Appointing supers was a massive mistake. It's just a political game the people have little say in now.
OT: Inflation
- Thread starter Jeffreauxdawg
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We felt that it was a hinderance to Mississippi. You had superintendents that had zero education experience running for election because it was a high paying job.
In hindsight, the good ol boy system is just as bad. Madison County hired a finalist for the state Superintendent of Alabama as their first unelected Superintendent. She was amazing and had great ideas to make Madison better. Didn't last a year. Too much change. She expected results. Couldn't handle it after years of just getting by on having more ed-focused parents in the district than other districts.
When considering how much easier it is for the kids to make high grades, it’s amazing how many are held back voluntarily by their parents for sports. The kids repeating classes must be bored out of their damn minds. And we know this is for daddy and mommy to have a chance to see little Johnny start on the football or baseball team.
The middle school sent a text message announcement to all parents last month that reminded everyone of “the last day to voluntarily hold back children with passing grades.”
The middle school sent a text message announcement to all parents last month that reminded everyone of “the last day to voluntarily hold back children with passing grades.”
A former long time elected Superintendent of Ed for Rankin County was on the board of supervisors before he figured out there was more money to be made in education. Nice guy, not who I'd want running one of the biggest school district's in the 'Sip, though. Appointed/elected, it's a crapshoot either way.
Joking, Memphis just fired their superintendent because she was attempting to change the failing schools. She lasted less than a year.
Then they quietly and indescribably took a knee and left the awards at the podium and moved to the beach
There should be requirements. We had a situation where a super was voted out by the voters. The guy who won, ended up having to resign mid-term. The sorry school board brought back the guy who was voted out. You can't have that kind of stuff going on. It's so bad! MS took voters out of the equations and school districts have suffered.
Fair question, and I freely admit some of these are pie in the sky.
1. Parents suck. I can’t believe some of the conversations my wife has with these people. You can’t even imply that their kid could possibly at fault for anything. Not sure how you’d fix this, but they have far too much leeway when it comes to their behavior, let alone their kids.
2. The comments about passing a kid no matter what are 100% accurate, and worse than you can imagine.
3. They absolutely teach kids to pass the standardized tests. Period.
4. The school year is FAR too long and inefficient. Starting in July is asinine. There are SO many breaks and service days and holidays… so much wasted time and money.
5. Don’t get me started on moving the grade scale.
6. After being in the workforce for nearly 30 years, I’m convinced more than ever that Home Ec and basic financial management classes need to be mandatory for both genders.
7. Tech-based curriculum needs to be offered as early as possible and treated as just as valuable/important as traditional curriculum. We’ve made tremendous strides in this area in my lifetime.
8. Consolidation of the absurd number of districts and reinvestment of the resulting savings back into the districts. This will never happen. Ever. But it should.
9. Having attended a rural school myself, I’m an absolute believer in taking some of the funding from these bigger districts (of which my kids were a part) and making sure that some of these smaller schools are at least above third world standards. Sounds like communism, and I get it….but if you can’t get on board with making sure a kid in Delta Town, MS has a decent cafeteria and working utilities then we aren’t concerned with the same things. This, of course, would invite corruption, but we already have that. See point number 8.
There are many more.
I’m not naive, and I’m no idiot. I know why things are the way they are…..but they don’t have to stay that way. I hate that the only thing holding back Mississippi is Mississippi.
These are my thoughts alone, but they are valid and based in logic.
Plus I made a 34 on the English section of the ACT, so….
Yep, agree, and some kids just don’t have a lick of home training. We’ve made strides here in my lifetime but plenty work left to do.
My sense is nobody anywhere in the system has any incentive to hold them back? Agree this is not good. We can’t punish schools our way out of our society just having some people who aren’t capable (for whatever reasons) of learning enough to pass.
Like 2, this is mostly incentivized by pretty much everyone I think? And not being pedantic but what’s the alternative? Un-standardized? And I’m not just justifying the status quo; these kids can’t read good.
I tend to agree. I do know there is some evidence the longer calendar prevents learning loss. I’m not sure how you control for some of those intrinsic qualities a kid gets from a good long summer.
I don’t know much about this one. Sounds like this is where some of the major grade inflation is coming from?
I’d throw in basic home/auto repairs as well.
I also think these computers are going to eventually catch on*
The number of counties with 3+ districts and a seg academy is absurd
I’m all for equal,adequate funding. Way too many aren’t.
Too bad you didn’t drive a Pontiac, you could’ve aced the whole thing
What’s new is the percentage of students doing it. The result is the kids that aren’t holding back for sports are starting to hold back so that they aren’t the youngest in the class.
back to the original topic: I wonder if some of the higher grades are a result of kids being a year older and with an extra year of instruction thrown in even though they didn’t need it.
That was my grading scale in highschool too
95-100 A
86-94 B
76-85 C
70-75 D
Below 70 F
You know how many 91-94 grade averages I had? A bunch. My GPA would have been significantly higher than it was. My friends that were in public school were on ten point scale. It pissed me off.
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Because MuH eLoN sAiD sO
I have my own views on school as you know, but I can assure you, the side that wants to cut the DoE most likely possesses the least amount of facts and evidence in this particular debate. It's very evident in this very thread.
You can make a case for each side of this. Saying one over the other is a “massive mistake” is purely situational.
The most ridiculous thing that has ever been created in schools is the concept of a floor grade. If your school district has a floor grade, there is a 100% chance that it is a bad school district and you need to get your kids out of it.
Floor grades work like this: The lowest grade a kid can receive on any assignment is a 50. Don't turn anything in - 50. Bomb a test - 50. This results in kids like the one in Tennessee that is suing his school district in having a 3.4 GPA and not being able to read.
There are most definitely others, but Jackson Public Schools has this policy in MIssissippi. And you can gain admission to any university with a 3.2 GPA (ACT not required if you have a 3.2), so you have a ton of kids choosing Mississippi State that aren't ready for college, and Keenum gives them free tuition and they flunk out - hurting our graduation rate and academic perception and our US News ranking.
Floor grades work like this: The lowest grade a kid can receive on any assignment is a 50. Don't turn anything in - 50. Bomb a test - 50. This results in kids like the one in Tennessee that is suing his school district in having a 3.4 GPA and not being able to read.
There are most definitely others, but Jackson Public Schools has this policy in MIssissippi. And you can gain admission to any university with a 3.2 GPA (ACT not required if you have a 3.2), so you have a ton of kids choosing Mississippi State that aren't ready for college, and Keenum gives them free tuition and they flunk out - hurting our graduation rate and academic perception and our US News ranking.
Crap shoot, but electing limits your pool to people within the district. That is a crazy way to approach what should be the hire of a high level executive.
Would you rather have a say in it or not? That's where I'd fall in this all. I want a say in who is overseeing our education. It cuts my vote from a board member and super to just one board member. I don't want government choosing a damn thing for me, give me the option. Simply put standard requirements for running for the office in every district then let us vote.
As for schools, start burning asses and booting troubled kids and parents. Tell their asses they can teach their own kids if they can't handle them. It's time to stop letting those kids 17 up everything for the rest of the kids. Maybe throw them into a fast track vocational program and send the to the work force when they hit the work age. But if they open up school choice, lots of schools will shut down in rural MS IMO, and honestly they should be.
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Edit: Never mind, I've got time today:
The present study investigates the incremental validity of the traditional books-at-home measure and selected extensions (i.e., number of children’s books and number of ebooks) for explaining students’ academic achievement as measured by their academic language comprehension. Using multiple linear regressions, we additionally explore the role of the source of information (i.e., whether information is given by parents or children). Based on cross-sectional data of a German sample of 2353 elementary school children from Grades 2 through 4, we found that parents’ information on the number of books and children’s books contributed to students’ academic language comprehension over and above parental occupation and education. Children’s information on the number of books did not further increase the amount of explained variance, and the effects were smaller than those for parents’ information. Yet, when investigated separately, both parents’ and children’s information on the number of books and children’s books at home predicted students’ academic language comprehension and mediated the relationship between more distal structural features of socioeconomic status (i.e., parents’ occupational status and education) and the outcome variable. No effect emerged for the number of ebooks. Our findings point to the robustness of the traditional books-at-home measure when used in parent questionnaires.
Number of books at home as an indicator of socioeconomic status: Examining its extensions and their incremental validity for academic achievement - Social Psychology of Education
The present study investigates the incremental validity of the traditional books-at-home measure and selected extensions (i.e., number of children’s books and number of ebooks) for explaining students’ academic achievement as measured by their academic language comprehension. Using multiple...link.springer.com
Just skimming over it, it doesn't make the mistake we're talking about or even try to account for it. The explicitly provide that the number of books is a proxy for something like SES that is a better predictor of reading ability than traditional measures of SES like income, education, and occupation. There's no magic thinking of just having books around will make kids better at reading, even if nobody reads them.
They also at least make a head nod to the problem of trying to distinguish between the effects from variables correlated with having more books and the reverse causality that you might find trying to associate the presence of books with increased learning.
They do provide that the number of children's books, not just the books overall provides a slightly better predictor, but of course without distinguishing how the books got there (i.e., were given versus the parents procuring), they are not trying to distinguish between the effect of having the type of invested parents that go out and specifically procure children's books versus the effect of just the presence of books. But again, they are explicitly recognizing number of books as a proxy for something, not trying to argue that the nubmer of books is the actual cause of increased learning.
This makes perfect sense. Politicians are held in such high regard and for such very good reasons, of course we want our school districts run by politicians. Just need to start having elections for head of all the state agencies too. Why are we leaving the possibility for these roles to be filled by professionals instead of politicians?
If they open up school choice, a lot of these arguments will go away. There will be some different ones in their place, but they won't be as contentious because most people won't be stuck with the bad decisions of politicians.
Man, you are more optimistic than me. There are a lot of people that are emotionally invested in government run schools, and there is no amount of logic that can convince them that putting more control in the people most concerned with the outcome is reasonable. They would rather untold decades of poor children be left without access to a decent education than even consider the idea on its merits.
I think its about to be a snowball that can't be stopped. Trump is going to push it from the federal level and Mississippi is the only red state not on board.
A large majority of people are excited about how AI can help further the goal of individual medical treatment thus improving the health of all.
How many of those same people would support AI to further education by providing individual tailored education thus improving education for all albeit at different individual paces?
How many of those same people would support AI to further education by providing individual tailored education thus improving education for all albeit at different individual paces?
Hayul Yayuh Mayun! Fugggg em!!!11
The whole purpose of public schools is to provide a baseline level of education to the masses, and prep them for the workforce. Period. You can't kick out the crappy kids......it's literally FOR the crappy kids. The sooner you internalize that, the better your understanding of the situation will be.
I'm not talking about the lowest of the low, the gangsters and total morons, so don't twist my words. That's the reason we have alternative school and...well, jail. That element doesn't belong in any level of society. Half the time they've dropped out of school anyway.
On the topic of school choice, my state's Legislature decided 2 years ago to allow out of district enrollment for any reason at any time of the year.
This has, quite predictably, created some serious frustrations for districts that are struggling AND districts that are appealing.
Not knowing how much money you will have as a district for the next year, since there is no longer a cutoff date for open enrolling, has caused some funding struggles on both ends.
But that struggle aside, it has been interesting to see heatmaps of where within a district students are open enrolling into and out of a certain district. Not surprisingly, its on the border of a district, but it isnt the entire border for the largest district(which is urban too). Its only some parts of the border and only a select few suburb districts are 'benefitting'.
One thing that was then implemented after last year's Legislative session is that 'chronic absenteeism' can be considered as a reason to kick open enrollment kids out of the district they enroll into.
The Legislature set penalties to districts that have too high of a chronic absenteeism rate, so districts can now kick open enroll students out who are absent too much, in order to help keep their rate from being too high.
Just mentioning a reality of open enrollment when its been paired to a chronic absenteeism initiative.
The funny thing to me is that the state's Dept of Ed refuses to give guidance to districts on...well really anything(seriously, that isnt an exaggeration), so districts are currently reporting absenteeism in multiple ways.
Classic example of Garbage In Garbage Out.
This has, quite predictably, created some serious frustrations for districts that are struggling AND districts that are appealing.
Not knowing how much money you will have as a district for the next year, since there is no longer a cutoff date for open enrolling, has caused some funding struggles on both ends.
But that struggle aside, it has been interesting to see heatmaps of where within a district students are open enrolling into and out of a certain district. Not surprisingly, its on the border of a district, but it isnt the entire border for the largest district(which is urban too). Its only some parts of the border and only a select few suburb districts are 'benefitting'.
One thing that was then implemented after last year's Legislative session is that 'chronic absenteeism' can be considered as a reason to kick open enrollment kids out of the district they enroll into.
The Legislature set penalties to districts that have too high of a chronic absenteeism rate, so districts can now kick open enroll students out who are absent too much, in order to help keep their rate from being too high.
Just mentioning a reality of open enrollment when its been paired to a chronic absenteeism initiative.
The funny thing to me is that the state's Dept of Ed refuses to give guidance to districts on...well really anything(seriously, that isnt an exaggeration), so districts are currently reporting absenteeism in multiple ways.
Classic example of Garbage In Garbage Out.
Well, Mississippi misses the mark on a number of things when it comes to this topic. First....the like post I just responded to, they don't understand why public schools truly exist, and two, like many places, property value basically is based on your school district, but in Mississippi, it matters even more to people. Why, well, obvious reasons, status, etc.
Not sure why Dems don't like it. I get why they don't like vouchers, that's a simple issue. But again school choice really is just a futile effort in my mind, that creates the illusion that a certain school is 'good', when schools are only as good as their students.
It's infuriating.
Morons: "we need better leadership, our children are dumb"
Leader: "we should do A, B, and C and be held accountable by measuring 1, 2, and 3"
Morons: "No, no, no. Too far. You're fired"
Her biggest crime was telling the glut of “administrators” sitting at the school system office doing nothing that were going to have to go sit in an actual school, but still do basically nothing. What a bit*h!
Now that well-off parents of school-aged kids have figured out they can legislate rebates for their private school tuition under the guise that they are doing it for the kids that truly have no good school choices, this train isn't stopping. That's what it feels like here in TN at least.
What do you think the system looks like when more states or the federal government get behind a vouchering system? Not arguing there aren't systematic issues that need to be fixed in public, but we seem to be headed towards a chaotic environment where public entities will be defunded to pay for subsidies to attend private. And most of those dollars will simply inflate private costs for parents of students already there and not achieve the goal of enabling kids in bad school districts to choose a better alternative IMO based on how its working out in states that have adopted already.
I'm not sure I've heard any articulated vision of what the education system is meant to look like after throwing public dollars onto a private market. Does it "fix" anything or just move problems around and different groups of people controlling tax dollars?
Sure you can. It's time to stop letting the thugs control and destroy schools. This was never meant to be a baby sitting job. Tell those parents to find another damn school if there's school choice coming. The kids that get tired of it are going to absolutely leave those sorry schools and collapse said schools if they don't. So when it's a trouble kid, fast track their asses vocationally and have them out fast. If they aren't straight by working age, they won't be.
The one size fits all approach to education is a sorry, lazy, cheap way of educating anyway.
that’s what this feels like to me as well. I’m giving the benefit of the doubt that this school choice idea started with good intentions from parents upset about the decisions of terrible administrators (Memphis), but I don’t think it ends in a good place. But hey, this will allow the private schools to raise their tuition by the price of the tax credit. Win win.
Right. We can't make a perfect world, but I'm in no way opposed to the idea of giving folks without any choices (usually that means they are poor or live in moronsville) more options to weigh. That should be a bipartisan value.
While it was sold as a program to achieve the above, the voucher income cutoff for a family of 4 is something like $170k. Get the 17 out of here - that's a money grab for folks that don't need it and nothing more.
40 years ago, we had roughly 10% get 3.5 or higher. And that is with "weighted" classes (pretty new stuff at the time) where A's were worth 5 pts, B's 4...... there were only a few of those classes but they still helps some.
We also had roughly 10% that got Certificates of Attendance instead of a diploma at their graduation ceremony.
I 100% agree with this. But you're not going to get your desired outcome through a system that was not designed for what you want.