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RU05

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ashokan said:
The ten year old article was to show how long the gov has been lying
The Twitter corruption shows that and its just the tip of the iceberg
Ukraine got destroyed while the "Ukraine is winning" psyops went on for months (of course Ukraine is corrupt DC's laundromat).

Most of the places I see with hiring signs lost workers after the covid payouts and vaccine mandates
In NY even the illegals got millions
Tech, media and others going down the drain with job implosion






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Didn't you chalk Kharkiv up as a win for Russia?

Your takes are brutal.
 
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RU05

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RUDead said:
Do you think Ukraine is winng?
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After the initial stages of the invasion, in which Russia took a ton of ground, Ukraine has been on the offensive and taken back significant ports of the land lost. Russia has made no real gains since that initial phase.

Russia is dug in, and continue to batter civilian positions, so maybe the plan has shifted to merely holding as much land as they can.

If they were to do that, that would have to be considered a win for Russia, but I'm not sure they can. Not with Ukraine having had significantly more victories since that initial stage.
 
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RUDead

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RU-05 said:
After the initial stages of the invasion, in which Russia took a ton of ground, Ukraine has been on the offensive and taken back significant ports of the land lost. Russia has made no real gains since that initial phase.

Russia is dug in, and continue to batter civilian positions, so maybe the plan has shifted to merely holding as much land as they can.

If they were to do that, that would have to be considered a win for Russia, but I'm not sure they can. Not with Ukraine having had significantly more victories since that initial stage.
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Russia has taken 20% of Ukraine and annexed it.
Russia has crippled the energy infrastructure of the entire country of Ukraine
Russia devastated the much larger Ukrainian army and is only now bringing in large numbers of troops.
Ukraine is in the early stages of humanitarian and refugee crisis.

On the other hand:

Ukraine won back some territory that they had previously lost.


This war isn't close so far and its looks like its about to get much worse for Ukrainians.
 
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RU05

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RUDead said:
Russia has taken 20% of Ukraine and annexed it.
Russia has crippled the energy infrastructure of the entire country of Ukraine
Russia devastated the much larger Ukrainian army and is only now bringing in large numbers of troops.
Ukraine is in the early stages of humanitarian and refugee crisis.

On the other hand:

Ukraine won back some territory that they had previously lost.


This war isn't close so far and its looks like its about to get much worse for Ukrainians.
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How "devastated" can the Ukraine army be when they have been winning back significant portions of the lands lost initially?

If anything Russia's need to add troops speaks to the state of their army. IE, it needed reinforcements.
 
T2Kplus20

T2Kplus20

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RU-05 said:
How "devastated" can the Ukraine army be when they have been winning back significant portions of the lands lost initially?

If anything Russia's need to add troops speaks to the state of their army. IE, it needed reinforcements.
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War can be looked at from many different perspectives. For example:

1. Who has caused the most destructive on the other side? Current winner = Russia
2. Who has control of the land being fought over? Current winner = UKR
3. Who has the momentum and advancing against the other side? Current winner = UKR

War/conflict has many POVs. Overall, I would say UKR is suffering the most hardship, but Putin/Russia are not accomplishing their goals and thus losing.
 
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RU05

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T2Kplus20 said:
War can be looked at from many different perspectives. For example:

1. Who has caused the most destructive on the other side? Current winner = Russia
2. Who has control of the land being fought over? Current winner = UKR
3. Who has the momentum and advancing against the other side? Current winner = UKR

War/conflict has many POVs. Overall, I would say UKR is suffering the most hardship, but Putin/Russia are not accomplishing their goals and thus losing.
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Ya, great points, but I would perhaps argue that, even if Russian doesn't accomplish their initial goals, which almost seems certain they won't, if they maintain current lines, then they did win something, while UKR lost something.

Conversely if UKR is able to retake all of Russian held territory, and especially if they retake Crimea and the preinvasion contested regions in the east then that is a big win for UKR and a huge loss for Russia.

Also have to consider the hit Russia's military has taken in regards to the world view. Even if they were to hold the regions they now hold, their military has been exposed as severely outdated. Never mind Finland and Sweden joining NATO, and in general NATO countries recommitting to military spending, (which would bring it back on topic in regards to this thread, ie defense stocks, and I'd argue steel producers as well)
 
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RUDead

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RU-05 said:
How "devastated" can the Ukraine army be when they have been winning back significant portions of the lands lost initially?

If anything Russia's need to add troops speaks to the state of their army. IE, it needed reinforcements.
Click to expand...

Russia has been focused on taking out infrastructure and troops and they have been very successful. They can win that land back if they want.

The numbers are all over the place due to heavy propaganda from both sides but the majority estimate Russia initially sent 100K troops to Ukraine 400-500K. They are adding to their numbers not reinforcing.
 
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RU05

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RUDead said:
Russia has been focused on taking out infrastructure and troops and they have been very successful. They can win that land back if they want.

The numbers are all over the place due to heavy propaganda from both sides but the majority estimate Russia initially sent 100K troops to Ukraine 400-500K. They are adding to their numbers not reinforcing.
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The bold is just silly.

They haven't had significant gains since the very early stages of the invasion. They can't even hold land, losing major cities like Kharkiv and Kherson.

They've been trying to take Bakhmut, a pretty much insignificant city, for months, and there is still no indication that they will.

It's true they have bombed the heck out of civilian area's though. No argument there, but I don't think it's going to break the will of UKR which is clearly their intent.
 
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RUDead

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RU-05 said:
The bold is just silly.

They haven't had significant gains since the very early stages of the invasion. They can't even hold land, losing major cities like Kharkiv and Kherson.

They've been trying to take Bakhmut, a pretty much insignificant city, for months, and there is still no indication that they will.

It's true they have bombed the heck out of civilian area's though. No argument there, but I don't think it's going to break the will of UKR which is clearly their intent.
Click to expand...

What's silly is you believing Ukraine is winning. They are getting their asses kicked.

All these stories about Ukraine winning these little battles are noise and propaganda. The results I spoke of in my first post are the only thing that matters.
 
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T2Kplus20

T2Kplus20

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RUDead said:
What's silly is you believing Ukraine is winning. They are getting their asses kicked.

All these stories about Ukraine winning these little battles are noise and propaganda. The results I spoke of in my first post are the only thing that matters.
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Sorry, but UKR is definitely winning vs Putin's goal of taking over the country within a month or two and installing a puppet government.

Big winning for UKR.
 
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RU05

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RUDead said:
What's silly is you believing Ukraine is winning. They are getting their asses kicked.

All these stories about Ukraine winning these little battles are noise and propaganda. The results I spoke of in my first post are the only thing that matters.
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Well it's nuanced, as I and @T2Kplus20 have noted in our back and forth above. But I have not said Ukraine is "winning the war".

Ukraine is winning back land though. That's a fact. Large swaths of it.

Calling the retaking of Kherson, the lone regional capital Russian had occupied, "a little battle" is certainly a good example of propaganda.
 
RUTGERS95

RUTGERS95

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RU-05 said:
The bold is just silly.

They haven't had significant gains since the very early stages of the invasion. They can't even hold land, losing major cities like Kharkiv and Kherson.

They've been trying to take Bakhmut, a pretty much insignificant city, for months, and there is still no indication that they will.

It's true they have bombed the heck out of civilian area's though. No argument there, but I don't think it's going to break the will of UKR which is clearly their intent.
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Not silly st all. Russia has been white gloves vs brutal onslaught. Russia has consolidated and regrouped in order to negotiate. Ukies don't want to negotiate so here comes the fk u hurt. Go Russia
 
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RUDead

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T2Kplus20 said:
Sorry, but UKR is definitely winning vs Putin's goal of taking over the country within a month or two and installing a puppet government.

Big winning for UKR.
Click to expand...

Nobody knows Putin's goals. Stop believing what the MSM tells you about Putin's goals.
 
T2Kplus20

T2Kplus20

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RUTGERS95 said:
Not silly st all. Russia has been white gloves vs brutal onslaught. Russia has consolidated and regrouped in order to negotiate. Ukies don't want to negotiate so here comes the fk u hurt. Go Russia
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Putin looks sickly due to stress and the long knives coming out for him. I wouldn't be surprised if he has one of those Russian "accidents" soon.
 
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RUDead

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RU-05 said:
Well it's nuanced, as I and @T2Kplus20 have noted in our back and forth above. But I have not said Ukraine is "winning the war".

Ukraine is winning back land though. That's a fact. Large swaths of it.

Calling the retaking of Kherson, the lone regional capital Russian had occupied, "a little battle" is certainly a good example of propaganda.
Click to expand...

Stop trying to move the goalposts. Results to date say Russia is winning big time. Nothing else matters.
 
T2Kplus20

T2Kplus20

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RU-05 said:
I wonder. Are republicans as anti weed as they once were?
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They voted down national legalization last year. No reason to think this will change in the near future. Yes, they are not as "anti" as before. However, weed stocks need national legalization, not more support for state-by-state patchwork of approvals.
 
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RU05

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RUTGERS95 said:
Not silly st all. Russia has been white gloves vs brutal onslaught. Russia has consolidated and regrouped in order to negotiate. Ukies don't want to negotiate so here comes the fk u hurt. Go Russia
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Ah, yes, mass indiscriminate bombing of civilian areas is clearly "white gloves".

Will be interesting to see how much they can regroup though. Can they get troops into fighting shape? Or has their military structure, which already looked dysfunctional, been degraded to the point where they will just be now throwing their men into the wood chipper?
 
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rurahrah000

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RUDead said:
Stop trying to move the goalposts. Results to date say Russia is winning big time. Nothing else matters.
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BIG TIME???? Russia was supposed to have destroyed Ukraine in 1 week and yet we are here 1 year into the war and Russia is retreating. You may need to define BIG TIME? And please don't refer to QAnon conspiracy theories or some vague sources.
 
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RU05

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RUDead said:
Stop trying to move the goalposts. Results to date say Russia is winning big time. Nothing else matters.
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I didn't move goal posts.

I said from my initial post on the topic. Russia took a large chunk of land early in the invasion, and has been losing land back since.
 
T2Kplus20

T2Kplus20

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rurahrah000 said:
BIG TIME???? Russia was supposed to have destroyed Ukraine in 1 week and yet we are here 1 year into the war and Russia is retreating. You may need to define BIG TIME? And please don't refer to QAnon conspiracy theories or some vague sources.
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Add in Sweden and Finland joining NATO and the impact to their economy. Russia/Putin really screwed the pooch this conflict.
 
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RUDead

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rurahrah000 said:
BIG TIME???? Russia was supposed to have destroyed Ukraine in 1 week and yet we are here 1 year into the war and Russia is retreating. You may need to define BIG TIME? And please don't refer to QAnon conspiracy theories or some vague sources.
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Oh goody. Another fool who believes what Russia was "supposed to do".
 
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RUDead

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rurahrah000 said:
How can you say he is winning if you don't know his goals? Foolish statement. Proves that you are another QAnon dumb dumb.
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Because I am basing it on the results, not "what should have happened" like you guys. Facts matter not the narrative.

Why do you keep bringing up QAnon?

You are too dumb for me to keep wasting my time responding to you.
 
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RU05

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rurahrah000 said:
BIG TIME???? Russia was supposed to have destroyed Ukraine in 1 week and yet we are here 1 year into the war and Russia is retreating. You may need to define BIG TIME? And please don't refer to QAnon conspiracy theories or some vague sources.
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If you trace this discussion back, it all started with a NY Post article about employment numbers being pumped up back in 2012. Which or course meant today's employment numbers are also being pumped up.

The logical next step is Putin is winning big in Ukraine.

So we should be wary of where this discussion will go next.
 
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Knight Owl

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Best estimates are at least 90K deceased Russian soldiers with at least as many wounded and/or out of operation compared to 13K deceased UKR soldiers and another 20K deceased UKR civilians.
Russian soldiers now realize they are merely being sacrificed for Putin’s insane fratricidal “hey let’s relive Russia’s imperial glory days” war.
 
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RU05

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RUDead said:
Because I am basing it on the results, not "what should have happened" like you guys. Facts matter not the narrative.

Why do you keep bringing up QAnon?

You are too dumb for me to keep wasting my time responding to you.
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Russia's success early on reminds me of Rutgers beating Temple this year.

Sure we were 3-0, but it still felt like we were not in line for a winning season.
 
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RU05

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Knight Owl said:
Best estimates are at least 90K deceased Russian soldiers with at least as many wounded and/or out of operation compared to 13K deceased UKR soldiers and another 20K deceased UKR civilians.
Russian soldiers now realize they are merely being sacrificed for Putin’s insane fratricidal “hey let’s relive Russia’s imperial glory days” war.
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I agree with @RUDead on this point. I just can't put much credence into those #'s. I'm going to highly doubt the troop casualty rate is 7 to 1.
 
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