This almost sounds too good to be true...
OT: Good news for Brandon.
- Thread starter GloryDawg
- Start date
I'm just telling facts. Residential customers will be on the hook for the upgrades to substations and generation plants because Entergy add those costs to the rate base. Why do you think the president of Entergy MS is in an all out propaganda war with the Northside Sun journalist that uncovered this fiasco. Sorry you're to bias too see it.
Because it is. It's propaganda by the people that are wanting to build these things because they are getting a sweetheart electricity deal
no, they won't. There are 35 gigawatts of data centers in northern virginia. again, with all due respect, you're speaking from an ignorant standpoint. Just sit back and enjoy
Did you seriously just try to compare data centers in Virginia to ones in MS? A different state with different laws and different PSC laws. Yeah you really know what you're talking about
The 6 pack could gasificate every data center in a 2000 mile radius
I’m skeptical of these huge power sucks too but I think by now most of us have figured out that @Shmuley has something to do with this line of work. MDA probably
.Seems like someone had laid it all a few months ago when the Murderidian ones were announced.
I don't think Brandon is service by Entergy anymore. There are two, Delta Utilites (not sure if they merge or one bought the other) and Southern Pine. I don't know which company service that part of Brandon. I'll say this Entergy might service that part of Brandon. I am service by Delta and I live in East Brandon.
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Delta Utilities is natural gas, brah.
Entergy has a significant amount of certificated area within the Brandon city limits, including the area where this data center is located. Entergy has agreed to supply the power for phase 1.
6 Pack: Where engineers go to fight! The Sonic of message boards!
I am getting message from Entergy that they will become Delta. Now I had Center Point gas and Entergy electric. Delta took over Center Point and the message from Entergy might be a generic message they are putting out. You probably correct but Entergy should do a better job of educating dumbasses like me.
Edited to say. I just went and read the entire message and yes, they are specifying gas only.
That guy needs to focus on sodding his own yard first.
Just out of curiosity, why would a company pay 75M to the County? What is that fee?
There are laws that allow for abatement of ad galore taxes for new investment. Once you reach a certain size investment, they can just negotiate a fee to pay in lieu of ad valorem taxes. There are some minimum requirements to make sure schools get there’s and that the counties don’t give away everything competing for investment. Lots of counties also have policies that they won’t abate say road and bridge portions of ad valors because new investment generally puts new stress on infrastructure.
Seems like there's a lot of pre-shitting going on in this thread. 
Where does the water go when they are done with it ? Does it dump back out into the river or evaporate into the atmosphere or what ?
They will never be able to support electric cars in Brandon now!
This man knows what he speaks of. The "fee-in-lieu" of ad valorem taxes is pre-negotiated between the state of MS, the county, and the company. The revenue is split three ways between the state, county/city, and school district where the development physically sits. It's generally lower than what the ad valorem taxes would be, but it guarantees a set revenue stream for the government entities and the company also knows their taxes won't increase for whatever the term of the agreement is for. It's based on the value of the property, building, and equipment inside the building. Data centers are different from most industrial developments in that the value of the equipment inside it stays high. They replace the servers about every five years. Whereas, with an industrial development the fee-in-lieu would start high and tail off as the development ages. You don't see that tailing off with data centers. The revenue stays high. That will give your communities steady revenue for a long time and revenue to really transform communities.
Pretty sure that guy is a Barksdale/Scruggs plant. "Papa Mississippi." Come on.
I've heard a tiny bit about the water issues, but I have to admit I'm a bit ignorant on the subject. What is the issue? Why do they negatively affect water sources/supply? I know they have huge chiller farms and other water cooled systems, but I assumed those were all closed loop systems. I'm probably missing the obvious, but I just haven't really thought about it that much.
I dunno. I’ve heard for decades from the “Drill Here, Drill Now” crowd that it’s “basic Econ 101 supply & demand” that producing more oil would help keep the price of oil down.
Now, if we apply that same “supply & demand” principle to the ENORMOUS amount of energy and water that’s going to be demanded by these data centers, then it stands to reason that the price of water and electricity for everybody that uses the same supply will go up.
If the company and/or the state are taking steps to mitigate/eliminate the impact to local residents, then that’s great, they SHOULD be doing that. I don’t think raising water and electrical consumption as legitimate concerns is some kind of political “gotcha”, regardless of your affiliation.
Also, if Tate and the MDA wanted to do something really impressive, they would get a major corporation to relocate its headquarters to Mississippi. I don’t mean some little 100 job operation either. I mean a legit “thousands of jobs” corporate headquarters.
Now, if we apply that same “supply & demand” principle to the ENORMOUS amount of energy and water that’s going to be demanded by these data centers, then it stands to reason that the price of water and electricity for everybody that uses the same supply will go up.
If the company and/or the state are taking steps to mitigate/eliminate the impact to local residents, then that’s great, they SHOULD be doing that. I don’t think raising water and electrical consumption as legitimate concerns is some kind of political “gotcha”, regardless of your affiliation.
Also, if Tate and the MDA wanted to do something really impressive, they would get a major corporation to relocate its headquarters to Mississippi. I don’t mean some little 100 job operation either. I mean a legit “thousands of jobs” corporate headquarters.
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"Sorry you're to bias too see it."
This is the guy I'll choose to believe here. LOL
He's not even from the state - I think he's from like Pennsylvania or something, but lives here now. He may be a paid shill, but I actually like most of his videos, which promote Mississippi socially. He seems super high on the state and puts cool info out that tends to give us good press. Which is what makes this one so out of the blue to me.
I get being concerned about environmental impact and all that crap - see my comment about AWS and their water system - but instead of seeing this as an overall postive thing with some "but let's figure this part out" caveats... this particular video of his seemed surprisingly negative and political (to me).
By the way, allow me one diatribe here before I get scolded by the NIMBYs... my opinion about this project is like almost all economic development projects -- at least they are doing something to help us build up the state. Some out of state company wants to build something here, pay taxes or in-lieu fees, create jobs for Mississippians, build up our school and infrastructure coiffers? YES PLEASE. Do we need to do things to make sure the state is protected financially, and environmentally? Absolutely. Let's figure those things out for sure.
If they need more power, let's build it. That's even more construction jobs, more electrical engineers, more service techs that have jobs in the future too. If they need more water, figure it out like AWS did. Not only are they using a currently non-potable water source, but I think I read by 2030 or 2040, their system will be completely self-sustaining, so they won't need more at that point and may even have a surplus of clean (at that point potable) water that could help supply the community. THAT's what we need to be doing. THAT's how humans evolve in a technologically advancing society. We don't just shut everything down immediately and say "No thank you, we don't want your growth, money, and jobs here. We're fine with the status quo here in good ol' Missipp."
I'm with you. I watched and liked his videos for a while.
He started out just promoting Mississippi, but recently the videos have become more and more political. And this bashing of the data center is par for the course. Bashing economic development is all the rage in certain circles.
All of the negatives brought up here are addressed, and they seem to be just copy and paste from mad lefty's in other areas.
I think a lot of it is closed loop, but with evaporation and maybe just ever-increasing demand, they have traditionally needed a large supply of water. But that's getting better. AWS as I referenced above, recognized the problem and is doing things to help. They're using wastewater where available, so that's a good answer. Using water that is non-drinkable to cool their data centers. They are recycling and re-using water more than ever as well - they have an initiative trying to get to water-neutral, fully self-sustained systems across their network of data centers by 2030.
I'm assuming other companies will follow suit.
I guess with Hugh Freeze in Alabama now, somebody has to do something to support the local coiffers.
^^^ This. Closed system with recirculation. The impact on the local water supply is manageable.
I started to just say 'no ****, Sherlock' but in all seriousness... Do people who are against the Brandon data center (as an example) think it's more likely that Tate and the MDA would have more success in the future recruiting a corporation to move their HQ here by
(a) welcoming smaller projects like this and showing that Mississippi can solve any challenges that come up, in effect hanging a sign that says "Open for Business";
or
(b) by shutting down all the data center offers because it's too hard, or "not enough jobs" or "we don't have enough power" or "they might use all our water"?
There's a clear and obvious answer here.
I did a little research, and, yes, that's right. I was surprised at first to learn that they generally used water cooling instead of air cooling, but I learned that air cooling actually uses more water in many instances because air cooling at that scale requires so much more power consumption at the data center that the power plants have to ramp up generation significantly. The extra power consumption uses more water at the power plant than the data center would by just going with water-cooled towers.
So, yes, it's a real issue. They generally need to use drinking water, with added chemicals, for their processes to prevent corrosion and other maintenance issues. So that's two problems - they use the drinking water, and they can't dump back into it because of all the added chemicals.
Some places, like Sweden, have started pumping the data center's waste water back to the power plant for use there. And like you said, AWS (along with I think Google and Meta) have pledged to be "water positive" by 2030. Not sure I believe they'll achieve it, but at least they're working towards it.
In summary, I agree it's a legitimate concern, and the folks around Jackson, Madison, Brandon, etc. should all be asking questions about how/if their drinking water is being protected. Hopefully the Pearl River can be used in some way, without damaging it either.
Here's the article I was referencing. AWS is using the Big Black River.
AWS Water supply system in Canton
Cooling and power generation seem to be the culprit. Stats are that medium-sized data centers can use 110 million gallons per year, comparable to the needs of 1,000 households. I've seen a stat that equated a 100 word AI prompt for information to a use of 500mL of water. I suspect that technology will help solve this, possibly in the form of these small nuclear reactors using molten salt. Very likely is that if it truly becomes a problem, we will see restrictions placed on their use of water (I suspect their cheapest form of cooling) and possibly force them into higher cost solutions. Without a doubt those solutions will have some kind of negative impact somewhere whether known or unintended...
I have no idea how it might impact my energy costs, but I do know that if we flipped the on switch at the Amazon data centers in Madison today, they would consume 60% of all the power that Entergy generates. Post Entergy upgrades to support these data centers, they will still consume 40% of all power generation by Entergy.