OT: Stock and Investment Thread

RU05

All-American
Jun 25, 2015
14,660
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May be tough as I believe there will be some selling for tax harvesting in December
I dunno, people have taken enough losses already, do they really need to harvest more?

I know I don't, might actually sell some winners to offset some of the losses. Especially if defense stocks like NOC, or energy like SLB go on a Dec run.
 
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RU05

All-American
Jun 25, 2015
14,660
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it's not organic, it's forced and therein lies the issue. On top of that, EV is far worse the environment and there isn't enough to fuel the battery production without significant destruction to the environment which is widely known but ignored.

liberal politics have one iron rule: logic is an enemy and truth is a menace
Organic or not, it's the direction auto manufacturers have signaled they are turning. Oil is not going to open the spickets in the face of that.
 

phs73rc77gsm83

All-Conference
Aug 11, 2011
3,061
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I dunno, people have taken enough losses already, do they really need to harvest more?

I know I don't, might actually sell some winners to offset some of the losses. Especially if defense stocks like NOC, or energy like SLB go on a Dec run.
You can use realized capital loses down the road, they don’t disappear in the current taxable year. I wouldn’t sell winners that that I still like to offset loses. Having said that, as a long term investor and not a trader, I don’t have any long term capital losses.
 
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Joey Bags

All-American
Sep 21, 2019
5,175
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Online Black Friday rocked it yesterday. I know my wife and I bought a ton of stuff:


(Reuters) -U.S. online spending is expected to set a record for Black Friday, according to Adobe Analytics, as steep discounts lured consumers against the backdrop of high inflation, kicking off the year's biggest shopping event on a strong note.

Initial numbers from Adobe Analytics, the data and insights arm of software company Adobe Inc, showed shoppers are expected to spend between $9 billion and $9.2 billion online on Friday, topping its forecast for a modest 1% rise to $9 billion.

As of 6 p.m. EST (2300 GMT) on Friday, Adobe data showed shoppers spent an estimated $7.28 billion online.

"E-commerce demand has remained strong regardless, and Black Friday is set to surpass $9 billion in online sales for the first time, as consumers come to value the ease and convenience of shopping from home," said Vivek Pandya, lead analyst at Adobe Digital Insights.

"Some shoppers are returning to physical stores for Black Friday, after two years where pandemic-related anxieties kept many people at home," Pandya added.

Adobe Analytics, which measures e-commerce by tracking transactions at websites, has access to data covering purchases at 85% of the top 100 internet retailers in the United States.
Any chance the fed looks at alternative data points such as this and determines their work isn't complete yet?
 

ashokan

Heisman
May 3, 2011
25,325
19,688
0
Electronics have been very cheap the last weeks, and BF was almost garage sale prices for many items.
Lots of backed-up inventory

I usually scoff at BF and wait for the Feb clearputs before new models but this year BF was like the olden days. I almost bought an Xbox S just because it was in stock at 240 but I play on PC
 

RUBlackout7

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Apr 10, 2021
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it's not organic, it's forced and therein lies the issue. On top of that, EV is far worse the environment and there isn't enough to fuel the battery production without significant destruction to the environment which is widely known but ignored.

liberal politics have one iron rule: logic is an enemy and truth is a menace
EVs are not far worse for the environment. Fake news.
 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
113
I dunno, people have taken enough losses already, do they really need to harvest more?

I know I don't, might actually sell some winners to offset some of the losses. Especially if defense stocks like NOC, or energy like SLB go on a Dec run.
Good point on selling some winners. If you have losses booked, you should use the opportunity to reposition. You only can deduct $3k in losses anyway.
 
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T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
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Any chance the fed looks at alternative data points such as this and determines their work isn't complete yet?
I don't think so. They are starting to crow about getting inflation down without tanking the economy and throwing people out of work for the holidays (i.e., soft landing).
 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
113
You can use realized capital loses down the road, they don’t disappear in the year in current taxable year. I wouldn’t sell winners that that I still like to offset loses. Having said that, as a long term investor and not a trader, I don’t have any long term capital losses.
+1
For our E-Trade taxable account, we didn't sell anything all year. Just adjusted positions by using our new money/bi-weekly contributions.
 
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ashokan

Heisman
May 3, 2011
25,325
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Organic or not, it's the direction auto manufacturers have signaled they are turning. Oil is not going to open the spickets in the face of that.

In NY the kooks aren't fixing the grid and are creating more weaknesses
That is the giveaway that the well-being of the people, planet whatever isn't the goal
They promise new energy to come after a shutdown (like Indian Point) but then the promised supply isn't there.

There are good reasons all the communists, radicals, CCP, Russia et al are pushing the US over a green cliff, while psychotics who think men need menstrual products in their bathrooms are being programmed to virtue signal their way into famines, shortages, hacked grids etc.

"Reliability margins on New York’s electric grid are shrinking as more fossil fuel generators retire and non-dispatchable renewables are added, the state’s Independent System Operator warned on Wednesday. “We’re taking on a little bit more risk,” NYISO President and CEO Richard Dewey told reporters in a call to discuss the grid operator’s annual Power Trends 2022 report.

New York has historically enjoyed a surplus of generation, but efforts to decarbonize are beginning to show up in forward-looking reliability assessments, Dewey said."

“If you look at the last three years, 2019 through 2021, you can see that retirements have significantly outpaced the new additions,



 

Jtung230

Heisman
Jun 30, 2005
19,103
12,266
82
Good point on selling some winners. If you have losses booked, you should use the opportunity to reposition. You only can deduct $3k in losses anyway.
What? You can carry forward your loses. No advantage unless you want out of the position
 

RUTGERS95

Heisman
Sep 28, 2005
29,628
40,868
113
Organic or not, it's the direction auto manufacturers have signaled they are turning. Oil is not going to open the spickets in the face of that.
no, you must have missed 2 manufacturers culling their lines and r-expanding ice production
 

RUBlackout7

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Apr 10, 2021
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Think you better get out of your bubble and understand what goes into mining, building, sourcing, and trashing of the many EV products
Yep we’ve been mining metals since the beginning of time. Let me know when we are cleaning up metal spills for decades across thousands of acres across the earth, which are responsible for millions of animal deaths. I also wonder if EVs have cleaner emissions. Take the L and get out of your echo chamber.
 

Joey Bags

All-American
Sep 21, 2019
5,175
5,311
1
Organic or not, it's the direction auto manufacturers have signaled they are turning. Oil is not going to open the spickets in the face of that.
The average american isn’t going to have access to the charging requirements needed to own an EV car. The vast, vast majority of apartments and apartment complexes don’t have any charging spots and landlords/real estate companies are too cheap to install them and when they do they will put 4 in a complex that has 200+ units. Lower and middle income complexes will likely never have them unless the government foots the full bill to outfit all parking spaces with them.

This is going to screw auto manufacturers, I just don’t see how it can’t. The luxury complex I moved out of said they don’t have plans to install charging stations in the foreseeable future.
 

RUBlackout

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Mar 11, 2008
10,745
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The average american isn’t going to have access to the charging requirements needed to own an EV car. The vast, vast majority of apartments and apartment complexes don’t have any charging spots and landlords/real estate companies are too cheap to install them and when they do they will put 4 in a complex that has 200+ units. Lower and middle income complexes will likely never have them unless the government foots the full bill to outfit all parking spaces with them.

This is going to screw auto manufacturers, I just don’t see how it can’t. The luxury complex I moved out of said they don’t have plans to install charging stations in the foreseeable future.
The answer will be to fill them up at charging stations like they do today at gas stations. What will need to improve is the time to recharge which I’m sure is being researched by many companies including Tesla and their vast network.
How many people has a gas pump at their house?
 

Joey Bags

All-American
Sep 21, 2019
5,175
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The answer will be to fill them up at charging stations like they do today at gas stations. What will need to improve is the time to recharge which I’m sure is being researched by many companies including Tesla and their vast network.
How many people has a gas pump at their house?
We are far, far away from charging stations being a perfect substitute for gas stations. I’m all for it if it can be done.
 
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DHajekRC84

Heisman
Aug 9, 2001
30,709
19,818
0
Good point on selling some winners. If you have losses booked, you should use the opportunity to reposition. You only can deduct $3k in losses anyway.
Now THIS is exactly what I did this year. But then again I only had about that -$3k anyway. Took a bunch of LT Profit earlier this year before the s storm fully materialized.

But with all these moves have to keep playing around with my Planner to manage under the $150k NJ Taxable Income Threshold. An extra grand could cost me $3k in more taxes. Not even sure if I'll do this much longer as I'm worried I just keep deferring too much income for a few grand in savings. I think I like the exercise is managing everything to it though and seeing how close I can come without going over.
Was a good thing to do this year as not to be pulling a bunch of qualified income out of deflated accounts.
 
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Scarletnut

All-Conference
Jul 27, 2001
5,471
4,164
77
Sometimes overthinking taxable gains/losses results in bad outcomes (I learned this early in my investment career). The bottom line is if you're paying taxes, that means you made money.
 
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RU-Hunter

Senior
May 21, 2022
723
494
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Now THIS is exactly what I did this year. But then again I only had about that -$3k anyway. Took a bunch of LT Profit earlier this year before the s storm fully materialized.

But with all these moves have to keep playing around with my Planner to manage under the $150k NJ Taxable Income Threshold. An extra grand could cost me $3k in more taxes. Not even sure if I'll do this much longer as I'm worried I just keep deferring too much income for a few grand in savings. I think I like the exercise is managing everything to it though and seeing how close I can come without going over.
Was a good thing to do this year as not to be pulling a bunch of qualified income out of deflated accounts.
I believe you only pay the higher tax rate ( 8.97%) on the amount above and beyond the $150K. In other words, you get taxed up to $150K at the lower rate and then they start taxing you only on the amount above $150k.
 
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phs73rc77gsm83

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Aug 11, 2011
3,061
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Sometimes overthinking taxable gains/losses results in bad outcomes (I learned this early in my investment career). The bottom line is if you're paying taxes, that means you made money.
I agree that taxes shouldn’t be the main driver in an investment decision, but efficient tax planning can be very valuable in the long term scheme of things.
 

DHajekRC84

Heisman
Aug 9, 2001
30,709
19,818
0
I believe you only pay the higher tax rate ( 8.97%) on the amount above and beyond the $150K. In other words, you get taxed up to $150K at the lower rate and then they start taxing you only on the amount above $150k.
we're talking about 2 different things. IF you are 62 and older you can exclude all to 25% of your retirement distributions if you NJ taxable income is under $100/125/150k. (married joint)


In addition to that the re-named Anchor Program rebates you $1,500 on your property taxes if under $150,000 in NJ taxable income.

So let's say you have $124k in retirement withdrawal for the year and your only other income is NJ non-taxable SSecurity. You get to deduct 50% of that $124k ($62k) from your NJ taxes! With the $2k standard deduction you're only paying taxes on $60k. Based on 2022 Rates that saves you $3.5k plus another $1.5k for total of $5k savings. (it reduces to about $3k if you're just under the $150k threshold).

$149.999k + $1 it all goes away. So saving $3 - $5k NJ taxes on $25k income is a 12 -20% return.

(that's my take on this and if I have this totally screwed up somebody here is sure to let me know)
 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
113
I agree that taxes shouldn’t be the main driver in an investment decision, but efficient tax planning can be very valuable in the long term scheme of things.
Just got estimates of cap gains distributions for my biggest funds - many between 6-8%. That's why my funds are in tax-deferred accounts and I use only ETFs in taxable accounts! LOL.
 
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T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
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Very important to keep in mind. The market always moved first. Fed speak eventually just becomes bluster and will be ignored.

"We focus on the inflation pivot, not the Fed pivot"

 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
113
Real world housing data negative/deflationary for a 3rd straight month. That means prices are declining. LOL!
 

rurahrah000

All-Conference
Aug 21, 2010
3,247
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Real world housing data negative/deflationary for a 3rd straight month. That means prices are declining. LOL!
It isn't going to be good enough for inflation to stagnate. We need it to come down to ~2%. if not then we will either continue to see rate hikes or rates to stay persistently elevated. Either of those scenarios is bad for growth stocks and the stock market in general.
 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
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It isn't going to be good enough for inflation to stagnate. We need it to come down to ~2%. if not then we will either continue to see rate hikes or rates to stay persistently elevated. Either of those scenarios is bad for growth stocks and the stock market in general.
Use real housing data and MoM CPI was negative last month (including Core CPI). The math is slowly moving in that direction. Too bad the morons at the Fed don't seem to understand the metrics.

Still eyeing LABU. Hoping to get in if it dips below $6. It has been hovering in the $6-7 range lately.
 

RUTGERS95

Heisman
Sep 28, 2005
29,628
40,868
113
It isn't going to be good enough for inflation to stagnate. We need it to come down to ~2%. if not then we will either continue to see rate hikes or rates to stay persistently elevated. Either of those scenarios is bad for growth stocks and the stock market in general.
cannot move down unless energy moves down significantly

sticky inflation is the concern
 

rurahrah000

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Aug 21, 2010
3,247
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cannot move down unless energy moves down significantly

sticky inflation is the concern

Energy, home/apartment rental prices all need to come down. Of course, a rapid downturn would likely mean a recession. I think all this talk of soft landing will end next year. We will be likely talking about recession.
 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
113
Energy, home/apartment rental prices all need to come down. Of course, a rapid downturn would likely mean a recession. I think all this talk of soft landing will end next year. We will be likely talking about recession.
Not seeing it - as in a legit recession. Energy is way down (the hysteria of calling for $200+ barrel is long past) . Home prices and rent are going down. Customer is strong. Labor market is strong. Wages are up. Life is good for the majority of people.
 

RUinPinehurst

All-American
Aug 27, 2011
8,395
7,915
113
Energy/oil have been deflationary for the past 6 months (i.e., well down from the peak).
Thank China's COVID lockdown for that. Once they're open, again, oil demand will be up as will prices. That said, electric/power rates are increasing, diesel fuel is in short supply, as is home heating oil. Winter will be pricey.
 

T2Kplus20

Heisman
May 1, 2007
31,248
19,254
113
Thank China's COVID lockdown for that. Once they're open, again, oil demand will be up as will prices. That said, electric/power rates are increasing, diesel fuel is in short supply, as is home heating oil. Winter will be pricey.
The irrational hysteria of Russia disrupting the entire market caused the spike (which never happens). Russia is selling their oil to China and China is then selling it over to the EU. No big deal. Unless that changes, we will be fine.
 

RUTGERS95

Heisman
Sep 28, 2005
29,628
40,868
113
Not seeing it - as in a legit recession. Energy is way down (the hysteria of calling for $200+ barrel is long past) . Home prices and rent are going down. Customer is strong. Labor market is strong. Wages are up. Life is good for the majority of people.
it's about sticky inflation, that is the concern i.e. where does it settle. I'm not see deflationary pressure while people are still pay $4/gallon and the spending on revolving debt has exploded which still hasn't subsided.

Of note, buy now pay later exploded on Black Friday and accounted for over 1/3 of all black friday spending.

I would not be suprised to see inflation and significant downturn in the market.

Home prices will continue to fall, a lot!