OT: NY Rangers 2023-2024 Thread

[zappaa]

The Rangers have only given up one goal in the last three games when Trouba was not on the ice. Our first line doesn’t give us fourth line scoring at 5v5 and is now becoming a liability on defense.

The “depth” part of this team is actually playing pretty well. The guys we are paying a ton of money to for them to be difference makers are mostly the ones who are shitting the bed.

Hard to score playing in your own end for 40 minutes of the game.

We’re back to strategy and schemes again, “they come hard and we know it” should be resulting in multiple odd man rushes by us, that’s what quells their “coming hard”
They can’t be in two places at once, it’s unbelievable to me Lav ALLOWS his team to sag and retreat…. Unbelievable.

 

[krup]

Hard to score playing in your own end for 40 minutes of the game.

We’re back to strategy and schemes again, “they come hard and we know it” should be resulting in multiple odd man rushes by us, that’s what quells their “coming hard”
They can’t be in two places at once, it’s unbelievable to me Lav ALLOWS his team to sag and retreat…. Unbelievable.

“should be resulting in multiple odd man rushes by us”, if we had more defensemen who could move the puck.

This series is perfect example of how people’s thinking is flawed about defensemen. Most Ranger fans look at Florida’s pressure in our zone and say “we can’t play Jones, he is so small he couldn’t handle that physicality”.

Yes, when Florida was dominating in the Rangers’ zone Jones wouldn’t be the guy you want in front of the net. However, his ability to move the puck means a lot if these times that Florida dominates in the Rangers zone wouldn’t happen and (as you mentioned) probably lead to Ranger rushes the other way.

With Fox obviously hurt, Schneider was the only guy at 5v5 doing anything to get the puck forward.

 

[KK1827]

Laf is not a superstar. He’s having a terrific playoff however a 57 point season this year ( his highest to date in 4 seasons) is far from anointing someone a superstar.

You have to realize hes not on pp1. If he was on pp1 he’d be a point per game player at age 22. Now youll respond, if he was a superstar hed be on pp1. To which id say, the rangers arent going to break up the #1 ranked pp in the nhl.

Am I saying hes better than mcdavid? Hell no. But wanna know a fact? Laff had more even strength goals than mcdavid this year. In fact laff was 15th in the nhl at even strength goals. Its good to compare apples to apples.

 

[zappaa]

“should be resulting in multiple odd man rushes by us”, if we had more defensemen who could move the puck.

This series is perfect example of how people’s thinking is flawed about defensemen. Most Ranger fans look at Florida’s pressure in our zone and say “we can’t play Jones, he is so small he couldn’t handle that physicality”.

Yes, when Florida was dominating in the Rangers’ zone Jones wouldn’t be the guy you want in front of the net. However, his ability to move the puck means a lot if these times that Florida dominates in the Rangers zone wouldn’t happen and (as you mentioned) probably lead to Ranger rushes the other way.

With Fox obviously hurt, Schneider was the only guy at 5v5 doing anything to get the puck forward.

Every defensemen we have not named Truba are excellent puck movers.
Give K’Andre the support the Panthers give their D men and he’d be unstoppable.
As good a puck mover as Jones is he’d be completely stiffed and stone walled, he would have no outlets and no place to go.
Exactly the same way Panarin is stone walled
Truba would be a friggen animal on Florida

 

[krup]

Every defensemen we have not named Truba are excellent puck movers.
Give K’Andre the support the Panthers give their D men and he’d be unstoppable.
As good a puck mover as Jones is he’d be completely stiffed and stone walled, he would have no outlets and no place to go.

Jones puck handling ability means he isn’t as dependent on the “outlets” as much as some of the other defensemen.

And, and far as physicality, an overmatched Jones in front of the net is still more effective defensively than Trouba making his inexplicable decisions to vacate the net front and chase somebody around.

 

[zappaa]

Jones puck handling ability means he isn’t as dependent on the “outlets” as much as some of the other defensemen.

And, and far as physicality, an overmatched Jones in front of the net is still more effective defensively than Trouba making his inexplicable decisions to vacate the net front and chase somebody around.

Jones is not skating out of our end under the duress and pressure the Panthers are applying…. Not happening.
Where he’d make an impact is stepping up in the neutral zone to intercept passes and slow down speed, he also a good pincher in my opinion.
Truba does nothing but sag and backup.

 

[RU Cheese]

Jones is not skating out of our end under the duress and pressure the Panthers are applying…. Not happening.
Where he’d make an impact is stepping up in the neutral zone to intercept passes and slow down speed, he also a good pincher in my opinion.
Truba does nothing but sag and backup.

That's the thing - I don't think Florida is creating more pressure or limiting time/space to the same degree that Carolina did. I think the physical aspect is certainly in defenseman's heads (same concept everyone uses to support Rempe being in the lineup) and there isn't nearby puck support.

I would dress Jones as seventh defensemen (or scratch Gus). I also have no idea why Miller and Trouba continue to play together.

I don't know how many more "Trouba has been on the ice for X out of the last X+Y" posts from Krup I can handle

 

[krup]

Jones is not skating out of our end under the duress and pressure the Panthers are applying…. Not happening.
Where he’d make an impact is stepping up in the neutral zone to intercept passes and slow down speed, he also a good pincher in my opinion.
Truba does nothing but sag and backup.

Jones doesn’t have to skate it out of our end.

Watch how they forecheck Fox compared to Trouba or Lindgren. They can’t commit the same way against a guy who can evade the first forechecker as they can against our defensemen whose only play is to wrap the puck around the boards to the other side.

 

[krup]

I will lay off the Rangers for a minute to make an observation.

He may be considered a star and have won the Selke as best defensive player, but Barkov is STILL underrated. To be that skilled offensively and that good defensively is almost cheating.

 

[zappaa]

I get texts all game long from friends who are Rangers fans.
“I can’t take the stress”
“How exciting”
My experience has me watching from a completely different viewpoint.
I’m bored by our inability to mount a sustained offensive, I’m bored watching our stars completely nullified.
I’m bored watching my team defend and have no shot attempts for 15 minutes at a time

 

[RU05]

I get texts all game long from friends who are Rangers fans.
“I can’t take the stress”
“How exciting”
My experience has me watching from a completely different viewpoint.
I’m bored by our inability to mount a sustained offensive, I’m bored watching our stars completely nullified.
I’m bored watching my team defend and have no shot attempts for 15 minutes at a time

I would still think you'd be able to enjoy shesterkin's play?

 

[RuBird]

I would still think you'd be able to enjoy shesterkin's play?

And Laffy. Finally playing up to the hype

 

[RU05]

And Laffy. Finally playing up to the hype

As a Devils fan, and Rag's hater, I refuse to like this post, but yes I would think some enjoyment could be taken there as well.

 

[Mikemarc]

Laf is not a superstar. He’s having a terrific playoff however a 57 point season this year ( his highest to date in 4 seasons) is far from anointing someone a superstar.

Kyk has some really crazy opinions on how “good” players are. Tough to take him seriously when he said a few weeks ago that Trochek is who Devils fans wish Hischier was….

 

[RU Cheese]

Kyk has some really crazy opinions on how “good” players are. Tough to take him seriously when he said a few weeks ago that Trochek is who Devils fans wish Hischier was….

Sure but why do you make a post like this that serves no purpose other than to re-instigate the same argument?

I want to bash the Rangers in peace and not deal with stupid troll debates

 

[Mikemarc]

Sure but why do you make a post like this that serves no purpose other than to re-instigate the same argument?

I want to bash the Rangers in peace and not deal with stupid troll debates

I just think some of the opinions on this thread are outlandish. That’s all. Just making my feelings known.

I’ve been called out many times too for having an outlandish opinion. All good..don’t think it’s trolling or stupid. Just think it furthers a good debate.

 

[RUHotTrumpetMonkeyLove]

As a Devils fan, and Rag's hater, I refuse to like this post, but yes I would think some enjoyment could be taken there as well.

As a Devils fan, and Rag's hater, I refuse to like this post, but yes I would think some enjoyment could be taken there as well.

As an Islanders fan, I have to agree as well. His own goal in game 1 was a thing of beauty.

 

[Section124]

When we had one hockey thread, the Devil's fans cried for separate threads. Since this is the Rangers thread, if fans of other teams want to add value, I am fine if they post here. If it's just to bring up personal battles from other thread, please keep that out of this thread.

 

[KK1827]

Kyk has some really crazy opinions on how “good” players are. Tough to take him seriously when he said a few weeks ago that Trochek is who Devils fans wish Hischier was….

1) Trocheck is better than nico. Whats something nico does better than trocheck? And im asking this while totally ignoring the edge trocheck plays with that in nicos game is non-existent.

2) how many points do you think laff had if he played pp1?

3) do you think its harder to score 5v5 or 5v4?

 

[RU05]

1) Trocheck is better than nico. Whats something nico does better than trocheck? And im asking this while totally ignoring the edge trocheck plays with that in nicos game is non-existent.

2) how many points do you think laff had if he played pp1?

3) do you think its harder to score 5v5 or 5v4?

Nico puts more points up. Scores more goals. Better defensively.

 

[Mikemarc]

1) Trocheck is better than nico. Whats something nico does better than trocheck? And im asking this while totally ignoring the edge trocheck plays with that in nicos game is non-existent.

2) how many points do you think laff had if he played pp1?

3) do you think its harder to score 5v5 or 5v4?

1- Nico has more career points per game than trocheck for one. And sure they’ve played on different teams with different line mates..so totally get that’s not a great comparison to make. But what does Nico do better? Nico is probably top 5 forward in the league…top 10 if you wanna be generous..as a defender. His all-around game is much better..and I don’t think there’s much denying this. Only one has been nominated for a major nhl award for play..Nico Selke last year. No hockey fan would trade a first line center who’s a captain for a 2nd/3rd line center who’s been a journeyman most of his career but is in the midst of his best season…

2-can’t play hypothetical. No idea how many more points he’d have…I’d probably say 20 more points

3-absolutely

 

[krup]

1- Nico has more career points per game than trocheck for one. And sure they’ve played on different teams with different line mates..so totally get that’s not a great comparison to make. But what does Nico do better? Nico is probably top 5 forward in the league…top 10 if you wanna be generous..as a defender. His all-around game is much better..and I don’t think there’s much denying this. Only one has been nominated for a major nhl award for play..Nico Selke last year. No hockey fan would trade a first line center who’s a captain for a 2nd/3rd line center who’s been a journeyman most of his career but is in the midst of his best season…

2-can’t play hypothetical. No idea how many more points he’d have…I’d probably say 20 more points

3-absolutely

It’s actually fairly easy to get a rough estimate for power play points. Most top forwards in the league get around 1/3 of their points on the power play.

Lafreniere had 51 points at evens, so he would have finished with about 75-77 points if he was on pp1. He probably finished the year at a better pace than that, though.

 

[Mikemarc]

It’s actually fairly easy to get a rough estimate for power play points. Most top forwards in the league get around 1/3 of their points on the power play.

Lafreniere had 51 points at evens, so he would have finished with about 75-77 points if he was on pp1. He probably finished the year at a better pace than that, though.

Agreed…hence why I said about 20 more points. He did have 6 PP points. So 20 more points would have put him at 26 PPP, and 77 points. I think my guess is pretty right on

 

[KK1827]

Nico puts more points up. Scores more goals. Better defensively.

1) just factually not true, trocheck put up more points
2) yes nico scored more goals overall this year, less even strength points and goals.
3) theyre both good defensively but trocheck has the extra gear of nastiness in his defensive game as well

Nico is your typical soft euro center. Gonna play a solid 200 foot game, be sound in his own end but devils fans would die to see him play like trocheck

 

[KK1827]

1- Nico has more career points per game than trocheck for one. And sure they’ve played on different teams with different line mates..so totally get that’s not a great comparison to make. But what does Nico do better? Nico is probably top 5 forward in the league…top 10 if you wanna be generous..as a defender. His all-around game is much better..and I don’t think there’s much denying this. Only one has been nominated for a major nhl award for play..Nico Selke last year. No hockey fan would trade a first line center who’s a captain for a 2nd/3rd line center who’s been a journeyman most of his career but is in the midst of his best season…

2-can’t play hypothetical. No idea how many more points he’d have…I’d probably say 20 more points

3-absolutely

Calling trocheck a journeyman 2/3C is absurd LOL.

Hes a guy who takes on whatever role a coach wants him to. In florida that meant scoring and he was a 75 point player at age 24, nico had 81 his age 24 season.

Carolina, rod wanted him to play a 2C role and focus on defensive game and not on pp1.

Rangers he does basically everything and these playoffs alone has more points than nico has in his entire career. Nico has 2 goals in 17 playoff games. The lights get bright and hes a pumpkin, too soft.

 

[zappaa]

Real final four back and forth hockey on TNT right now.
Not one team playing keep away

 

[RU848789]

Real final four back and forth hockey on TNT right now.
Not one team playing keep away

Rollercoaster. I could watch McDavid all day. He's just special.

 

[Mikemarc]

Calling trocheck a journeyman 2/3C is absurd LOL.

Hes a guy who takes on whatever role a coach wants him to. In florida that meant scoring and he was a 75 point player at age 24, nico had 81 his age 24 season.

Carolina, rod wanted him to play a 2C role and focus on defensive game and not on pp1.

Rangers he does basically everything and these playoffs alone has more points than nico has in his entire career. Nico has 2 goals in 17 playoff games. The lights get bright and hes a pumpkin, too soft.

not quite as absurd as saying devils fans would rather have him over Nico, though.

Listen, he’s a good player and probably one of the rangers best free agent signings in recent history. We can probably at least agree on that. He’s no Hischier though..

 

[KK1827]

not quite as absurd as saying devils fans would rather have him over Nico, though.

Listen, he’s a good player and probably one of the rangers best free agent signings in recent history. We can probably at least agree on that. He’s no Hischier though..

Agreed and I’m very thankful for that. Nico isnt a 16 game player. Hes not built for the spring.

 

[Mikemarc]

Agreed and I’m very thankful for that. Nico isnt a 16 game player. Hes not built for the spring.

What makes you think this? Certainly not enough games to make this determination.

He has 17 playoff games..8 points.

Let’s compare that to Trochecks who had 6 points in his first 19 playoff games.

Again, 2 different situations so can’t compare strictly by that…

But cmon. You’re trying too hard to make Nico look bad.

 

[zappaa]

What makes you think this? Certainly not enough games to make this determination.

He has 17 playoff games..8 points.

Let’s compare that to Trochecks who had 6 points in his first 19 playoff games.

Again, 2 different situations so can’t compare strictly by that…

But cmon. You’re trying too hard to make Nico look bad.

The topic is ridiculous.
Nico is one hell of a player, if the Rangers had 12 forwards who played like Trochek we’d be winning half these board battles against Florida.
Two excellent players who’d make any team better.
Kreider on the other hand is a dynamic scorer when the Rangers cycle is going and the opposing defense is in duress..
Unfortunately he does absolutely nothing to facilitate it, he’s a benafactor.
Softest big man along the walls in the entire league

 

[RU05]

1) just factually not true, trocheck put up more points
2) yes nico scored more goals overall this year, less even strength points and goals.
3) theyre both good defensively but trocheck has the extra gear of nastiness in his defensive game as well

Nico is your typical soft euro center. Gonna play a solid 200 foot game, be sound in his own end but devils fans would die to see him play like trocheck

1)Well yeah, Nico missed games, so Trocheck did put up more points this season, but Nico still scored more goals. Over the last 3 years, despite missing games, Nico has more points, and goals.

2) 5v5, which is a much better situational break down then even strength Nico scored twice as many goals as Trocheck did this season. Nico was actually top 10 in the league in pts/60 5v5. But at even strength Nico scored more goals as well, in about 300 less minutes played. . If we go last 2 seasons, Nico outproduced Trocheck 5v5, ES, and overall. Last 3 seasons as well.

3)Nico plays a lot more vs's opposing top lines, takes more defensive zone faceoffs, and still puts up better territorial numbers then Trocheck. He also plays more PK minutes.

I do give Trocheck credit for never missing games, while Nico does get banged up a fair amount, and Trocheck does play with more edge then Nico, who is more a quiet grinder, but Nico is the superior player by a good stretch.

All that said.... Go Panthers!!!

 

[KK1827]

What makes you think this? Certainly not enough games to make this determination.

He has 17 playoff games..8 points.

Let’s compare that to Trochecks who had 6 points in his first 19 playoff games.

Again, 2 different situations so can’t compare strictly by that…

But cmon. You’re trying too hard to make Nico look bad.

Nico isn't a bad player. But he's also not trocheck. You're not gonna find many in NHL circles who will tell you they'd prefer nico over trocheck in the playoffs. If nico had trochecks attitude and mentality he'd be better but he doesn't. Too soft

 

[zappaa]

Nico isn't a bad player. But he's also not trocheck. You're not gonna find many in NHL circles who will tell you they'd prefer nico over trocheck in the playoffs. If nico had trochecks attitude and mentality he'd be better but he doesn't. Too soft

stop this ridiculous argument… we’ve got game 5 to watch and discuss.
Hopefully it’s real hockey.

As my dad used to say:
“I’ll take both of them”

 

[RU05]

Nico isn't a bad player. But he's also not trocheck. You're not gonna find many in NHL circles who will tell you they'd prefer nico over trocheck in the playoffs. If nico had trochecks attitude and mentality he'd be better but he doesn't. Too soft

Well after this playoffs I think Trocheck would be an easy call, but after last years playoffs, in which Trocheck did jack ****, Nico was the easy call.

 

[RU05]

stop this ridiculous argument… we’ve got game 6 to watch and discuss.
Hopefully it’s real hockey.

As my dad used to say:
“I’ll take both of them”

Sorry Zap, as a Devils fan, I'm not quite as focused on the Panthers series.....though I will definitely be watching tonight.

 

[ClassOf02v.2]

stop this ridiculous argument… we’ve got game 6 to watch and discuss.
Hopefully it’s real hockey.

As my dad used to say:
“I’ll take both of them”

Thank you! Tonight is game 5 of the ECF and we’re sitting here talking about Nico Hischier????

As someone mentioned above, Devils fans wanted separate team threads rather than one NHL thread. Kyk has to knock it off, but the discussion here needs to be about the Rangers in the midst of a deep playoff run.

 

[Mikemarc]

Nico isn't a bad player. But he's also not trocheck. You're not gonna find many in NHL circles who will tell you they'd prefer nico over trocheck in the playoffs. If nico had trochecks attitude and mentality he'd be better but he doesn't. Too soft

Well as someone who literally works in the game and is around people in “hockey circles”..I’m telling you Nico is the preferred player. As I said above, he lacks much playoff experience to really determine yet what type of playoff player he is just yet.

 

[KK1827]

Well after this playoffs I think Trocheck would be an easy call, but after last years playoffs, in which Trocheck did jack ****, Nico was the easy call.

No one did jack **** last playoffs because gerard gallant literally wasn't coaching haha. He was telling the guys to play hard haha.

 

[KK1827]

Well as someone who literally works in the game and is around people in “hockey circles”..I’m telling you Nico is the preferred player. As I said above, he lacks much playoff experience to really determine yet what type of playoff player he is just yet.

I have friends in the league. I'm telling you. No one cares if they're playing against nico. Guys hate playing against trocheck.