherwise I think he'd be good.
I don't disagree with you. I look at it like this, with a guy like Rich Rod you get immediate credibility with recruits and you will have a chance in every game because he's gonna score.
Yes I can see that but my worry would be being a slightly better version of IU (mainly because we probably have access to better recruits). I like the spread and I think it's the way to go and I've said it for some time now BUT I want a guy who will be semi serious about defense and can deliver some mediocre results on that side of the ball. If they show me no record of that, I become wary. It doesn't mean they can't work out but it's a caveat.
Rich Rod may go to Maryland, but I don't think Miami can afford him. They're going to be in the same price range as us - and Rich Rod isn't coming cheap. I bet he gets an interview at South Carolina as well. Because of the disadvantages recruiting and money wise they have against the powers in their division they need to try and balance that our scheme-wise (sound familiar?) and he might be able to do that while recruiting Florida and Georgia athletes.
I think Illinois goes with Fleck because they need a recruiter and a local guy and Fleck checks both of those boxes.
Will be interesting to see what UVA does with their eventual opening. If London from an FCS power hadn't failed so miserably I would have had them looking at Everett Withers the HC at JMU. But his resume is really similar to London and don't think they can do that twice in a row.
Agree with others that I don't think USC hires a young guy again. I actually think Herman will be picky and wouldn't be surprised to see him stay at Houston for another year. USC, I think, will go older and possibly an NFL assistant. They also need to go away from the Carroll tree and get new blood. Del Rio wanted the job badly two years ago but don't think he's leaving the Raiders to save the USC program.
One interesting name for Miami - Holgorsen. He might prefer to recruit and throw all over the ACC instead of .500 season in the Big 12 every year. The Miami talent would shine in his offense and they need some swagger back.
I think Illinois goes with Fleck because they need a recruiter and a local guy and Fleck checks both of those boxes.
Will be interesting to see what UVA does with their eventual opening. If London from an FCS power hadn't failed so miserably I would have had them looking at Everett Withers the HC at JMU. But his resume is really similar to London and don't think they can do that twice in a row.
Agree with others that I don't think USC hires a young guy again. I actually think Herman will be picky and wouldn't be surprised to see him stay at Houston for another year. USC, I think, will go older and possibly an NFL assistant. They also need to go away from the Carroll tree and get new blood. Del Rio wanted the job badly two years ago but don't think he's leaving the Raiders to save the USC program.
One interesting name for Miami - Holgorsen. He might prefer to recruit and throw all over the ACC instead of .500 season in the Big 12 every year. The Miami talent would shine in his offense and they need some swagger back.
Where do you reside as a fan? Do you want to win just enough to go bowling every year? Or do you want to threaten for a B10 title and a trip to a Rose Bowl? I'm trying to be as politically correct as possible but this is not a good job for a HC who can really win at a high level. If the goal is to go bowling every other year then those coaches are a dime a dozen which is why Schiano did well here. If the goal is to threaten for a B10 title and a Rose Bowl, those coaches are very difficult to attract. I think most posters are smart enough to understand that hiring a good head coach is not enough!! The institution will need to embark on a 4-6 year project costing tens of millions and exercising a hands off approach in order for him to win. It's just not happening.
Think Rich Rod only makes about 2 mill per so he's affordable for Miami. He signed a 5 year 9.55 million dollar deal. agree with everything else you said. Holgorson is a nice name. I could see WVU being willing to part ways and he definitely would get another job.
The thing with Rich Rod is probably less his salary and more those MLP shares he gets if he sticks around for awhile. Not sure how much they're worth now, or whether they've gone up or down in value. I think he'd be good for Miami. Also mentioned Holgorsen in the Golden thread. He's done just an okay job at WVU but I think that job became harder since becoming a B12 outpost. So his star might not shine bright but again can see the marriage between his offense and all the speed and talent in Florida.
Like rutgersguy said, I think there's more than just the money in the contract that makes RichRod more expensive. He could get a sweet deal at Maryland and I can see Plank liking him (the way he likes Mike Leach).
I had forgotten about the shares. I'd imagine they are either not worth that much or they figured something out. If they were worth as much as people originally thought he wouldn't be listening to other offers.
I'm not as "up" on Fuente as I should be, so I'll take your word for it. Just saw somewhere that their D stats this year weren't very good.
There was an article in the Chicago Tribune right after Beckman got fired where people close to Fleck stated that he doesn't want the Illinois job, which pretty much improved my opinion of him 1000% (it's still pretty low, though).
The WV fanbase has been trying to get that guy fired for 3 years now. Why on earth would Miami be content to settle for him (unless they strike out on everyone else)?
I'll believe that Fleck doesn't want the Illinois job if he actually turns down an offer. These MAC coaches see their peers - two years ago Pete Lembo was interviewing for P5 openings. Now he's in the middle of a MAC rebuild and people are wondering if he's really that good. If Illinois ends up being Fleck's only interview/offer I'd love to see him turn it down.
They aren't, last time I looked they were ranked over 100 on defense. But during his first 3 years there they started out bad but then the number improved for both scoring and total defense. I think ranked up to #11. I posted the figures in one of the older threads here. They've lost a lot on defense (13 starters/backups) this year and their DC to Mizzou.
This year, his 4th, the offense has gotten up to the top 10 and the defense really fell back like into the 100s.
I found part of my old post and these were Fuente's numbers:
During his 3 year stint as OC TCU's scoring offense ranked (5,4,9) and total offense(7,12,28)
Also during his 3 years as Memphis HC scoring offense ranked (86,110,21) total offense (110, 116, 46)
scoring defense (79, 44, 11) total defense (50, 39, 27). Notice the trend.
I seriously doubt that Illinois will be dumb enough to try and hire another MAC flavor-of-the-month.
Go ahead and compare Fleck's resume side by side with Tim Beckman's, and then tell me what you see. The guy has never come close to winning anything of even remote significance, and I am continually flabbergasted as to why anyone considers him some kind of serious coaching candidate.
Until they hire Houston's staff (for example) and now they are on the market looking for a coach in our price range. Unless they hire from the NFL, all of these high profile jobs are going to trigger a lot of movement.
I don't like Fleck as a coach at all. I can't believe people think he'd be a good candidate for a bigger position. I'm not trying to make a case for him to be a good hire, just that I think he could get hired and if anywhere I think it would be there. He's all style and no substance. Doesn't have a real signature win on his resume, no expertise on either side of the ball, never been a coordinator (does any of this sound familiar to us Rutgers fans?)
My point in the last post was that I don't think he's got the luxury that Fuente and Herman have where they can be picky. Fleck's resume is actually built on recruiting and reputation for being the next good coach, only that he hasn't actually shown to be that good of a football coach - just a good PR guy (with lots of rumors around his out-of-office behavior). If he gets offered a job I think he takes it...was just trying to say I while he may not love the Illinois gig he would take it. And saying 'I don't want that job' in back channels can be a nice way of saying 'give me a call and give me a couple of million reasons to say yes'.
Believe what you want. he was
43-28 (32-15 in conference) at Glenville State
60-26 at WV
31-17 at Arizona
he had zero personal to fit his style when he got to UM. He was trending up having won 3, 5, and 7 games in his time. As you see above, he's won everyone he has coached and won 9 conference championships but he yea, he wouldn't have won at Michigan.
Completely agree. He looks like a carbon copy of ex-Minnesota coach Tim Brewster.
I just hope to hell that somebody hires him before the Iowa job comes open again. In the article that I mentioned, he actually said that he preferred the Iowa job over Illinois. I about puked.
any coach from the MAC who says no to a P5 is a moron. Look at Cristobol.....turned down tow schools and got fired from FIU a year later.
Apples to oranges. Just because you've had success somewhere else doesn't mean you will win anywhere. He was playing his preferred, defense-optional style of football the last couple of years and it was awful. Iowa handed him his lunch both times that they played, without a single player on the roster that Michigan would have even considered worthy of a scholarship offer.
The PAC-12 is perfect for a guy like him. He would (and has) gotten eaten alive in the B1G. Results don't lie.
Many P5 jobs are garbage. A truly good coach knows that he will have plenty of other opportunities down the line. Only the desperate ones jump at any opportunity.
BTW, Cristobal is currently listed everywhere as one of the leading candidates for the Miami job.
A
anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy
Guest
If you're a MAC coach and get a P5 offer with P5 money, you take it for the most part. Getting a guaranteed $8-$10 million is a life changer and that's what a P5 job pays.
Tell that to Pete Lembo - two years ago he was on everyone's list as a great hire for a P5 spot. Clawson got the Wake job and Lembo is still at Ball St. and he and his team look really bad. I don't think MAC guys turn down P5 offers. Guys like Matt Wells, Chris Peterson (for several years at Boise St), Tom Herman, Fuente can all be picky. But early in their career MAC coaches should take any opportunity they can get.
Not if you care about the longterm health of your career. If you have any confidence at all in your ability, you hold out until the right opportunity presents itself.
Not all of these guys want to make a killing for 4 years and then get fired and be disgraced nationally. Some of them actually aspire to be productive coaches for several years and build a legacy.
Shocking, I know.
will have to agree to disagree. he didn't have success "somewhere" he's had it everywhere he has been. He's won 9 conference titles in 3 different conferences. that isn't just dumb luck or coincidence. If given the time to get his QB and athletes of age he would have won.
A
anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy
Guest
I'll go right along with your point here, sir. If you have any confidence at all in your ability after 4 years shouldn't you be running a dominant program?
Do you see what I did there?
Lembo is kind of a weirdo that probably wouldn't do well under the media scrutiny of a major job, anyway. And if he turns things around in Muncie, he'll get plenty of opportunities in the future.
You're argument is just factually incorrect. There have been plenty of high profile coordinators that are frequently mentioned for major jobs, only to turn them down for various reasons. Hell, look at Petersen at Boise State. He was the hot guy to jump for like a decade before he finally did.
Not everyone has the same viewpoint and outlook on life as you do. You might want to consider that for a few minutes sometime. You might learn something.
He's won zero conference titles at the Power 5 level. The Big East was a lower-tier league when he was there. I don't find his overall resume particularly impressive, frankly, and his team isn't very good this year.
A
anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy
Guest
Peterson also was paid like a P5 coach at Boise, so I think you need to take a step back.
And just a little piece of advice. You're new here, we try to have civil conversations on the round table. You are outwardly aggressive and coming at peoples necks. Tone it down a few notches bud.
Sure, if you're offered a "dominant" job.
Illinois, Rutgers, and Maryland do not meet that criteria.
Point 1: False. Petersen was not paid anywhere close to what a B1G coach makes.
Point 2: I know my way around a messageboard and don't need advice on how to handle myself from you. Getting banned on Rivals isn't exactly the end of the world and not something that I spend a lot of time losing sleep over.
I agree with going to an offense that can score with less talent. We will never out recruit OSU, Mich, and likely PSU. Adopting an offensive style that can be effective against better talent is the way to go.
A
anon_0k9zlfz6lz9oy
Guest
Peterson made $2.1 million a year. Again, very comparable with P5 money. You're wrong.
Look, I understand many people here dislike Schiano and I don't know if he'd be the best person for the RU job, but anybody that thinks he's "proven" himself to be a medicore game day coach must think people can NEVER change or learn on the job.
He took a horrible RU program and built it into a respectable one with a couple of great years. When he left for the NFL, he went to a Tampa Bay team that had won 7 games in the two years before him. Yeah, he failed to do very well (going 11-21) but the team went 2-14 the year after him and is 2-4 this year with the #1 QB in the draft leading the team (something Greg never had).
It's been said a million times here before, but Schiano is hardly the first college coach to struggle in the NFL.
Lou Holtz went 3-10
Nick Saban went 15-17 (with a team that was FAR BETTER than Tampa Bay was when Schiano went there. They were basically a borderline playoff team for Saban)
Steve Spurrier went 12-20 ( a whopping one win more than Greg had)
Would you have hired any of these guys after their NFL gig? Because they all had plenty of success afterwards.
Reading comprehension - I specifically said MAC Coaches. If you're going to come here and instigate arguments and be condescending with me and other posters then go do it somewhere else. Consider that for a few minutes, you might learn something.