Question for Coach/rugb/fish/OEM.....

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PineGroveBully

Redshirt
Nov 13, 2007
8,508
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Stansburys first NCAA we was a 3, then a 5, then a 2, then a 8/9, then a 8/9, then 13.

That doesnt justify firing him but those trends normally go in the other direction.

those seeds are from memory, feel free to correct
 
D

donthateme

Guest
Whoever the hell you are Coach34 your my new best friend along with that stannottheman guy... All I have to say to your response is AMEN. State has potential to be something in basketball, but it will not happen with Stansburry as the coach...

There's no movement, screens, want to, or at least an offense.
And the defensive decisions he makes sucks!
 

HD6

Sophomore
Apr 8, 2003
10,019
108
63
about our ability to win in the SEC. We do plenty of that. You guys are complaining about us being unable to compete on a national level. I want for you to A) not point out what is going on right now and then B) explain what about MSU makes you think we could consistently be a top 15 team and consistently make the Sweet Sixteen or better.

And who is complaining about recruiting? Saying our state isn't a hotbed of hoops prospects isn't complaining. Look at our best players under Stansbury. Other than Rhodes and Bowers, who was from Mississippi? Austin was from Alabama, Zimmerman was from Louisiana, Roberts from Texas, Frazier was from Florida, Gordon and Varnado are from Tennessee.
 

DawgatAuburn

All-Conference
Apr 25, 2006
10,972
1,726
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Once every five or six years is not "consistently", but it would make me happy. Consistent would be at least half the time, which I don't think we can sustain. Consistent is not 0 for 11. Well, actually it is, but not the kind we are looking for.

I love how you people stretch all these discussions to the extreme.

Statement: We don't schedule well.
Sheep response: Why do you want to add UNC, Duke and UConn? They won't play us anyway. Go ahead and call them and let them laugh at us.

Statement: We would like to be nationally relevant.
Sheep response: What makes you think we can be consistently in the Sweet 16 or better? The Final Four was the best and worst thing to ever happen to us.

There are more.....but that's how these threads always go.
 

8dog

All-American
Feb 23, 2008
13,896
5,734
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of the teams that made the Sweet 16 from 2000-09, why did LSU, Auburn, Alabama, and Ole Miss fire their coaches? Seems pretty dumb to fire them if they went to the Sweet 16.
 

Hanmudog

Redshirt
Apr 30, 2006
5,853
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Every single person on this board thought we would be at best an NIT team last year after losing Rhodes, Gordon, and Hansbrough. We went to the NCAAT, won the SECT, and won 23 games. That is not underachieving. That is some of you shifting your expectations and forgetting where we started out.
The expectations for this season were predicating on Riek and Sidney being as advertised and Kodi being better than worthless. That hasn't happened That being said, we are still 15-4 and in first place in the West.There is alot of basketball left to be played and many of you have thrown in the towel after one SEC loss. Let that sink in for a minute. One SEC loss. You guys may as well kill yourselves before football and baseball start to save you the misery.
 

DawgatAuburn

All-Conference
Apr 25, 2006
10,972
1,726
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If you get one shot to play Kansas or Duke or one of those type teams, and the only shot is at their place, then yes. Every time. Hopefully you have a good enough team to compete. If not, you learn real quick what it takes to compete. If it's a team from the lower 3/4 of the big conferences, then no. During the Stansbury era I think we have had home and homes with Clemson, Miami, Missouri, and Oklahoma. Throw in Xavier though they are not a power conference team. I am probably forgetting a few. There is no reason we can't try to do the same with teams like Ga Tech, Maryland, Texas A&M, Florida State, etc. I'd try the ACC and Big 12 teams first because those are probably easier trips for some of our fans.

The field at the Hawaii tournament next year looks good too.
 

Coach34

Redshirt
Jul 20, 2012
20,283
1
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2006- didnt underachieve due to rebuilding, but that was an embarrassing schedule</p>

2007- underachieved...some bad losses and weak scheduling led to NIT

2008- underachieved- while played Memphis well in NCAA's, had 5 losses OOC and played in a weak SEC. Then lost to Georgia after they had already played a game earlier that day

2009- probably overachieved...but let me ask you this- you and other sheep want to always talk about "bad draws" or "teams getting hot in March"....werent we the "hot" team when we went to Washington? Why are we always getting upset? Why don't we ever pull the upset instead? When are we going to be the "hot" team" in March?</p>
 

paindonthurt_

All-Conference
Jun 27, 2009
9,528
2,045
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Name a year and I'll show you underachievement. Name one. I dare you.

No one is saying we should be North Carolina, Duke, Kansas, etc. We are saying that Stansbury has consistently underachieved.
 

RonnyAtmosphere

Redshirt
Jun 4, 2007
2,883
0
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...a SEC tournament championship. If not for overachieving in the SEC tournament last year, it would have been, at best, the NIT.

Outside the realm of sixpack ignorance,last year's squadoverachieved on a massive scale.

Dumbass.
 

Hanmudog

Redshirt
Apr 30, 2006
5,853
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paindonthurt said:
Name a year and I'll show you underachievement. Name one. I dare you.

No one is saying we should be North Carolina, Duke, Kansas, etc. We are saying that Stansbury has consistently underachieved.

If you say you predicted us to do what we did last year after losing Gordon, Rhodes, and Hansbrough while also starting a freshman point guard and two sophomores who had only previously played in mop up duty then you are a damned liar.
 

paindonthurt_

All-Conference
Jun 27, 2009
9,528
2,045
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http://www.mstateathletic...=16800&Q_SEASON=2008

I didn't expect to be world beaters coming into the year, but there is no way we SHOULD have had 5 losses before league play. No damn way. If we just win 2 of those 5 games (probably should have won 3 of them), we have a better seed going into the NCAA tournament. Then we probably win the first round and get beat in the second round. Thats not over achieving but rather that is meeting expectations.

If stans had underachieved 5 or 6 out of 12 years and met expectation or god forbid better than expectations then I would be thrilled, but EVERY YEAR HE HAS UNDERACHIEVED. EVERY YEAR.
 

Hanmudog

Redshirt
Apr 30, 2006
5,853
0
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If you expected that out of last year's team then you are a bigger sheep than me. I did not see last season coming. Funny how you guys are so quick to excuse Pelphrey, Trent Johnson, etc. for having rebuilding years but Stans was "expected" to do that last year?
Stansbury has his faults. His biggest one right now is putting Phil Turner on the bench in favor of either Ravern or Kodi and his stubborn refusal to let them up the tempo, However, I don't want him fired and can appreciate what we have accomplished while still being realistic about where our program stands.</p>
 

paindonthurt_

All-Conference
Jun 27, 2009
9,528
2,045
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Answer the question.

Should we have lost 5 games prior to league play??? Hell no.

If we win 2 of those 5 and make a decent run in the SEC tourn. Win 2 games and get beat in the champion ship, we probably still make the NCAA tourn. with a better seed. We had to win the SEC tourn. Why you ask?? B/c we UNDERACHIEVED EARLY AND OFTEN.
 

Coach34

Redshirt
Jul 20, 2012
20,283
1
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the last 5 years, including this year, and look at our OOC schedule its awful. Then if you take away the gimme games with Valley, Jacksonville State, and the like- where we didnt even need a coach to win, its really awful with the losses we have.

5 freaking years OOC- and tell me how many quality wins we have vs bad losses. And I dont think mid-majors are quality wins.
 
Mar 3, 2008
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Basketball is an urban game played by urbanites for the most part. To even get the amount of talent that comes now to the SEC speaks more of our money and facilities than any desire for kids to come play here for college. And high schools in the south focus more on football and baseball than basketball. MSU basketball, as much as we all want it to get better, just has fundamental problems against it that have to be dealt with before even thinking about national power. Sure, we'll luck into some major talent every now and then, but we won't get the kind of player depth necessary to consistently build a national player. It doesn't matter who the coach is.

I think that's one of the reasons that Stansbury recruits like he does. He gets players that are athletic in talent but raw in skill (Rhodes, Campbell, Varnado, Turner, Gordon, Zimmerman), or players that have developed completely but have fundamental weaknesses that prevent them from being top-notch basketball plaers (Stewart, Bost, Osby, Power). I think Stansbury does good building up what he has, but there isn't any top-tier talent here. (On a talent scale in the SEC, I'd say we're just above Vanderbilt, LSU, and South Carolina currently, but everyone else is way more talented 1-12. Yes even Georgia). Yeah, Stansbury isn't a great gameday coach, but he's an good preparation coach. He's a good recruiter for where he operates, but not a national power recruiter. He is what he is, but I think we're better off with him. For what we get here in terms of players, I think Stansbury does a good job.
 
Mar 3, 2008
45
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Last year's team was horrible compared to what we're used to. Honestly, there's no reason that team should have beaten Tennessee in the SEC championship.
 

RonnyAtmosphere

Redshirt
Jun 4, 2007
2,883
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...I realize you are ignorant of the way college basketball works, but any time a collegebasketball team in America wins their conference tournament, itis considered to be a great achievement.

Moreover, unlessyou enteryour conferencetournament with a lock on a #1 or #2 seed in the NCAA tournament, it's usually considered an overachievment to win your conference tournament.

Since college basketball is a tournament-based sport with a viable playoff system in place, the regular season is little more than a series ofwarm up games for the tournaments. Who gives a crap what you did in the regular season if you can win your conference tournament then automatically earn a bid to the NCAA tournament.
 

RonnyAtmosphere

Redshirt
Jun 4, 2007
2,883
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Basketball is an urban game played by urbanites for the most part.
If this even made sense, it would still be ********.

The bulk of the basketball players in the SEC are small town/small cityyoungstersfrom small town/small cityschools.

If basketball was an "urban" game, then hillbilly Kentucky would suck every year instead of competingfor NC's.
 

paindonthurt_

All-Conference
Jun 27, 2009
9,528
2,045
113
Should we have lost to WSU, TT, Charlotte, Cinn, and San Diego last year??? No. If we win 2 of those 5, then we don't have to overachieve in the SEC Tournament. And we still probably get a higher seed in the NCAA tourn.
 

Hanmudog

Redshirt
Apr 30, 2006
5,853
0
0
Coach34 said:
the last 5 years, including this year, and look at our OOC schedule its awful. Then if you take away the gimme games with Valley, Jacksonville State, and the like- where we didnt even need a coach to win, its really awful with the losses we have.

5 freaking years OOC- and tell me how many quality wins we have vs bad losses. And I dont think mid-majors are quality wins.

Now you are taking wins away from us to make us look worse. Take away Trent Johnson's "gimmees" from last year and see how his record looks or any coach for that matter. To hell with it, I'm going to just sit back and enjoy the 22+ games we are going to win this season and enjoy the ride. It you guys want to piss and moan 7-8 times after lossethis season then go ahead.
 

DawgatAuburn

All-Conference
Apr 25, 2006
10,972
1,726
113
AConstipatedMonkey said:
(On a talent scale in the SEC, I'd say we're just above Vanderbilt, LSU, and South Carolina currently, but everyone else is way more talented 1-12. Yes even Georgia).
We are not above Vanderbilt. And if you think Auburn, Alabama and Arkansas are more talented 1-12 then I can't help you.
 
Mar 3, 2008
45
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You talking about the same Alabama team that none of our guards could run away from Saturday? Or the one who had 4 blocks by their guiards, or the one who consistently ran us down on a fast break?
 

paindonthurt_

All-Conference
Jun 27, 2009
9,528
2,045
113
The question remains that you won't answer. Should we have lost 5 games in our pre league schedule last year?? The answer should be an astounding NO.
 

Repeat Offender

Redshirt
Dec 30, 2009
304
0
0
consisted of several upsets. How bad of a coachis Pearl? With all of that talent, he could not get his team prepared to play for the SEC tournament championship game. </p>
 

Repeat Offender

Redshirt
Dec 30, 2009
304
0
0
beaten LSU and UT in the SEC tournament. By your logic, the weakOOC games would have been more important to our resume than the LSU and UT victories??? Really.
 

HD6

Sophomore
Apr 8, 2003
10,019
108
63
with terrible non-conference SOS. I am really not seeing this correlation between non-conference SOS and postseason success.

Code:
[b] STRENGTH OF SCHEDULE NON-CONF SOS[/b] [b][url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006]Rnk[/url] Team Conf [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=Wins]W[/url]-[url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=Losses]L[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006]Pyth[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=AdjOE]AdjO/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=AdjDE]AdjD/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=Consistency]Cons/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=Luck]Luck/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=SOSPythag]Pyth/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=SOSO]OppO/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=SOSD]OppD/Rnk[/url] [url=http://kenpom.com/rate.php?y=2006&s=NCSOSPythag]Pyth/Rnk[/url][/b]
2006 1 Florida SEC 33-6 .9737 119.4/2 87.2/5 20.0/172 -.017/186 .7396/50 107.0/38 97.7/71 <span style="font-weight: bold;">.5024/196</span>-

2007 2 Florida SEC 35-5 .9845 125.4/1 87.4/12 24.8/308 +.023/95 .7635/45 108.2/35 97.7/62 <span style="font-weight: bold;">.5595/145</span>
 

HD6

Sophomore
Apr 8, 2003
10,019
108
63
in the Texas Tech, Washington State, and Cincy losses. Those are all power conference teams, we played away from home. The other two losses were bad, but I look at as we were a young team replacing 3 starters, playing a true freshman point guard, and our best player is a defensive stopper, not a big time scorer. I thought last year would be a rebuilding year, and we ended up winning the SEC tournament and going to the NCAA tournament. That's not a bad job.
 

fishwater99

Freshman
Jun 4, 2007
14,072
54
48
Stans needs a assistant coach who can help him implement an offense besides te damn "motion". It's not that hard to do. Stans is now content to Live and Die by the 3 ball. I mean in 12 years he has failed to become better at coaching on he offensive end. He needs help and now. We should not have to rely on 3 pointers to win games, we have very athletic players that are not being utilized.

Just back from NOLA....... Who Dat?
 

fishwater99

Freshman
Jun 4, 2007
14,072
54
48
And this trend has been going on for years. If you play the weak teams, you have to win the games.
 

HD6

Sophomore
Apr 8, 2003
10,019
108
63
College of Charleston loses to Western Carolina tonight. That loss gets worse and worse for UNC.
 
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