The Next Two Years are Free

[DJ Spanky]

We're the only team that "gets beaten up." Everyone else has it easy and plays flag football.

Damnit, I knew there was a reason we were at a major disadvantage!

Not to pile on here, but if we're getting "beaten up," what does that say about our strength & conditioning program? And what does it say about the guy who hires the people who run that program?

Actually a major component of that is depth, more specifically our lack of depth. Most of our compatriots in the Big 10 have significant depth particular on the lines, so they can trot in replacements for a few series with very little fall off in quality of play. We aren't there, but we're finally starting to inch closer to that.

It says we need more money

Money, money, money, money!!! I'm still waiting for the program that asks Rutgers fans to sell extraneous body parts, such as that pesky extra kidney we all have.

 

[RUforlife]

We’re not looking up. We’re looking lateral and if you are suggesting we should be worlds ahead of them or VTech or Michigan State that’s silly. Gong 50% against those teams won’t do it. We need to be 80% against them to make a bowl game.

The first five games include Northwestern, Temple, Wagner, and Virginia Tech, anything less than a 4-1 record is simply unacceptable. And if in year 4 Schiano can't go 2-5 over the remaining conference schedule which includes an awful Indiana team than Schiano deserves to finally be held accountable. No more free years.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

The first five games include Northwestern, Temple, Wagner, and Virginia Tech, anything less than a 4-1 record is simply unacceptable. And if in year 4 Schiano can't go 2-5 over the remaining conference schedule which includes an awful Indiana team than Schiano deserves to finally be held accountable. No more free years.

The OL is worse than last year, expecting 6-6 is fools gold. This is likely a 4 win team maybe 5 tops if they catch a break.

 

[brgRC90]

That wasn’t the argument. We beat BC in a close game. They became a worse team after that game. Just as we were a worse team after Sutton went down (Michigan game prior season). It’s impossible to say how much. Certainly we were a worse team by the time we played Minnesota as we no longer had Sam Brown.

The team had a barely functioning offense last year. Unless the offense becomes at least average 6 wins is a pure fantasy.

 

[rutgersal_rivals139582]

Beat Northwestern, Indiana, Maryland, Temple, Wagner, and Virginia Tech in year 4 of a transfer portal era rebuild. That is not asking too much of any competent P5 coach.

We don’t have the opportunity to recruit the best kids in the portal, because there isn’t enough NIL support.

Maryland with Taulia Tagovailoa has been a particularly difficult game for us the last few years. We would need Wimsatt to outplay him, which is possible, but not likely. Northwestern is another difficult but winnable game for us.

 

[rutgersal_rivals139582]

Only Greg has the secret sauce??? No one else could recruit at Rutgers like Greg? You see what prime is doing in Colorado???

Ok, honest question. For your wank material are you using pics of Greg circa 2006 or silver fox greg of today?

Prime is backed by an army of boosters willing to spend money to make Colorado the best it can be. We have an army of posters running their mouth on the messageboard.

 

[rutgersal_rivals139582]

Not to pile on here, but if we're getting "beaten up," what does that say about our strength & conditioning program? And what does it say about the guy who hires the people who run that program?

I think we have caught up to most of the Big Ten from a strength and conditioning perspective. 4 years of Jay Butler is enough. Our problem is the lack of talent. Schiano says the ‘24 class gives him the talent to win, and I agree.

 

[rutgersal_rivals139582]

Fine, but still the argument that we beat BC only by one because we had been beaten up by our Big Ten opponents (none of whom we had played) doesn't hold water.

BC was game one and we were close to full strength. And BC was close to full strength as well. We won a war of attrition with them. By the end of the game, they were spent. Unfortunately, by the Minnesota game, we were spent as well.

 

[rutgersal_rivals139582]

The OL is worse than last year, expecting 6-6 is fools gold. This is likely a 4 win team maybe 5 tops if they catch a break.

This is a 4-6 win team. 6 wins if we’re perfect in our winnable games, which isn’t likely.

 

[Knight Shift]

Prime is backed by an army of boosters willing to spend money to make Colorado the best it can be. We have an army of posters running their mouth on the messageboard.

I think we have caught up to most of the Big Ten from a strength and conditioning perspective. 4 years of Jay Butler is enough. Our problem is the lack of talent. Schiano says the ‘24 class gives him the talent to win, and I agree.

More internal inconsistency from you, and with each reply you make a bigger fool of yourself, or you are just trolling for attention.

First you say NIL money is a problem at RU. Then you say the 24 class gives Greg the talent to win? NIL was not a factor in 20-22 classes. It was on Greg to get the best recruits from the start. Are you giving him a free pass on 20-22? That's lame.

And nice job throwing our QB under the bus. Be a better fan.

 

[rutgersal_rivals139582]

More internal inconsistency from you, and with each reply you make a bigger fool of yourself, or you are just trolling for attention.

First you say NIL money is a problem at RU. Then you say the 24 class gives Greg the talent to win? NIL was not a factor in 20-22 classes. It was on Greg to get the best recruits from the start. Are you giving him a free pass on 20-22? That's lame.

And nice job throwing our QB under the bus. Be a better fan.

There is no internal consistency. First, Kids have been getting NIL since the ‘21 Class. Wimsatt got an NIL deal to come to Rutgers.
But no one else did due to lack of support. ‘21 there was a trickle of players. ‘22 more players such as Arch Manning received NIL deals. The floodgates opened for the ‘23 class and this will continue, which puts us at a competitive disadvantage.

We can still add to our talent base even though we don’t have NIL as a tool to accelerate the process of doing so. We are doing so through the recruitment of 2 and 3 star kids who have the aptitude to contribute at this level. Roughly 50% will wash out, but 50% will become contributors.

The Ray Rice class of 2005 put us over the top, and the expectation is that the ‘24 class will have a similar impact.

- Ray Rice was a 3 star
- Devin McCourty was a 2 star
- Jason McCourty was a 2 star
- Kevin Malast was a three star

The lack of NIL significantly reduces the chances of recruiting the 4 and 5 star kid. So we have been improving the talent base slowly over four recruiting classes. The ‘24 class will be the 5th.

Contrast that with USC, who bought the best team money could buy last year, and went from a 4-8 losing season to 11-3 in one year. If we had USC support, we could have shown similar improvement. But we don’t, so this is a slow build.

 

[DJ Spanky]

And nice job throwing our QB under the bus. Be a better fan.

His solution, as always, encompasses attacking those participate here and elsewhere. Typical.

We have an army of posters running their mouth on the messageboard.

Your lack of comprehension and knowledge exposes you as a fool.

 

[-RUFAN4LIFE-]

More internal inconsistency from you, and with each reply you make a bigger fool of yourself, or you are just trolling for attention.

First you say NIL money is a problem at RU. Then you say the 24 class gives Greg the talent to win? NIL was not a factor in 20-22 classes. It was on Greg to get the best recruits from the start. Are you giving him a free pass on 20-22? That's lame.

And nice job throwing our QB under the bus. Be a better fan.

Let’s not forget that if ‘24 class gives Greg the talent to win, most of them don’t start impacting the roster in large numbers until the ‘26 season. So he’s pushing the timeline out even further.

 

[Section124]

This is a 4-6 win team. 6 wins if we’re perfect in our winnable games, which isn’t likely.

Just curious Al. Which 3 teams (besides Wagner) do we beat this year. I assume you have us beating Temple and Indiana. I assume Northwestern and VT are a toss up.

 

[gtbb3115]

We don’t have the opportunity to recruit the best kids in the portal, because there isn’t enough NIL support.

Maryland with Taulia Tagovailoa has been a particularly difficult game for us the last few years. We would need Wimsatt to outplay him, which is possible, but not likely. Northwestern is another difficult but winnable game for us.

You dont need the best kids in the portal to go 6-6. Northwestern got a quality QB and 2 wr tranfers. VT got 3 wr transfers. We got transfers ourselves but time will tell who did better improving their deficiencies. The point is no one is waiting for us to improve. They are all doing the same things we are. Greg is gonna have to coach the way you think he can coach to get us to 6-6.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

The first five games include Northwestern, Temple, Wagner, and Virginia Tech, anything less than a 4-1 record is simply unacceptable. And if in year 4 Schiano can't go 2-5 over the remaining conference schedule which includes an awful Indiana team than Schiano deserves to finally be held accountable. No more free years.

Let’s say your right and we beat NW and VTech. By the way - both those teams could improve too. We have no idea. But even still - your throwing out that 2-5 number as if that should be “easy”. Let me ask you this. Do you think with Leipold as coach (or whoever today’s flavor of the day is) - we would be a SLAM DUNK to win one of OSU, Michigan, Penn State, @ Wisconsin, @ Iowa? Because that’s 5 of the games right there and I say odds are anyone who we’d have as coach would be heavy underdogs in every one these games. 0-5 highly likely.

So basically, what your saying is that in addition to winning the NW and VTech games, it should be automatic that we go 2-1 against Michigan State, Maryland and Indiana. If Schiano can’t do it - bye bye. There’s no doubt these other guys would be doing it no problem year in and out?

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

You dont need the best kids in the portal to go 6-6. Northwestern got a quality QB and 2 wr tranfers. VT got 3 wr transfers. We got transfers ourselves but time will who did better improving their deficiencies. The point is no one is waiting for us to improve. They are all doing the same things we are. Greg is gonna have to coach the way you think he can coach to get us to 6-6.

Correct. The difference is that NW and VTech do not have to play OSU, Michigan and PSU for 3 automatic losses. VTech doesn’t even play Clemson next year. So of course getting to6-6 is easier. They have one game @ Florida State and the rest of their conference games are similar to our Maryland and Indiana games.

 

[gtbb3115]

Let’s say your right and we beat NW and VTech. By the way - both those teams could improve too. We have no idea. But even still - your throwing out that 2-5 number as if that should be “easy”. Let me ask you this. Do you think with Leipold as coach (or whoever today’s flavor of the day is) - we would be a SLAM DUNK to win one of OSU, Michigan, Penn State, @ Wisconsin, @ Iowa? Because that’s 5 of the games right there and I say odds are anyone who we’d have as coach would be heavy underdogs in every one these games. 0-5 highly likely.

So basically, what your saying is that in addition to winning the NW and VTech games, it should be automatic that we go 2-1 against Michigan State, Maryland and Indiana. If Schiano can’t do it - bye bye. There’s no doubt these other guys would be doing it no problem year in and out?

Dont think we would be favorites to win against any of those power teams but Leipold would have had at least 1 or 2 wins against them within 4 years.

 

[gtbb3115]

Correct. The difference is that NW and VTech do not have to play OSU, Michigan and PSU for 3 automatic losses. VTech doesn’t even play Clemson next year. So of course getting to6-6 is easier. They have one game @ Florida State and the rest of their conference games are similar to our Maryland and Indiana games.

Im not comparing our schedule with there's. lol Im talking about our match ups with them. Teams are trying to get better just like us. No one is waiting for us to catch up. Including big10 teams.

 

[RUforlife]

Let’s say your right and we beat NW and VTech. By the way - both those teams could improve too. We have no idea. But even still - your throwing out that 2-5 number as if that should be “easy”. Let me ask you this. Do you think with Leipold as coach (or whoever today’s flavor of the day is) - we would be a SLAM DUNK to win one of OSU, Michigan, Penn State, @ Wisconsin, @ Iowa? Because that’s 5 of the games right there and I say odds are anyone who we’d have as coach would be heavy underdogs in every one these games. 0-5 highly likely.

So basically, what your saying is that in addition to winning the NW and VTech games, it should be automatic that we go 2-1 against Michigan State, Maryland and Indiana. If Schiano can’t do it - bye bye. There’s no doubt these other guys would be doing it no problem year in and out?

In year 4 of a rebuild a legitimate P5 coach should be expected to pull off at least one upset of a quality opponent. The idea that in year 4 Schiano gets a free pass against PSU, Michigan, MSU, Wisconsin and Iowa is to be very frank, pathetic.

 

[gtbb3115]

How did we get to the point where people start caring more about how easy it is for teams in other conferences than we they care about Rutgers being good? What's the point of being in the Big10 if we are gonna make excuses for incompetent coaching?

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

Im not comparing our schedule with there's. lol Im talking about our match ups with them. Teams are trying to get better just like us. No one is waiting for us to catch up. Including big10 teams.

Exactly - and 3-2 against Maryland, Michigan State, Indiana, Virginia Tech, and NW isn’t good enough. That only gets us to 5-7 unless we pull a major upset. Our fans are underestimating just how hard it is to go 4-1 in these games. If we were playing Purdue, Illinois and Minnesota instead of say OSU, PSU and Iowa the margin of error would be completely different. Going 4-4 or 5-3 in 8 winnable games is a much less daunting task than having to go 4-1 in 5 winnable games.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

In year 4 of a rebuild a legitimate P5 coach should be expected to pull off at least one upset of a quality opponent. The idea that in year 4 Schiano gets a free pass against PSU, Michigan, MSU, Wisconsin and Iowa is to be very frank, pathetic.

So I guess your saying that Leipold better beat a 2 loss B12 team or go on the road and beat an 8 win team in conference or Kansas should send him packing too.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

How did we get to the point where people start caring more about how easy it is for teams in other conferences than we they care about Rutgers being good? What's the point of being in the Big10 if we are gonna make excuses for incompetent coaching?

Nobody cares how these other teams do. The point is that you can’t point to these other teams that get to 6 wins against bad teams and say their coaches would do better at Rutgers than ours. It would be one thing if we were losing the Eastern Michigan and Buffalo games on our schedule. We haven’t lost OOC yet period. As I said, if we lose the Temple game, let’s talk then.

 

[gtbb3115]

Exactly - and 3-2 against Maryland, Michigan State, Indiana, Virginia Tech, and NW isn’t good enough. That only gets us to 5-7 unless we pull a major upset. Our fans are underestimating just how hard it is to go 4-1 in these games. If we were playing Purdue, Illinois and Minnesota instead of say OSU, PSU and Iowa the margin of error would be completely different. Going 4-4 or 5-3 in 8 winnable games is a much less daunting task than having to go 4-1 in 5 winnable games.

I know. I never made an argument against that I was responding to Al on post #535.

 

[gtbb3115]

Nobody cares how these other teams do. The point is that you can’t point to these other teams that get to 6 wins against bad teams and say their coaches would do better at Rutgers than ours. It would be one thing if we were losing the Eastern Michigan and Buffalo games on our schedule. We haven’t lost OOC yet period. As I said, if we lose the Temple game, let’s talk then.

Dont tell me no one cares. It has become the default response when other teams turnaround comes up. Kansas, Illnois, Maryland, Uconn Cuse. People like to mention how they are not in the big ten, they dont have to face OSU and UMIch etc. Pointing out how much easier it is for them doesnt make us any better. How many times are we gonna mention that to justify our 4-8 records? Kids see wins and losses. They dont break down schedules the way we do.

 

[NickRU714]

Dont tell me no one cares. It has become the default response when other teams turnaround comes up. Kansas, Illnois, Maryland, Uconn Cuse. People like to mention how they are not in the big ten, they dont have to face OSU and UMIch etc.. Its annoying. Pointing out how much easier it is for them doesnt make us any better. Kids see wins and losses. They dont break down schedules they way we do. Greg got kids to commit in his first stint because he sold them on wins. Teams that win will do the same.

You're conviently ignoring that Rutgers gets uniquely screwed by having to schedule 9 Big Ten teams a year while other teams do not.

Hopefully one of these years the Big Ten Conference stops screwing us and doesn't force us to play all these Big Ten teams.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

Dont tell me no one cares. It has become the default response when other teams turnaround comes up. They are not in the big ten, they dont have to face OSU and UMIch etc.. Its annoying. Pointing out how much easier it is for them doesnt make us any better. Kids see wins and losses. They dont break down schedules they way we do. Greg got kids to commit in his first stint because he sold them on wins. Teams that win will do the same.

I’m not following. Are you saying that there SHOULD be an outcry to replace our coach with theirs even though it’s quite possible the coach we already have would perform better than them against similar competition? I don’t get it. The people making these comments are responding to the suggestion that another coach would be successful at Rutgers because he wins 6-7 games in an easier conference.

Look at Hafley. Everyone thought he was on the rise until we beat him last year. He had a better record than us the year before. Big deal. The point is it means nothing. Schiano already proved he can produce consistent bowl caliber teams in a middling conference.

 

[RUforlife]

So I guess your saying that Leipold better beat a 2 loss B12 team or go on the road and beat an 8 win team in conference or Kansas should send him packing too.

Leipold last year beat Oklahoma St, Iowa St, WVU, Houston, Duke, and lost by 7 points to TCU. You really want to judge Greg in year 4 against that record after 2 years? According to your friend Al, Greg gets 2 more free years. I don't think Leipold is working on that same time frame. LOL!!

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

Leipold last year beat Oklahoma St, Iowa St, WVU, Houston, Duke, and lost by 7 points to TCU. You really want to judge Greg in year 4 against that record after 2 years? According to your friend Al, Greg gets 2 more free years. I don't think Leipold is working on that same time frame. LOL!!

Kansas’ performance following that TCU game looks eerily similar to how we faired after Sutton went down in that Michigan heartbreaker.

As for last year. We lost our plan A and plan B QBs from day one. And lost our top RB after the Indiana game. How do you think Kansas or any other team would look on their 3rd string QB for training camp and down their best RB. How many first team reps do you think Evan got in pre season practice?

 

[gtbb3115]

You're conviently ignoring that Rutgers gets uniquely screwed by having to schedule 9 Big Ten teams a year while other teams do not.

Hopefully one of these years the Big Ten Conference stops screwing us and doesn't force us to play all these Big Ten teams.

Another excuse. How great it is being in the Big10. We get to talk about how hard it is to play in the league and make excuses for the coach. Hooray, exactly how I envisioned being invited to the Big10.

 

[gtbb3115]

I’m not following. Are you saying that there SHOULD be an outcry to replace our coach with theirs even though it’s quite possible the coach we already have would perform better than them against similar competition? I don’t get it. The people making these comments are responding to the suggestion that another coach would be successful at Rutgers because he wins 6-7 games in an easier conference.

Look at Hafley. Everyone thought he was on the rise until we beat him last year. He had a better record than us the year before. Big deal. The point is it means nothing. Schiano already proved he can produce consistent bowl caliber teams in a middling conference.

I didnt mention Hafley. Besides he should be struggling as a first time HC. Most thought we were on the rise during Greg 2.0.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

I didnt mention Hafley. Besides he should be struggling as a first time HC. Most thought we were on the rise during Greg 2.0.

Several years ago that’s what everyone was saying. We made the mistake of not hiring him…. Now it’s Lance because he had a good year. Could’ve been someone like Flood after 2014. Sometimes everything goes right and you win all the 50 / 50 games.

 

[RUforlife]

Kansas’ performance following that TCU game looks eerily similar to how we faired after Sutton went down in that Michigan heartbreaker.

As for last year. We lost our plan A and plan B QBs from day one. And lost our top RB after the Indiana game. How do you think Kansas or any other team would look on their 3rd string QB for training camp and down their best RB. How many first team reps do you think Evan got in pre season practice?

I am not busting Greg's balls for year 3, however, I am stating that in year 4 when he has his 4 star QB in place and ready to go there are no more free years. No excuses, he needs to deliver this year, not year 6.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

I am not busting Greg's balls for year 3, however, I am stating that in year 4 when he has his 4 star QB in place and ready to go there are no more free years. No excuses, he needs to deliver this year, not year 6.

Everything your saying would be spot on. Except that to this point, our promising 4 star QB has looked like a complete bust beyond the scope of what could be realistically pinned on a coach or the surrounding cast of players. It’s been point blank lack of accuracy even when the opponent is a team like Wagner.


Let’s hope that changes next year

 

[brgRC90]

His solution, as always, encompasses attacking those participate here and elsewhere. Typical.

It's OUR fault the team can't get past midfield because apparently our talent is that bad, even though one of Schiano's selling points is that he's allegedly a great recruiter. I'd like to see Al go to a practice and tell the players they suck and have no talent.

 

[PSAL_Hoops]

It's OUR fault the team can't get past midfield because apparently our talent is that bad, even though one of Schiano's selling points is that he's allegedly a great recruiter. I'd like to see Al go to a practice and tell the players they suck and have no talent.

Our talent at QB looks worrisome to me. I’m not a believer that Wimsatt is going to turn things around. I really hope to be proven wrong. I think we’ve improved in other areas but if he can’t complete a pass I think we’re still in trouble.

 

[rutgersguy1_rivals]

It's paywall but for those that have the Athletic. A re-rank of the 2019 recruiting class giving a top 25 4 years later.

It goes more in depth but just to give some numbers.

NC State at 8, Pitt at 9, Utah 12, Oregon State 13, UTSA 14, Illinois 17, Fresno State 20

Outside the top 25 but no blurbs about them
UAB 26, WF 27, SMU 28, Purdue 30, TCU 31, Tulane 34


From the article:

The scoring system for grading these classes remains the same 0-to-5 scale inspired by the recruiting industry’s star system. We are grading scholarship players and walk-ons who earned scholarships based on what they’ve achieved over four years, not what they might do in the future.

5 points: All-American, award winner, top-50 NFL Draft pick
4: Multiyear starter, all-conference honors
3: One-year starter or key reserve
2: Career backup
0: Minor or no contribution

Because class sizes vary, we focus on class average (total points divided by total signees) as the measuring stick. A bonus is added to each class based on its four-year record. The attrition rate listed counts all signees who left school due to transfer, grad transfer, dismissal, ineligibility or injury. Players are graded by their contribution to the program regardless of whether they transferred. The impact of the portal era is clearly creeping into these rankings: Among this year’s top 25, the average class attrition rate was 49 percent.

 

[Tom_PSU]

I can see a legitimate path for Rutgers to win six games this year. First in Temple and Va. Tech you have two tomato cans. One a perpetual doormat with resources that are well below Rutgers. The other with a rebuilding team with a new inexperienced coach whose seat is already warming up in his second season. Finally a joke game with Wagner. I’m not criticizing, everyone with a brain is scheduling likewise.

Next NW and IND are probably the least talented teams in the BIG. ( Al’s contradictory and confusing statements notwithstanding ). That should provide a realistic opportunity for 2 more wins. Success against OSU, PSU and UM this year seems highly unlikely, but perhaps you steal one of the remaining four. Five wins should be the acceptable minimum no matter who’s coaching. Four or less four years into a rebuild in the modern landscape is unacceptable, and Schiano should be sent packing.

Because truth be told you are what your record says you are. I don’t have any skin in this game either way, just trying to be as objective as possible.

 

[rutgersguy1_rivals]

You're conviently ignoring that Rutgers gets uniquely screwed by having to schedule 9 Big Ten teams a year while other teams do not.

Hopefully one of these years the Big Ten Conference stops screwing us and doesn't force us to play all these Big Ten teams.

You know the other thing is, schools in these other conferences also get less conference revenue than us. Things are relative.

People always make fun of these conferences that make less money or whatever but I always say opportunity is there. You're competing against schools in the same boat as you and there's still inclusion so the opportunity for accomplishments, even big ones, still exists. I remember when the BE basketball schools were left behind quite a few thought they'd die on the vine but Villanova/UConn have one national championships and I think the conference has done okay on the whole.

Also I've said OSU is really the only Mount Everest, everyone is else is beatable in a given year.