The numbers......

[HD6]

This list is only players that played at least 2 years in the NBA.

2002 Tourney

Maryland-Juan Dixon, Steve Blake, Lonny Baxter, Chris Wilcox
Kentucky-Tayshaun Prince, Keith Bogans
Southern Illinois-None that I can find
UConn-Ben Gordon, Emeka Okafor, Caron Butler
Kansas-Drew Gooden, Nick Collison, Kirk Heinrich, Wayne Simien
Illinois-Brian Cook, Luther Head, Frank Williams
Texas-TJ Ford, Royal Ivey
Oregon-Fred Jones, Luke Jackson, Luke Ridnour
Duke-Carlos Boozer, Mike Dunleavy, Dahntay Jones, Chris Duhon (And lest we forget number 2 overall pick Jason Williams who's career ended on a motorcycle)
Pitt-None that I could find
Kent State-None that I could find, but they had a guy named Antonio Gates who's done pretty well in other fields
UCLA-Jason Kapono, Dan Gadzuric
Mizzou-Kareem Rush
Arizona-Luke Walton, Salim Stoudamire, Channing Frye
Oklahoma-None that I could find

So, 12 out of 16 teams had at least one guy who played multiple years in the NBA. No one on the MSU roster from that season has ever played a minute in the NBA.

2003 Tournament
Oklahoma-Hey, look at that. That Kelvin Sampson is a great coach when he isn't texting illegally.
Butler-What do you think?
Syracuse-Carmelo Anthony, Hakim Warrick
Auburn-Marquis Daniels
Texas-Same as previous year
UConn-Okafor and Gordon
Maryland-Steve Blake
Michigan State-Maurice Ager, Paul Davis
Kentucky-Keith Bogans, Kelenna Azubuike
Wisconsin-Alando Tucker, Devin Harris
Marquette-Travis Diener, Dwayne Wade
Pitt-None
Arizona-Salim Stoudamire, <font color="#000000">Andre Iguodala, Channing Frye, Luke Walton
</font>Notre Dame-none
Duke-Dahntay Jones, Chris Duhon, Shelden Williams, JJ Reddick
Kansas-Nick Collison, Kirk Heinrich, Wayne Simien

Again 12 out of 16. Again, no MSU player that year played in the NBA, ever.

2004 Tournament
St. Joe's-Jameer Nelson, Delonte West
Wake Forest-Chris Paul
Pitt-Yet aGAIN, not a one. Too bad we can't get Ben Howland or Jamie Dixon.
Oklahoma State-Tony Allen (Good thing they were SO lucky and John Lucas III transferred there from Baylor.)
UAB-None
Kansas-Down to Wayne Simien at this point.
Georgia Tech-Jarrett Jack
Nevada-Kirk Snyder
Duke-JJ Reddick, Luol Deng, Shelden Williams, Chris Duhon, Shavlik Randolph
Illinois-Deron Williams, Luther Head
Texas-Royal Ivey
Xavier-None
Alabama-Jermareo Davidson (Hard to believe Shelton and Winston never made the league)
Syracuse-Hakim Warrick
Vandy-Matt Freje
UConn-Gordon, Okafor, Charlie Villaneuva, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone

13 out of 16. This is probably the year you can be upset about, as we lost to a team with no NBA talent. But there is no disputing they had a lot of momentum coming in. Could go either way.

2005 Tournament
North Carolina-(First time we've seen this team) Raymond Felton, Sean May, Rashard McCants, Marvin Williams (Another note, did you know there was a guy from Harrison Central on this team? Byron Sanders? Anyone?)
Villanova-Randy Foye
Wisconsin-Alando Tucker
NC State-Julius Hodge
Duke-Randolph, Williams, Reddick
Michigan State-Ager, Davis
Utah-Andrew Bogut
Kentucky-Jermareo Davidson, Randolph Morris, Rajon Rondo
Illinois-Deron Williams, Luther Head
UW-Milwaukee-None
Arizona-Frye and Stoudamire aGAIN.
Oklahoma State-None.
Washington-Brandon Roy
Texas Tech-None, let's go get Bobby Knight!
West Virginia-None

12 out of 16 aGAIN. So 49 out of 64 teams, 77 percent of the teams that made a sweet sixteen in the years Stansbury made the tourney had at least one player that played more than 2 years in the NBA on their roster. We had 1 in those four years, Lawrence Roberts.

 

[HD6]

This list is only players that played at least 2 years in the NBA.

2002 Tourney

Maryland-Juan Dixon, Steve Blake, Lonny Baxter, Chris Wilcox
Kentucky-Tayshaun Prince, Keith Bogans
Southern Illinois-None that I can find
UConn-Ben Gordon, Emeka Okafor, Caron Butler
Kansas-Drew Gooden, Nick Collison, Kirk Heinrich, Wayne Simien
Illinois-Brian Cook, Luther Head, Frank Williams
Texas-TJ Ford, Royal Ivey
Oregon-Fred Jones, Luke Jackson, Luke Ridnour
Duke-Carlos Boozer, Mike Dunleavy, Dahntay Jones, Chris Duhon (And lest we forget number 2 overall pick Jason Williams who's career ended on a motorcycle)
Pitt-None that I could find
Kent State-None that I could find, but they had a guy named Antonio Gates who's done pretty well in other fields
UCLA-Jason Kapono, Dan Gadzuric
Mizzou-Kareem Rush
Arizona-Luke Walton, Salim Stoudamire, Channing Frye
Oklahoma-None that I could find

So, 12 out of 16 teams had at least one guy who played multiple years in the NBA. No one on the MSU roster from that season has ever played a minute in the NBA.

2003 Tournament
Oklahoma-Hey, look at that. That Kelvin Sampson is a great coach when he isn't texting illegally.
Butler-What do you think?
Syracuse-Carmelo Anthony, Hakim Warrick
Auburn-Marquis Daniels
Texas-Same as previous year
UConn-Okafor and Gordon
Maryland-Steve Blake
Michigan State-Maurice Ager, Paul Davis
Kentucky-Keith Bogans, Kelenna Azubuike
Wisconsin-Alando Tucker, Devin Harris
Marquette-Travis Diener, Dwayne Wade
Pitt-None
Arizona-Salim Stoudamire, <font color="#000000">Andre Iguodala, Channing Frye, Luke Walton
</font>Notre Dame-none
Duke-Dahntay Jones, Chris Duhon, Shelden Williams, JJ Reddick
Kansas-Nick Collison, Kirk Heinrich, Wayne Simien

Again 12 out of 16. Again, no MSU player that year played in the NBA, ever.

2004 Tournament
St. Joe's-Jameer Nelson, Delonte West
Wake Forest-Chris Paul
Pitt-Yet aGAIN, not a one. Too bad we can't get Ben Howland or Jamie Dixon.
Oklahoma State-Tony Allen (Good thing they were SO lucky and John Lucas III transferred there from Baylor.)
UAB-None
Kansas-Down to Wayne Simien at this point.
Georgia Tech-Jarrett Jack
Nevada-Kirk Snyder
Duke-JJ Reddick, Luol Deng, Shelden Williams, Chris Duhon, Shavlik Randolph
Illinois-Deron Williams, Luther Head
Texas-Royal Ivey
Xavier-None
Alabama-Jermareo Davidson (Hard to believe Shelton and Winston never made the league)
Syracuse-Hakim Warrick
Vandy-Matt Freje
UConn-Gordon, Okafor, Charlie Villaneuva, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone

13 out of 16. This is probably the year you can be upset about, as we lost to a team with no NBA talent. But there is no disputing they had a lot of momentum coming in. Could go either way.

2005 Tournament
North Carolina-(First time we've seen this team) Raymond Felton, Sean May, Rashard McCants, Marvin Williams (Another note, did you know there was a guy from Harrison Central on this team? Byron Sanders? Anyone?)
Villanova-Randy Foye
Wisconsin-Alando Tucker
NC State-Julius Hodge
Duke-Randolph, Williams, Reddick
Michigan State-Ager, Davis
Utah-Andrew Bogut
Kentucky-Jermareo Davidson, Randolph Morris, Rajon Rondo
Illinois-Deron Williams, Luther Head
UW-Milwaukee-None
Arizona-Frye and Stoudamire aGAIN.
Oklahoma State-None.
Washington-Brandon Roy
Texas Tech-None, let's go get Bobby Knight!
West Virginia-None

12 out of 16 aGAIN. So 49 out of 64 teams, 77 percent of the teams that made a sweet sixteen in the years Stansbury made the tourney had at least one player that played more than 2 years in the NBA on their roster. We had 1 in those four years, Lawrence Roberts.

 

[HD6]

This list is only players that played at least 2 years in the NBA.

2002 Tourney

Maryland-Juan Dixon, Steve Blake, Lonny Baxter, Chris Wilcox
Kentucky-Tayshaun Prince, Keith Bogans
Southern Illinois-None that I can find
UConn-Ben Gordon, Emeka Okafor, Caron Butler
Kansas-Drew Gooden, Nick Collison, Kirk Heinrich, Wayne Simien
Illinois-Brian Cook, Luther Head, Frank Williams
Texas-TJ Ford, Royal Ivey
Oregon-Fred Jones, Luke Jackson, Luke Ridnour
Duke-Carlos Boozer, Mike Dunleavy, Dahntay Jones, Chris Duhon (And lest we forget number 2 overall pick Jason Williams who's career ended on a motorcycle)
Pitt-None that I could find
Kent State-None that I could find, but they had a guy named Antonio Gates who's done pretty well in other fields
UCLA-Jason Kapono, Dan Gadzuric
Mizzou-Kareem Rush
Arizona-Luke Walton, Salim Stoudamire, Channing Frye
Oklahoma-None that I could find

So, 12 out of 16 teams had at least one guy who played multiple years in the NBA. No one on the MSU roster from that season has ever played a minute in the NBA.

2003 Tournament
Oklahoma-Hey, look at that. That Kelvin Sampson is a great coach when he isn't texting illegally.
Butler-What do you think?
Syracuse-Carmelo Anthony, Hakim Warrick
Auburn-Marquis Daniels
Texas-Same as previous year
UConn-Okafor and Gordon
Maryland-Steve Blake
Michigan State-Maurice Ager, Paul Davis
Kentucky-Keith Bogans, Kelenna Azubuike
Wisconsin-Alando Tucker, Devin Harris
Marquette-Travis Diener, Dwayne Wade
Pitt-None
Arizona-Salim Stoudamire, <font color="#000000">Andre Iguodala, Channing Frye, Luke Walton
</font>Notre Dame-none
Duke-Dahntay Jones, Chris Duhon, Shelden Williams, JJ Reddick
Kansas-Nick Collison, Kirk Heinrich, Wayne Simien

Again 12 out of 16. Again, no MSU player that year played in the NBA, ever.

2004 Tournament
St. Joe's-Jameer Nelson, Delonte West
Wake Forest-Chris Paul
Pitt-Yet aGAIN, not a one. Too bad we can't get Ben Howland or Jamie Dixon.
Oklahoma State-Tony Allen (Good thing they were SO lucky and John Lucas III transferred there from Baylor.)
UAB-None
Kansas-Down to Wayne Simien at this point.
Georgia Tech-Jarrett Jack
Nevada-Kirk Snyder
Duke-JJ Reddick, Luol Deng, Shelden Williams, Chris Duhon, Shavlik Randolph
Illinois-Deron Williams, Luther Head
Texas-Royal Ivey
Xavier-None
Alabama-Jermareo Davidson (Hard to believe Shelton and Winston never made the league)
Syracuse-Hakim Warrick
Vandy-Matt Freje
UConn-Gordon, Okafor, Charlie Villaneuva, Marcus Williams, Josh Boone

13 out of 16. This is probably the year you can be upset about, as we lost to a team with no NBA talent. But there is no disputing they had a lot of momentum coming in. Could go either way.

2005 Tournament
North Carolina-(First time we've seen this team) Raymond Felton, Sean May, Rashard McCants, Marvin Williams (Another note, did you know there was a guy from Harrison Central on this team? Byron Sanders? Anyone?)
Villanova-Randy Foye
Wisconsin-Alando Tucker
NC State-Julius Hodge
Duke-Randolph, Williams, Reddick
Michigan State-Ager, Davis
Utah-Andrew Bogut
Kentucky-Jermareo Davidson, Randolph Morris, Rajon Rondo
Illinois-Deron Williams, Luther Head
UW-Milwaukee-None
Arizona-Frye and Stoudamire aGAIN.
Oklahoma State-None.
Washington-Brandon Roy
Texas Tech-None, let's go get Bobby Knight!
West Virginia-None

12 out of 16 aGAIN. So 49 out of 64 teams, 77 percent of the teams that made a sweet sixteen in the years Stansbury made the tourney had at least one player that played more than 2 years in the NBA on their roster. We had 1 in those four years, Lawrence Roberts.

 

[KurtRambis4]

stans teams were loaded with nba talent...

 

[8dog]

in 2003 and 2004, we lost to 2 of the few teams without NBA talent.

the Butler game was the essence of the Stans era. Tons of talent on the floor thanks to him but a complete inability to dictate tempo and an inability to get buckets in critical half court possessions.

 

[Todd4State]

First of all, I would love to go from riding Timmy Bowers coattails to going to UNC to ride the pine for a couple of years. Hey, Hansbrough! You want some more Gatorade? Being on the basketball team there is sure to be a chick magnet, without all of the stress, of you know? Performing. I admire that dude.

Secondly, if we had Bobby Knight, I'm pretty sure that we would have a much worse transfer problem than what we have now. But it would be much more entertaing. Of course, the empty chair that beat Rod Barnes would have been an extra empty chair on the Ole Miss bench after Knight hurled it at Karl Hess. I'm also pretty sure that Knight could have kicked Tomlinson (friendly fire) and Hess's *** with one hand.

 

[Todd4State]

but getting upset by teams like that happens every year in the Big Dance. Unfortunately, it was our turn.

 

[DawgatAuburn]

Zimmerman and Tang both played in the NBA. Not much, but they played. As much or more as some of the guys on your little list.

 

[8dog]

in a row.

Im not all that hung up on those appearances though they discredit rick as a floor coach immensly. Im more disgusted at the 07 and 08 drastic underacheivements.

 

[Henry Kissinger]

i don't follow the nba so i don't know, but he said that all of those players played for at least 2 years. surely tang and zimmerman didn't play 2 years.

if there are other players on that list that didn't play two years, well the numbers will change

 

[DawgatAuburn]

There are.

 

[HD6]

wasn't on our roster in any of the years I listed. Zimmerman may have played a grand total of two games total since he left Starkville. But I guess I can give you that. Two whole players!!

I think it's funny you refer to it as my "little list". I'll take that as proof I got under your skin by providing facts, CoachDAA.

 

[HD6]

with no NBA players beating another team with no NBA players, not that big an upset. It's not like Butler flamed out, they beat Louisville to go to the Sweet Sixteen.

 

[HD6]

had to look for myself. 32 minutes in his NBA career. That certainly is a strong argument.

</a><a href="http://hoopshype.com/players/derrick_zimmerman.htm">http://hoopshype.com/players/derrick_zimmerman.htm

 

[8dog]

it just doesn't give me warm fuzzies. At least Pitino forced an up tempo game...we didn't. If we had gotten beat in that type game, I could deal. But Stans hates trying to press and run despite constantly having freakish athletes.

 

[BulldogLegacy]

It seems as if all the teams that gave state a early exit in the tourny didn't flame out but actually made a deep run in the tournament.

 

[BriantheDawg]

.

 

[HD6]

nobody on that list played less than 2 years, unless they are just in their second season now and were freshmen in 05. And there were a lot of guys with only one year that I left off.

 

[wpnetdawg]

I may be figuring this wrong or remembering wrong, but only two teams that have defeated State in NCAA tourney (regardless of the coach) play went on to lose their next game in the tourney.

Duke went on to lose to Mich. State in their next game and Syracuse lost in the national championship game.

Am I missing one?

 

[DawgatAuburn]

Let me ask this though.......if having NBA talent is such a strong predictor of the Sweet 16, then how many NBA players who played in college never played in the Sweet 16? And two years is a time frame that works in your favor since rookie deals are three years. Many of the players you listed got the rookie deal then never played again. Wayne Simien, Julius Hodge and Alando Tucker are no more NBA players than Zimmerman was. In another year you'll be able to add Ager, Morris and others to that group.

By the way, Jamerio Davidson did not transfer from Alabama to Kentucky.

 

[HD6]

Simien played in 43 games as a rookie, or 42.5 more games than did Zimmerman. Simien was just a touch better player than Zimmerman also, being All-American two years in a row, Big 12 player of the year, and Wooden finalist two years in a row.

Ager and Hodge stuck for 3 years in the league, Tucker is only in his second season. All of them have played in more games than Zimmerman ever will.

</p>

 

[DawgatAuburn]

Simien played in 43 games as a rookie and impressed people so much that he played in 8 games the next year is now in Europe.
Hodge is in Australia.
Tucker is in his first season....in the D League.

There are plenty of legit players on your list but it is padded to look good with the small timeframe.

 

[BlindDawg]

Another note, did you know there was a guy from Harrison Central on this team? Byron Sanders? Anyone?

Actually, yes I did know that. I'm a big Carolina fan, and he was always one of my favorite players just cause I felt like I had to root for the MS boy. He actually did play a good bit his senior year (the year after McCants, Felton, and May left I believe), and I think he started a good bit of those games too. He wasn't a bad player (obvious if you're on the roster at UNC). He was a solid big man and did much of the same things Brian Johnson does for our team - play good D, rebound, and be a good teammate/cheerleader.

 

[squirldawg]

We had two NBA players (Erick Dampier, Dontae Jones) and one (Marcus Bullard) that would have likely gone to the NBA. Add arguably the best college player to play at MSU to that lineup, in Darryl Wilson, and it is easy to see how we went the Final Four. The fact is that NBA players make a difference when it comes to making strong runs in the NCAA tournament.

 

[bonedaddy401]

You might as well admit your are out researched, out smarted and out argued again. HD6 did the proper research and presented a very concrete argument and all you can throw out is Tang Hamilton and Z? Pathetic. Did I expect more? No. Am I surprised? No. To quote the swami Chris Berman - Come on maaaan!</p>

 

[HD6]

<span><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/IDcj7KWW8yo&rel=1" width="425" height="355" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" allowScriptAccess="never" ></embed></span> when there are no MSU players that fit that timeframe?

 

[Optimus Prime 4]

If these other crappy small schools can, why can't Stans?

I also bet if you looked at the top 25 at the end of four years ago, 80% of those teams had a player in the NBA. Not sure what that proves though

 

[dawgstudent]

goes to HD6.? Although, I am partial to this one with the remix...

<span><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/F9gRzmCf1EI&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&feature=player_embedded&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="425" height="344" allowScriptAccess="never" ></embed></span>

 

[KurtRambis4]

all these names out and all you can do is come back with zimmerman and tang? uhh, sorry but you lose. the point was a)that people keep bashing stans for not making the sweet 16 b) that the fact that people keep claiming stans gets ALLLL this load of talent each year is wrong baesed on....c) sweet 16 talent = nba draft talent (based on the numbers) and HD backed up this assertion with facts to prove it. based on the facts roughl;y 75% of the teams in the sweet 16 over the past years have at least 1 player that was drafted in the top 2 rounds. wherreas state has had 2. and i'll give y'all that butler didn't either in 03, however in 04 sato and chalmers were both taken in the draft. now i'm not saying that of all these players taken in the first 2 rounds, that they were all nba all-stars or the 2nd coming of michael jordan, just that they had the talent to at least be drafted in the first two rounds whereas we had 2....TWO... player in that time frame that people thought might at least have the talent to be drafted in the top 2 rounds (and one of them barely made it into the top 2 rounds).

 

[Dog in the Know]

The year he was drafted from MSU, N. Carolina had 2 or 3 players drafted in the top 5 or top 10 (cant remember) . I could care less that we dont have all these so called "NBA players". Do I want them, yes, however I feel like MSU can be successful without them with proper coaching. There are only TWO rounds in the NBA draft, then free agents come after that. Two rounds is not a lot of picks with 300+ basketball teams AND you throw in the foreign players and the ability to get a player to the NBA is very slim. I want to keep players from transferring. Keep a nucleus that can play together and build.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

This whole thread is a very interesting read.

Players that played for top 25 teams/March Madness teams have had way more exposure which in turn gives them a bump in their draft status. If you go and look at that list of players HD listed there are several that played 2 years at the most and there are many that just sit on the bench and play maybe 5 minutes a game. And yeah I know that still means they are NBA players but it goes back to what D@A said about their rookie contracts. These guys get the exposure and get drafted higher than they should and they aren't really NBA players.

I have no dog in the hunt but just wanted to throw that out there.

 

[Hanmudog]

But I feel like NBA scouts already know who the top players are well before the NCAAT ever starts. There is too much money being thrown around to base much of your decision on 2 or 3 games played in March. If they put alot of stock in that then Charles Rhodes would have been drafted last season. You may be right for the smaller schools and some of their players however.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

Well Im not just talking about March Madness teams but also Top 25 teams (the ones always on TV). They are on SportsCenter every time they play.....most them anyway. Take a look at Lawrence Roberts. He had huge exposure. You don't think that didn't help him get drafted?

 

[dawgstudent]

in last year's tourney by becoming a household name.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

[No message]

 

[Hanmudog]

The NBA scouts are not a bunch of goobers on the internet. They already knew who Curry was prior to the NCAAT. Just because we didn't does not mean they didn't.

 

[dawgstudent]

about the small schools. I don't doubt the scouts already knew who he was just because of his dad but to the nation, I had no idea who the guy was.

 

[bonedaddy401]

You stole fizzy lifting drinks.....

Thanks for getting that stuck in my head all day.</p>

 

[DawgatAuburn]

Players that played for top 25 teams/March Madness teams have had way more exposure which in turn gives them a bump in their draft status. If you go and look at that list of players HD listed there are several that played 2 years at the most and there are many that just sit on the bench and play maybe 5 minutes a game. And yeah I know that still means they are NBA players but it goes back to what D@A said about their rookie contracts. These guys get the exposure and get drafted higher than they should and they aren't really NBA players.

That's where HD and I differ. Getting drafted and playing sparse minutes for two or three years doesn't make you an NBA player any more than Z or Tang were NBA players in their 32 and 98 minutes respectively. Well, I guess that's not true. Guys like Simien and Tucker and others did get the guaranteed rookie deals whereas Roberts did not as a second rounder and Z and Tang did not as free agents. The guys who get bigger exposure and get drafted also get a better shot because of the guaranteed money. I never argued that the teams HD listed didn't have talented players. They were. The argument was originally about "elite players" and the fact that being in the NBA for two years made you an elite college talent. I don't buy that (see Coach's Balkman example for one). College basketball and the NBA are different games, and elite college players are all-conference in the big conferences. The best of the elite are legitimate All-Americans regardless of their draft status or NBA career. Was Jamont Gordon not an elite college talent? First team all-SEC for two years? I say yes. Others may disagree, and that's fine. My gosh, Roberts was first team All American and can't stick in the Association.

 

[KurtRambis4]

was drafted, 40th overall pick.