AL Schiano didn't help build anything at Miami. They were the team of the decade (90's) He was there for a little over 16 months. The players he recruited there didn't even see the field until he was long gone.
The Next Two Years are Free
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It’s not the alignment. It’s the alignees. Two more years and we’ll have enough talent to give any quarterback a good chance of being successful.
Right now there a big question marks as to who will catch the ball. Kids want to be in Situations where they are assured of success. Since our receiving Corp has recently struggled, we couldn’t offer them that opportunity. But soon we will be in position to do so.
Keep saying that AL. It's like your mantra. It is both the alignment and alignees. When you are playing a style of football (alignment) that very little talent (alignees) are attracted to, you will have a problem succeeding.
Wrong. DJ Williams was the number 1 recruit in the country and starting linebacker for the Hurricanes National Championship Team. Vince Wilfork had an exemplary NFL career. Jonathan Vilma was one of the best linebackers to ever come out of the University of Miami.
Not wrong. DJ Williams played fullback his freshmen year 2000 because he couldn't get on the field while Schiano was there. DJ didn't play LB until Schiano was gone. Vilma was recruited to Miami before Schiano was involved and was back up while Schiano was there. Wilfork on the other hand was somewhat recruited to Miami by Schiano but didn't set foot on campus until Schiano was gone.
My brother attended Miami and payed there. Stop!
For 10 years, people swore up and down that all we needed to do was switch to a spread offense, and all our offensive issues would be cured. Problem is, you’re not going to have an effective offense if the line doesn’t block and the kids don’t catch.
Now we have a spread offense and the offense still sucks. It would still suck no matter what offense we ran, imo. More than the alignment itself, kids are attracted to results. Those have been short for us on the offensive side of the ball.
This year, we are going to see incremental improvement, a flicker that will make it easier to recruit kids going forward on the offensive side of the ball.
In two years, the offense will be ready to go.
We are in agreement on much of what you say above. The O is only as good as what is up front. O line play has been lacking I think mostly due to inferior coaching and technique. The guys up front haven't been coached at a D1 level since Schiano took over.
Where I am not in agreement is we don't have a spread offense. The offense is the furthest thing from RPO or spread. It's quite simply predictable and pre-dertimined. The formations, play-calling and execution are lacking.
Wrong again. Vilma was recruiting class of ‘00, and Schiano had a hand in recruiting that class. So what if he was a backup. That’s not uncommon for a freshman.
I went to the University of Miami in 2001, and knew many of the players, so you can’t BS me. Bryant McKinnie lived in the same place that I did. Here is a write up.
The Hurricanes defense had to bail the offense out a few times in 2001. The defense for the 2001 Miami football team was anchored by safety Ed Reed and a deep secondary and a pair of all-American linebackers in Jonathan Vilma and D.J. Williams.
The ability of the Miami defense to create points amped the pressure on opposing offenses. The Hurricane led the nation allowing 9.4 PPG in 2001. The defense’s ability to score at a clip or more than 30 percent of what the offense allowed was likely unprecedented.
We can’t change what’s happened in the past. Going forward, our guys will be better coached. Everyone agrees that the offense stinks.
with better personnel and direction, the offense will gradually get better.
BS'ing what the hell are you talking about? I stated facts. You left out the other 2 examples coincidentally. Didn't deny Vilma was '00. Schiano was hired in April of 99. He had minimal effect on Vilma's recruitment. Much of the heavy lift was done. Yes Vilma was a back up as freshmen. As you say nothing wrong with that. But he blossomed well after Schiano was gone. Not raining on the effect Schiano had on the Miami program. Merely pointing out Schiano did not "build" anything there. The "U " was the Alabama and Clemson of the 80' and 90's.
Between 1983 and 2001, Miami won 5 national championships. Their championship brand was well established before Schiano got there.
I agree others could build a winner at Rutgers, but I feel when Greg was hired to rebuild the program he once made a winner, those others wouldn't even interview for the job after third party talks shown that Rutgers wasn't going to give what they felt would make taking the job worthwhile .
Schiano got there at the end of their run. He benefitted from everyone else's work. Anyone could've recruited Miami in 2000. He's a good recruiter but he's not the reason Miami won a NC.
Simple fact.:
He was not there when they won it, so cannot take credit for the reason they did. Randy Shannon was the DC.
Lol I was thinking to myself I thought Larry Coker took over after both GS left to here then BD to the Browns, am I getting old and misremembering.
thank you for the correction, simple fact:
I was wrong, but still feel Schiano was a reason the U had a good D
but admit Shannon helped bring home the bacon not Greg
but not so old as to jump on what someone says and look foolish by giving a wrong answer> deserving this:
Instead of making OC McNulty the highest OC ever, then hiring HC Schiano then making OC KC the highest paid OC ever - should the AD have gone cheap for the coaching staff and just put all that money into infrastructure?
If having highly paid coaches isn't the answer - divert resources to what matters: the fieldhouse?
Resources are finite and expenses need to be prioritized.
He called plays well for Miami, basically, but since he wasn't there long enough to recruit or develop much of the talent you can't say he was some kind of great builder of NC-caliber defenses. It was mostly not his players.
Exactly right. @rutgersal should say hello to Jim L. Mora at UConn. The program was left for dead. 4-32 in the 3 seasons that preceded him.
Year 1- he has UConn beating a 10-4 Fresno State, beating a Utah State bowl team, beating BC 13-3 (better than RU's margin) and beating an 8-5 Liberty coached by Hugh Freeze, taking UConn bowling.
One year does not make program, but Al needs to stop with the lame excuses and the number of years needed for a turnaround.
But we also must think about if Rutgers was offering enough to bring in a qualified HC willing to accept what Hobbs was offering.
All the talk we could have done better is true, but the question is was RU offering enough to make the type of HC needed willing to come ???
Rutgers was a graveyard for HCs before Greg arrived the first time becase it was running the program on the cheap.
Before he accepted the position he had a lost of demands that must be met before he'd take the job.
When Mulcahy promise to get it done, Schiano accepted the job
Can't say how many turned their back on RU, but it has been said Greg wasn't first choice.
Schiano's return engagement didn't just happen, IT TOOK tough negotiations between him and Hobbs before he took the job and mainly because Hobbs felt pressure from the fanbase and gave in to most of Greg's demands .
No one can be sure if through 3rd parties hearing what Rutgers would be offering top candidates felt RU wasn't offering enough salary and support for them to even take an interview for the position
I'm with the we could have done better crowd, I just feel RU wouldn't pay the price it took to bring any of them in and those that would accept less were bigger gambles than Greg
If our coaches are inexperienced, what does that say about GS's ability to recruit coaching talent or judgment in how to hire? And if he can't recruit good coaches, what does that say about his abiity to recruit and develop good players?
More fundamentally, nothing is "free." I am sure that even you would want to fire Schiano if the team is significantly worse the next two years.
I am all in favor of optimism and in being supportive of the program. I am not in favor of moonshine.
The programs like ours that do best are not the ones that hire big name coaches for boatloads of money. They're the ones that hire coaches from down below. Look at Kansas. They hired Les Miles, and he fizzled. They promoted a guy from lower down and he turned the team around. Rutgers and it's fans have to get the idea out of their head that we can only hire coaches from P5 programs. Most of those guys fail miserably and for a lot of money.
agree, but must have an excellent resume to be worth the gamble.
Then there are those from mid majors ( or even lower classification) that might be excellent candidates, better then P-5 retreads, that look at what the challenge facing the program is and what RU is offering, then decide the offer isn't enough to be willing to risk their career .
They know better offers will come from programs willing to give them the salary and support necessary for them to feel like they can make a winner there.
but was any other program interested in him after he was bought out by UCLA in 2017, or did he wait till the last payment was made on his $12 million buyout before looking for work.Jim Mora is making $1.5M per year.
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UCLA must pay more than $12 million to buy out the remainder of Mora's contract, which runs through 2021. The school announced that Mora's contract will be "honored by UCLA Athletics, exclusively using department-generated funds."Nov 20, 2017"
Could have been one time cash payout, but usually buyout is spread out for life of contract and any other coaching earnings deducted from it.
When Greg was dumped by TB he held outlooking for the right spot until his contract with the Bucs expired and no more buyourt payments were coming, then took Ohio State DC job.
Mora probably did the same, look for gold while being paid by old employer , settle for silver when payment stopped and it stoped after Rutgers found Ash's replacement.
Sometimes there's more to a picture than what you see taking a quick glance
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that's if he was looking when RU was looking and might have not been offered what Greg fought for.
It could be Rutgers was offering silver when Mora felt he deserved to be considered worth gold and wouldn't settle for less until he needed to find work.
Chris Klieman, Lance Leipold, Dave Clawson, Matt Campbell from the lower levels and have done solid jobs thus far.
Jonathan Smith at Oregon State was a non descript P5 OC at Washington. Mike Elko a little more high profile but didn’t get a lot of P5 HC offers before Duke.
People act like these multimillion dollar jobs grow on trees. The way contracts are written these days, the jobs are even more lucrative. Can some coaches be choosy? Sure, but the I think the majority aren’t so much and will entertain an opportunity.
These guys would jump at the chance to coach at a P5 program. It's ridiculous to say nobody would come here. Our football experts.
the question I ask myself and bug others in my replies:
would those HCs have taken the job if they felt the administration wasn't going to support them enough to be successful there.
I feel RU probably gave an impression of limited financial support which made top candidates leery of risking their careers coaching RU..
4 million sounds like a great payday, 8 year contract gravy , but were those figures out there when looking for Ash 's replacement and was Hobbs talking to 3rd parties promising to do what it takes to make RU FB competitive.
Or was it more like on the cheap, but you will be leading a P-5 program
being the type of third part discussions from people unofficially talking for Hobbs.
I can't say how it really was, but over the years feel like RU goes the cheap route unless forced to pony up and doesen't alys try for the best because the best expect too much
all coaches don't jump on every oppertunity, they weigh chances to succeed
when looking at possible landing places.
Careers are ruined by wrong choices , taking a position with a program that doesn't give enough support to have a successful program
These weren’t top level candidates that I mentioned. They’re solid names but by no means the cream of the crop in the years they were hired. Elko would probably be the highest profile of the bunch but even he was sort of high profile but under the radar. If they were so sought after they would have had bigger jobs come after them but they didn’t.
So my answer would be yea candidates with similar profiles would take the job. It’s up to the AD to pick the right one. It’s always crap shoot to some degree and if it works great and if not try again.
Hindsight is 20/20, of course. Hiring GS made sense because he was the one candidate with the leverage to get Rutgers to committ to providing resources. It's not his fault that NILhas made facilities less important. Hiring GS also created excitement, which was, to say the least, badly needed after his predecessor.
I'm disappointed in him so far. Perhaps this is a little thing but he doesn't act at press conferences like he still has fire in the belly. But he's not going anywhere anytime soon, so we're best off rooting that he can do the job. Maybe we've *finally* found the right OC. OTOH, we shouldn't act, as @rutgersal would have it, like the team's record the next two years doesn't matter.
I'm disappointed in him so far. Perhaps this is a little thing but he doesn't act at press conferences like he still has fire in the belly. But he's not going anywhere anytime soon, so we're best off rooting that he can do the job. Maybe we've *finally* found the right OC. OTOH, we shouldn't act, as @rutgersal would have it, like the team's record the next two years doesn't matter.
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Jonathan Smith ( Oregon State) took a few years to build that program
Elko did a fine job at Duke, the program was turning into a disaster, but the old HC Cutcliffe did a good job there for awhile
Chris Klieman, Lance Leipold, Dave Clawson,and Matt Campbell would have been great choices.
Campbell has been mentioned a lot when openings pop up and it seems like he is waiting for the right spot before he leaves Iowa State.
He might expect more than RU is willing to give
Clawson seems set with the Deacons, so it might take a lot to get him to RU and will be too much for RU to offer him.
Chris Klieman and Lance Leipold are solid in my book and Klieman would have been my first choice to hire over Greg. Lance I wouldn't have objected to if he got the nod over Schiano
Klieman was in his first year as KCU's HC so might not have thought about a change when Ash was dumped.
Leipold might be one that would go for less than he would get at RU if he felt the rewards would be greater and didn't think RU would back the program enough to give him a chance to be successful if he took the job.
His first year's W-L record as the Jayhawks HC would have most here wishing Greg was hired instead , but his second would gain fans.
I just think coaches like Lance, Chris, and the others look at RU as a professional graveyard because it hedges its bets when it comes to investing fully in the making of a winner
I wasn’t talking about hiring them here when we needed a hire or now. It was more about you every opportunity to get a solid hire regardless of what P5 school you are and it doesn’t have to be some big shot name.
I go away for 2 days and I see the game of Whack A Mole with al continues.
No, he got 3 years and 4 games, he was fired after starting 2019 1-3 which included a brutal 30-0 loss to Iowa and at 52-0 shellacking at the hands of Michigan.
No, he got 3 years and 4 games, he was fired after starting 2019 1-3 which included a brutal 30-0 loss to Iowa and at 52-0 shellacking at the hands of Michigan.
The U was not Alabama of the 90’s. Miami encountered a Pell Grant scandal and was put on probation, resulting in a 5-6 record in ‘97. These are the following records for Miami after Butch Davis was named Coach, up until their MNC year.
1995 8-3
1996 9-3
1997 5-6
1998 9-3
1999 9-4
2000 11-1
2001 12-0
Greg Schiano was hired in ‘99 after Miami’s defense was terrible, and they gave up 66 pts to Syracuse and 45 points to UCLA. He improved the defense to 12th in points allowed in ‘99, then 5th in ‘00. Greg Schiano joined a solid Miami team, and left it, elite, deserving to play for the National Championship, but being left out to a team it defeated (FSU).
He gets credit for the ‘00 class, period. In an elite program, he would be an elite recruiter. Rutgers is not an elite program, though we’re trying to build it into one, but progress is slow here due to the constraints involved.