The eight wins we ought to be so happy about...

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Wins:
Jackson St. (SWAC)
Auburn (3-9, 0-8)
Troy (5-7)
South Alabama (2-10)
Kentucky (2-10, 0-8)
Tennessee (5-7, 1-7)
Middle Tennessee (8-3, 6-1)
Arkansas (4-8, 2-6)

For those of you pumping sunshine about going 8-4, please look above. Those are our eight wins. Look at them. Look long and hard. Our best 17ing win is MTSU. That is 17ing embarrassing.

We played four teams with a pulse this year. We got our doors blown off in all four (average margin of defeat 23.25 points i.e. 3 17ing touchdowns).

Please quit telling me how I should be happy to be 8-4. I'm not melting down. I'm not even as mad as I am just disgusted. I'm just looking at the season. We sucked this year. Period. Anyone who tells you otherwise belongs on the lake.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

Quit being a *****. EVERY 8-4 team either doesn't beat anyone, or beats some good teams and also loses to bad ones.
I challenge you to name me one team that doesn't fit into one of those categories.

Point being, we are a typical 8-4 team. We aren't a notably bad one, we just are one. I wanted to be better too, but let's not make it seem worse than it is.

The knock on us is looking bad in all of our losses.

 

[thatsbaseball]

Hell yea. Don`t pay any attention to that man behind the curtain.

 

[was21]

get a grip.

 

[seb304]

Quit being a *****. EVERY 8-4 team either doesn't beat anyone, or beats some good teams and also loses to bad ones.
I challenge you to name me one team that doesn't fit into one of those categories.

Point being, we are a typical 8-4 team. We aren't a notably bad one, we just are one. I wanted to be better too, but let's not make it seem worse than it is.

The knock on us is looking bad in all of our losses.

I think people could be alright with us not beating anyone if we had looked even remotely competitive in our 4 losses.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

EVERY 8-4 team either doesn't beat anyone, or beats some good teams and also loses to bad ones. I challenge you to name me one team that doesn't fit into one of those categories.

Point being, we are a typical 8-4 team. We aren't a notably bad one, we just are one. I wanted to be better too, but let's not make it seem worse than it is.

The knock on us is looking bad in all of our losses.

To answer your question:
North Carolina: 8-4 with wins over Virginia Tech (6-6), win over East Carolina (8-4), 3-point loss to Duke (6-6), 5-point road loss to Louisville (9-2). 12 points from being 11-1.
Penn State: Double-digit win over Northwestern (9-3), win over Indiana (6-6), win over Minnesota (6-6), win over Wisconsin (7-5), 12-point loss to undefeated Ohio State (12-0), 9-point loss at Nebraska (10-2), opening home loss to Ohio (8-4)
Michigan: Win over Air Force (6-6), Win at Purdue (6-6), win over Michigan State (6-6), win over Minnesota (6-6), win over Northwestern (9-3), 7-point loss at Notre Dame (12-0)
East Carolina: Win over 1-AA Appalachian State (8-3). All other wins over teams with losing records, losses to teams with winning records
Bowling Green: 12-point win at Ohio (8-4), 7-point home loss to Kent State (11-1), 12-point loss at Toledo (9-3), 37-point loss at Virginia Tech (6-6)
Vanderbilt: Win over Ole Miss (6-6), 4-point loss to South Carolina (10-2), 1-point loss at Northwestern (9-3), 45-point loss to Georgia (11-1), 14-point loss to Florida (11-1)

 

[Sutterkane]

and with that schedule from 01-08 excluding 2007, we probably go 4-8 and Tennessee, Auburn, and Arkansas all feel better about themselves beating us and still fire their coaches.

If we'd have won on Saturday, this board would be lit up like we were bound for the national title next year.

 

[lasher8]

Attaboy, Homer...you really showed him, didn't you? Everybody give Homer an "attaboy" - he must have spent a lot of time on that.

To answer your question:
North Carolina: 8-4 with wins over Virginia Tech (6-6), win over East Carolina (8-4), 3-point loss to Duke (6-6), 5-point road loss to Louisville (9-2). 12 points from being 11-1.
Penn State: Double-digit win over Northwestern (9-3), win over Indiana (6-6), win over Minnesota (6-6), win over Wisconsin (7-5), 12-point loss to undefeated Ohio State (12-0), 9-point loss at Nebraska (10-2), opening home loss to Ohio (8-4)
Michigan: Win over Air Force (6-6), Win at Purdue (6-6), win over Michigan State (6-6), win over Minnesota (6-6), win over Northwestern (9-3), 7-point loss at Notre Dame (12-0)
East Carolina: Win over 1-AA Appalachian State (8-3). All other wins over teams with losing records, losses to teams with winning records
Bowling Green: 12-point win at Ohio (8-4), 7-point home loss to Kent State (11-1), 12-point loss at Toledo (9-3), 37-point loss at Virginia Tech (6-6)
Vanderbilt: Win over Ole Miss (6-6), 4-point loss to South Carolina (10-2), 1-point loss at Northwestern (9-3), 45-point loss to Georgia (11-1), 14-point loss to Florida (11-1)

 

[DAWG61]

I'll remember this year with wins over Auburn, Arkansas and Tennessee. Without looking it up I'm guessing that's the first time we have ever beaten all 3 of those teams in the same season. A nice bowl win will be remembered too. The losses will also be remembered but they won't stand out except for 2. Johnny Football and how frustrated he made me with the 50 missed tackles he caused and then doing the Superman chest move in our endzone and the second being how we layed down in the 2nd half vs snot nosed Bucky.

I will remember that Ole Miss rushed the field after beating us and how I laughed at that and for the first time ever I knew that Ole Miss considered us above them. Nobody rushes the field when they beat a school they feel they are better than.

I will remember how awesome it felt to be 7-0 and have the Bulldog nation rallying together from everywhere in the world. That was a very cool week. Seeing Hail State pictures from around the globe was awesome.

I will remember Chilly's helmet being used and how he got to meet Sherrill and Smoot and how happy he was that day.

I will remember that Kentucky, Auburn, Arkansas and Tennessee all fired their coaches this year and we beat all of them no doubt helping in the firings as MSU had supplanted them in the minds of the nation in the SEC pecking order.

I will also remember how 8-4 and headed to a 3rd straight bowl game feels oh so much better than embarrassing 3-9 seasons with really bad losses to LTech, UAB and Maine and that when I tell people now where I graduated from their immediate response is "oh you have a really good coach" instead of "that's Ole Miss right?".

And lastly I will remember that I love college football and I am already excited for the bowl game (really hope it's the Peach Bowl) and next season to see how MSU will be.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

Whole 10 minutes. Thanks. The hypothesis of how other 8-4 teams fared intrigued me, so I decided to take a look and pass along the findings. No smack - Believe my virtual silence regarding Saturday's game can back me up on that one - intended.

I deal only in facts. That's why I'm a cocky 17ing bastard.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

So the grand answer is that Penn State and Michigan beat a 9-3 Northwestern team. I think their fans probably feel the same way about their season as we do about ours.

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

So what? I'm SOOO past having a "competitive schedule"...

...8 (and soon 9) games in the SEC is competitive enough for anyone. We win 4 SEC games, we go undefeated in non-conference, we go to a bowl. Good formula. Remember the last time we tried "competitive"? We got skulldrugged by Oregon, Houston, Georgia Tech, etc. I'm dreading next year's Oklahoma State game.

 

[00Dawg]

This, this, a thousand times this.
It's hard for me to fathom the number of complaints I'm seeing when we're 4 years removed from Croom and a decade of near-irrelevance. If we're still topping out at 9 wins in 2020, we can talk.

 

[Dog of Tillo]

Now...taking Homer's list, let's ask this question: How many of those teams on that list(and I mean 8-4 teams plus their opponents) would have beaten any of the teams we lost to ?

 

[BiscuitEater]

So, I take it from your post ....

For those of you pumping sunshine about going 8-4, please look above. Those are our eight wins. Look at them. Look long and hard. Our best 17ing win is MTSU. That is 17ing embarrassing.

We played four teams with a pulse this year. We got our doors blown off in all four (average margin of defeat 23.25 points i.e. 3 17ing touchdowns).

You would feel much better "if" we had lost to a couple of those other teams?

 

[Dawg1976]

Ditto. Give me 4 cup cakes from now on and I will be happy. If we had tried the old formula this year, we would be sitting at 6-6 at best.

Look, we will never be happy right after a loss to OM, but we are still light years ahead of lot's of MSU teams I have seen in the past. Granted, there is plenty of room for improvement but I'm not going to hang my head over an 8-4 season.

 

[KurtRambis4]

What you have

to ask yourself is this; Would you rather have the season that we had (8-4 and a good bowl game) or a season like OM (6-6 with a crap bowl but plenty of morla victories!1!!)? This isn't a jab at the bears, they just happened to be the perfect example. You could insert any 6-6 crappy bowl bound team that had "moral" victories galore. To me, I pick the 8-4 every day of the week and twice on Sunday. You're letting your bear friends talk to much. 17 them.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

We have to get to this point, in order to take the next step. I fully believe we'll take a step and knock off one of the big boys next year. Record might not get better, but the team is improving....better recruits, better depth....all due to consistent winning and positive momentum.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

I don't remember advocating for a harder schedule. The record is irrelevant. If we went 12-0 but played an all SWAC schedule, would you be excited about that? We aren't improving. That's the point. We beat a bunch of nobodies. When we faced a team that actually could play, we got our doors blown off to the tune of three touchdowns each time. That sucks.

aGAIN, I'm not saying we have to beat Bama, A&M, LSU or Ole Miss. But we have to at least be competitive. You're on the wrong board if you can't see that.

 

[00Dawg]

LSU didn't blow our doors off, but yes, it would be nice to compete with the big boys like we did in 2009 and 2010, but I'm not going to play the impatient fan.

Anyway, most importantly I refuse to buy into what the non-improvement view would dictate as far as changes. We're light years better than we were from 2001 through 2008 (with one exception) where it matters: wins and losses. We see what short-sighted demands for change and thinking they had advanced (or deserved to return) to the next level got Kansas, Texas Tech, Michigan, West Virginia, and is probably about to get NC State. I'm going to continue to pump money into State athletics and tout Mullen's successes for the foreseeable future.

 

[Jacknut1]

Can't ***** about the SEC schedule. It is what it is. Not our fault those other programs pooped the bed this year. We don't suck and that's no sunshine pumping. If we sucked we would have lost to Auburn after they ran the 2nd half kickoff back and took the lead, we would have lost to UT when they pulled to within 3 with 5 min left, and we would have lost to Troy when they came back strong in the 4th quarter. We don't suck, but we are very average and we got thumped by better teams. Deal with it.

 

[CarlCoers]

I enjoy having the 6-6 team that was at least competitive with the great teams. I am not into moral victories, but these games were good indicators of progress in a season that was a write-off as the first brick of a complete rebuild. I'll take our team because of what it tells us about possibilities next year. We didn't beat anybody worth a damn (no offense), though neither did you, so there's no real telling how we will do in the next couple of years, but I feel good.

I also understand preferring the 8-4 team, though I think if you are honest Mullen seems to have taken a step backward this year and in year four doesn't have a signature win.

If we'd played a cupcake instead of Texas we might've had another win, or we might have just as easily been crappier after that game, having not been tested and had a gut-check.

Of course, its all relative. We are happy with our season because it shows wild improvement—because we started and rock bottom. Your season shows reversion, because you've had medium success in recent seasons.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

I think you pretty much nailed it.

 

[KurtRambis4]

See you

are putting way more into this. I know you took this as a knock on your beloved rebels but it wasn't.

At the basic leve, all ******** aside, we were an SEC team that was 8-4. I'll take that every single day of the week. SOS doesn't win you any kind of special prize. We had the hardest schedcule in the nation in 2009 and finished 5-7. You know what we were rewareded with for that tough schedule? Nothing.

 

[HueFreeze]

What did South Carolina average their 1st 4 years under the ol' Ball Coach, don't come here with we aren't improving ...have you even looked at our depth chart and who we are recruiting

if you are saying we aren't improving with Bama and LSU ...lets compare the records from the 60's; 70's; 80's; 90's; and 00's before we look at bama and lsu last year & this and msu last year and this

compare our situations that are equal to us... We are following the USC that Steve Spurrier did, I am sure we would all want to be where they are right now, remember how they skull17ed the SECEast Champ, but still came up short to go to Atlanta...

Alabama and Georgia had the two easiest schedules in the SEC, it is no coincidence they are playing for the National Title...

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

First of all, I don't have any bear friends so they've got nothing to do with it.

Secondly, I think that's a lot tougher question to answer than you might assume. Looking at Ole Miss' season and ours there's one big difference between them (other than our two extra wins). They have optimism heading into next year. We are questioning whether this is as good as it gets. So would I trade a win vs. Kentucky & Troy for a losses vs. UGA & Texas? If it meant that we played everyone tough (save Texas) instead of getting embarrassed (four times)? I'm not sure. That's a tough decision.

Thirdly, SOS doesn't win you a prize. But it tells you more about your team than your win-loss record. This isn't a question of who had the better season. It's a question of progress. We have not progressed as a team (irrespective of our opponents).

To give you an example, if we'd played a 2009-type schedule this year and gone 5-7, many would have called that regression. But you'd have to watch the games to know whether we were actually better or worse than last year. The record doesn't tell you that.

I watched the games this year. We are certainly not any better than last year and possibly worse.

ETA: I blame our regression (or lack of progression) almost totally on our defense. It was terrible this year. Just look at the rushing statistics. Pathetic.

 

[maroonmania]

...8 (and soon 9) games in the SEC is competitive enough for anyone. We win 4 SEC games, we go undefeated in non-conference, we go to a bowl. Good formula. Remember the last time we tried "competitive"? We got skulldrugged by Oregon, Houston, Georgia Tech, etc. I'm dreading next year's Oklahoma State game.

So true, and you can add 2 skulldraggings by West Virginia to your list as well.

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Can't ***** about the SEC schedule. It is what it is. Not our fault those other programs pooped the bed this year. We don't suck and that's no sunshine pumping. If we sucked we would have lost to Auburn after they ran the 2nd half kickoff back and took the lead, we would have lost to UT when they pulled to within 3 with 5 min left, and we would have lost to Troy when they came back strong in the 4th quarter. We don't suck, but we are very average and we got thumped by better teams. Deal with it.

We don't control the schedule. We do control recruiting, practice, play-calling, etc. Of the things we do control, we are not any better and in some cases much worse (defense).

 

[Jacknut1]

8-4 (4-4) is worse than 6-6 (2-6)? Take off the red and blue glasses! As far as "signature" win goes, beating you guys in 2009 and beating his former boss in 2010 at his place on homecoming was pretty "signature" for me.

 

[HueFreeze]

You know why most are not happy, but they should

out of 116 tries ...2012-1895, no team in '43

We have only won 8 games ...14 times ...2007, 2000, 1998, 1994, 1981, 1946, 1942, 1941, 1939, 1935
We have only won more than 8 ...4 times ...2010;1999;1974;1940

proof that our fanbase has no experience with having an ok season...

 

[CookieMonster.sixpack]

Have you looked at our season statistics. The defense has regressed every year since Manny's departure. That's a fact. We are giving up rushing yards like candy on halloween.

It's funny you mention South Carolina because the last time we played them was the last time we were actually competitive against a decent team. Too bad that was 18 games ago.

 

[johnson86-1]

to ask yourself is this; Would you rather have the season that we had (8-4 and a good bowl game) or a season like OM (6-6 with a crap bowl but plenty of morla victories!1!!)? This isn't a jab at the bears, they just happened to be the perfect example. You could insert any 6-6 crappy bowl bound team that had "moral" victories galore. To me, I pick the 8-4 every day of the week and twice on Sunday. You're letting your bear friends talk to much. 17 them.

We are in the exact opposite position from 2009. In 2009, you had to prefer Ole Miss's season, but it was clear that Ole Miss was trending down, had a DC that couldn't stop a spread offense, and MSU had a promising new head coach.

This year, you prefer MSU's season, but while MSU isn't trending down, we have a questinoable DC and there also appears to be something else going on with our Staff and/or team that has resulted in a loss of intensity, and Ole Miss has a promising head coach.

In 2009, I knew we were in teh better position moving forward. Right now, Ole Miss should be happy, but I'd prefer the position we're in unless and until it becomes clear that Mullen is burned out or has lost his competitive edge for some other reason. The other reason we should be more optimistic is that a lot of our issues now are the result of Dan taking two years to figure out recruiting in the SEC. I think we've resolved that issue, so we should be able to start moving forward again after next year if Mullen's heart is still in it and he's willing to cut ties with coaches that can't get the job done even though he personally likes them.

 

[IBleedMaroonDawg]

 

[FISHDAWG]

give up cookie ... I get your point and totally agree but saying that here won't get you any points ... some folks are like "it's not raining if you stay inside "

 

[SkinkTyree]

We were 3-5 in the SEC. Not 2-6. We squeaked one out against

Arkansas, pulled away at the end against Auburn, and utterly dominated Mississippi State. Those were our three wins. Just for clarification.

 

[KurtRambis4]

See you

are putting way more into it that should be. I am not looking at next season. I am not looking at SOS. I am looking at this season. I am looking at our record. We were 8-4. None of the rest matters, in regards to this year. You're basically taking the loss to OM (who is virtually dead even in he series over the past 20 years) as the sign of the coming of God and the end of the world.

Do I think we underperformed in areas this year? Yes. Do I think we could struggle next year? Yes. However, we are 8-4 this year. There's no reason to jump off a bridge over that.

 

[Jacknut1]

I was talking about MSU's record, Einstein. The bear I was replying to said we were getting worse.

 

[Jacknut1]

The point I was making, which seems to be flying over your heads, was that sucky teams don't go 8-4. Jackie's last 3 and Croom except for 2007 were sucky teams.

 

[SkinkTyree]

Ah, my mistake. I only scrolled over subject lines as I didn't

want to wade completely into this thread. Shouldn't have replied without fully immersing myself in this lunacy.

 

[HotMop]

If we'd beat Ole Miss none of this would matter.