The SEC needs bowl reform

[shotgunDawg]

The SEC needs bowl reform. There are two major problems that the SEC currently has with its bowl tie-ins and system.

1. The same teams seem to always be in the running for the same bowls. This is the problem that MSU is currently having to deal with in regards to the Gator Bowl and Music City Bowl. It has little to do with the way MSU is playing and much more to do with MSU having been to both of those of those in the past two year, and who could blame the Gator and Music City if they choose other teams who haven't been to their ever?

It is very difficult to go to the next level in this conference. This is not the NFL where rules are designed for every team to go 8-8. In the SEC it is possible to get the next level, but very difficult and will take many years. Heck, South Carolina has awesome talent, but hasn't sniffed a BCS bowl yet. The SEC has to find an answer, if possible, to the redundancy of the same teams being in play for the same bowls every single year.

2. Most of the SEC's bowl tie-ins are with Big 10 and ACC. These two conferences are absolutely awful at football, and provide very little in the way interesting match ups. The simple fact is that the SEC is by far the best and deepest conference in the country. Due to that, we to find a way to strike up a bowl or two with the PAC 12. The game could be played in Phoenix, Dallas, Houston, San Diego, or LA. Doesn't really matter to me, but going to the Music City Bowl and playing Wake Forest or going to the Gator Bowl and playing a horrid Michigan team isn't going to cut it.

The SEC has simply outgrown the two conferences that is most tied to in bowl games. Therefore, if the SEC wants to continue to make bowl games interesting and special for mid-SEC level teams, they need to get rid of bowl games that involve 5th place Big 10 and ACC teams. The interest just isn't there and the match ups stink.

I am not sure what the answer is, but its easy to see the problems. Should we not have bowl tie-ins and just be open for bidding? What say you?

 

[DAWG61]

I'd like to see CF go to a 32 team playoff. Not sure how it'd be possible but it would be awesome to watch. Use the bowls as the different sites.

 

[natchezdawg]

I really don't know what could be done to make things better for teams like State. I would much rather have a guaranteed tie in than compete for bids. Since these tie ins started in the late 90's we have been to more bowls in the past 15 years that in the entire history of the school before then. A lot has to do with the number of bowls but the tie ins help.

 

[Coach34]

The SEC in no way gives a **** really about the bottom of the conference. Hell, they made a rule changing how the SEC schedule works after we got to Atlanta in 1998 so it would be harder for teams like us to get there. Why would they care about being equal when they make so much money pushing the Big 6 teams of the SEC down the nation's throat?

 

[patdog]

32 would be WAY too many. The 4-team playoff is all that's absolutely needed. I do think an 8-team playoff would be the best size though. After that, you just start getting way too many mediocre teams in the playoff and water it down.

 

[DesotoCountyDawg]

I agree and 8 should be the absolute maximum. Once you go past 8 there are teams that have no business in the hunt for a national championship.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

I like a 6 team format where #1 and #2 get byes. That way you can really weed out the crap like a possible Boise in the first round of games without giving them a shot to knock off a really good team that is down. At the same time giving a 'chance' to 2 more teams, albeit harder for 3-6. Gives more incentive for the regular season too, to get that first round bye.

 

[OrrDawg]

An 8-team playoff would be ideal. That number would, in most years, include all the teams that would have a legitimate shot at the championship. Also, this system would produce 7 good football games to watch during bowl season rather than some of the trash we are given now.

 

[SkullCandy.sixpack]

Shotgun said it perfectly--the system favors the best teams, and there's no way out. In the NFL, the teams that go to the playoffs, get lower draft picks, and a harder schedule the next year. Bama spends more, makes more, winning attracts better recruits, etc. The only way I think it could be fixed is pay the players (just like the NFL), but have a tiered rate so that the top recruits are offered more (just like the NFL). That way, after Bama got their best 10, we could lure away great talent by offering our top pay rate. It would spread out the talent. If no one cheated... Yeah, I know.

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

I remember hearing something (here) about that, Coach... but what were the specifics? I don't recall.

 

[Optimus Prime 4]

I actually agree with you on this

And the "play-in" games could be on campus, to avoid more bowl issues. Three rounds of bowl type games is tough. Lose the play-in and go to a regular bowl. Maybe?

 

[Coach34]

I remember hearing something (here) about that, Coach... but what were the specifics? I don't recall.

Back in 1998 when the East was ruling the SEC, we made it to Atlanta without having to play Fla, Georgia, or Tenn. Those teams bitched, as did Bama, Auburn, and LSU. So they changed the rotation for playing teams from the other side so that wouldn't happen again. Just complete ********.

Its funny you are hearing a little flak about Bama not playing any of the top 3 from the East this year- but they damn sure won't change rotations because of it

17 the SEC

 

[GhostOfJackie]

This thread immediately got hijacked into a playoff thread. Back to the original thread.

1. There is not much that the SEC can do about this. It's one of those "put up of shut up" things and thats something a smaller SEC school like MSU has to deal with. Look, if we could take care of business against LSU and Ole Miss this year then we would be in the running for a bigger bowl. A 10-2 Vandy team would have a good chance at one of these bigger bowls. It just happens that LSU, Alabama, Georgia, Florida and Arkansas (minus this year) all beat teams to have this chance. They rarely falter against the Mississippi's of this league. \

2. We have three bowls that tie in with the Big 10. I think one of those needs to be with a PAC 12 team. Also, the SEC needs to get out of this Liberty Bowl garbage. NO SEC BOWL TEAM should have to play a conference USA team in a freezing cold ********. WE need a (big) bowl tie in with the PAC 12 and another bowl tie in with the BIG 12. Two tie ins with the ACC is just too many.

Maybe the SEC could drop their tie in with the liberty bowl and pick up a PAC 12 tie in somewhere in Texas. The independence bowl could pick up the slack and actually put an SEC team with a Big 12 team like they used to always do.

All in all, win games and we get good bowls.

 

[patdog]

I could live with that, as long as you didn't guarantee bids to conference champions and just took the best 6 teams. Realistically, the 4-team playoff is set in stone for the next 12 years, so all this talk is just for hypotheticals. And to be honest, a 4-team playoff is all that is really needed. This year you'd wind up with #1 Notre Dame, #2 Bama/UGA, #3 Florida and #4 Oregon/Kansas St. If K-State beats Texas, either them or Oregon would be the only 1-loss team left out. Neither has a top 10 win and their best wins are #11 Oklahoma and #15 Oregon St. Hard to feel too sorry for either of them.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

That's because the West still rules the East, and will be evidenced again Saturday.

Georgia is catching 10 kinds of hell for avoiding the Top West teams.

You're just in panty waste mode.

 

[00Dawg]

State won the SECW in '98 without playing UGA, UT, or UF in the regular season. At the time, everyone had 2 permanent cross-divisional opponents and 1 rotating. Ours were SoCar and UK, and we played Vandy as our rotating opponent that year.
Cooler heads pointed out that such things are cyclical, but TPTB decided the complainers needed to be placated. IIRC, Jeremy Foley was our largest detractor (which made whooping UF in 2000 slightly more enjoyable).
Our valiant try against UT didn't earn our cause any credit, either.

 

[00Dawg]

Georgia is catching 10 kinds of hell for avoiding the Top West teams.

They are? I've only seen it occasionally mentioned of late, and I spent Thanksgiving in Athens.
I certainly haven't seen the cane-raising we saw in '98.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

from espn.com cfb front page

A Dawg's Life

A favorable SEC schedule, a "timely" defeat -- this year, it's good to be Georgia. Adam Rittenberg »BCS standings »Reax »Bowl projections »Bloggers »Rank 'Em »Alabama next for Irish

 

[Hanmudog]

I just wish there was a bonofide pecking order for the bowls instead of this damn guessing game every year. I get so tired of it seeming like an 8-4 Auburn or LSU would be looking at a Cotton Bowl or Peach Bowl while an 8-4 MSU or Vandy is looking at a Music City Bowl or praying not to be in the Liberty Bowl.

 

[00Dawg]

Not sure that qualifies as "catching 10 kinds of hell".

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

how did they "change the rotation" to penalize MSU? Are you saying Ole Miss, MSU and Arkansas (West lil 6) all will have at least 1 of UF, UGA or UT (East big 6) on their schedule ever year?

 

[00Dawg]

I just keep thinking we should grab the New Orleans Bowl and help turn it into a major player.
The BBVA Compass Bowl needs to either help UAB build a new stadium or fade away.
The Liberty Bowl is close to the same boat, although they do have history on their side.

As replacements outside of the New Orleans Bowl, I'd look towards the Meineke Car Care Bowl in Houston, and maybe the Beef 'O' Brady's Bowl...need some more details on their stadium.
Oh, and the Russell Athletic Bowl...their contract with the Big East is up in 2014.

 

[FlabLoser]

I just wish there was a bonofide pecking order for the bowls instead of this damn guessing game every year. I get so tired of it seeming like an 8-4 Auburn or LSU would be looking at a Cotton Bowl or Peach Bowl while an 8-4 MSU or Vandy is looking at a Music City Bowl or praying not to be in the Liberty Bowl.

An 8-4 MSU made it to the Cotton Bowl.

An 8-4 Ole Miss team made it to the Cotton Bowl (after losing the Egg Bowl)

Just sayin.

 

[FlabLoser]

how did they "change the rotation" to penalize MSU? Are you saying Ole Miss, MSU and Arkansas (West lil 6) all will have at least 1 of UF, UGA or UT (East big 6) on their schedule ever year?

I can't speak for the rotation.

But just a couple years ago, Bama bitched about having to play too many teams that had an off week before their Bama game - so the SEC helped Bama out on that. They sure as hell wouldn't do that for most other teams.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Need a Mississippi Bowl.....

We need to quit trying to help Birmingham and New Orleans, and instead create our own bowl in Jackson, whether it's at the Vet or a new facility.

 

[patdog]

They changed from 2 permanent opponents in the opposite division to just 1, so the big 3 in the other division will rotate onto your schedule more often. Not sure that was specifically done to eliminate teams getting to the title game like we did in 1998, but I do remember that being a factor. With the expansion, we're back to a system where it's much easier for a team to avoid the top teams in the other division and greater schedule disparity. For example, LSU had to play both Florida and USC and Bama avoided all the good teams in the East.

 

[Hanmudog]

An 8-4 MSU made it to the Cotton Bowl.

An 8-4 Ole Miss team made it to the Cotton Bowl (after losing the Egg Bowl)

Just sayin.

An 8-4 SEC West Champ MSU went to the Cotton Bowl. How often has the SEC West Champ only gotten the Cotton?

Ole Miss got it at 8-4 because everyone else had a crap year that year and there was really no one else to take.

You can bet your *** that an 8-4 MSU, Ole Miss, Kentucky, or Vandy team would not get a bigger bowl than an 8-4 LSU, Bama, Georgia, or Florida.

Point being the lower teams have to have extenuating circumstances or perform way better than is common for a given bowl to move up under the current bowl structure.

 

[00Dawg]

And the Cotton Bowl immediately had their "SEC West Champ" contractual clause removed following the '98 game ('99 technically). That was despite a record time for selling out.

 

[patdog]

And a 10-2 LSU team is probably going to fall to the Peach Bowl. We're in no position to be bitching about which bowls we're going to. We got the Gator 2 years ago which is a good bowl and we got the Music City at 6-6 last year, which is a real good bowl for that record. We'll probably get the Gator again this year. But if we don't, we have only ourselves to blame, not the SEC office.

 

[TUSK.sixpack]

that, I do remember, Bama dropped Vandy as a permanent OOD opponent & kept UT... I didn't expect that to work out as well as it has.

 

[patdog]

The thing I always find funny about MSU and UM fans that ***** about how the SEC office is "out to get us" is, we play Vandy and Kentucky as our permanent opponents in the East. Historically, you can't ask for anything better. It's almost as if the SEC came to us and said, you 2 pick your East opponent and then we'll work the rest out from there. I know it didn't happen that way, but seriously, if you're playing Vandy & Kentucky, you should be thanking the SEC office all day long every day.

 

[Hanmudog]

No one is bitching about what bowl we are going to. We are talking about the current structure of the SEC bowl tie ins. Do you think a Capital One or Cotton Bowl is going to pick a 9-3 Kentucky team or a 9-3 LSU team given a choice? Do you think the Gator Bowl would take a 8-4 Florida or an 8-4 Vandy?

I would just like to see a concrete structure to eliminate the guess work and politics.

 

[InaccuratePredictionsDawg]

Not much you can do...

..you get past the BCS bowl match-ups, which are dictated by computer ranking, after that, all the other bowl match-ups are dictated by political maneuvering of corporate sponsorships.

That's why they constantly break the conference rankings rule: The corporate sponsor of a given bowl just wants the biggest fanbase to show up for their personal bowl. They could care less about who deserves what.

I really don't care what conference the team MSU plays is from as long as MSU can beat them. I don't want an exciting match-up for a bowl game. I want a MSU victory. Anyway, MSU always lays a turd when it comes to "exciting match-ups."

Any day of the week, I would take Duke in the Music City Bowl (probable win) over Wisconsin in the Gator Bowl (probable loss).

 

[patdog]

I know I would sure take a 9-3 LSU team over a 9-3 Kentucky team and an 8-4 Florida over an 8-4 Vandy. So what? I've got no problem with bowls taking the team with the biggest fanbase when they have the same record. Realistically, that's the only reason for the Gator to take us over Vandy. We have the same record, they've played a slightly tougher schedule (Northwestern & Wake Forest) and they've won 6 in a row while we've lost 4 of 5. The truth is, Vandy deserves that bowl more than we do.

 

[Hanmudog]

You are right. Vandy deserves a better bowl than us but because they are Vandy they may not get it. That is exactly my point.

A more structured system that uses head to head results or SEC records or hell....just anything..... to add some like of legitamite picking order would be an improvement. For example, suppose 9-3 Kentucky beats 9-3 Georgia head to head. It should be impossible for Georgia to get a bowl ahead of Kentucky in that scenario. Or if State goes 5-3 in the SEC, it should not be possible for a 4-4 SEC team to go ahead of us.

The whole damn thing is a popularity contest. In a perfect world bowls should be told who they are going to get and not the other way around.

 

[QuaoarsKing]

It will be different in a few years. The Champions Bowl is the beginning of the conferences cutting out the middle men and running the bowls themselves. Without having to pay greedy executives 7-figure salaries to run these bowls, the conferences can rake in the same totals no matter what and give each team the matchup it deserves.

 

[SkullCandy.sixpack]

"NO SEC BOWL TEAM should have to play a conference USA team in a freezing cold ********." I don't care who you are, that's funny.

 

[HammerOfTheDogs]

I think we should go the other way. Play 10 regular season games a year. Six conference games max. Let bowls decide who they want to invite...ie, no tie-ins. Multiple conference and national Championships. It's suppposed to be a game, not a Bataan Death March (which it is today with playing 14-15 games a year).

 

[QuaoarsKing]

Yeah, give everyone a trophy! Don't even keep score!