Thoughts on Lebby’s progression

[Seinfeld]

Ok, I’m not a big Lebby fan at the moment. Let’s get that out of the way. Last season was a disaster, I don’t think he sells the program, his recruiting is very meh, and he hasn’t shown that he can make difficult decisions when it comes to his staff.

That said, my question is more about all these Ifs that I’m about to roll out. If this team does find a way to get 4-5 wins this season, it would only happen by both sides of the ball seeing significant improvement, and I’d at least be able to say by year’s end that we beat who we should’ve beaten. That’s a helluva lot more than we could say about last year.

Then, let’s just say that recruiting gets a little better, money continues to come in, and by god we make it back to 6-7 wins and a bowl next year. Following that, we finally hit 8 wins in year 4 which I honestly think is this program’s peak barring major changes or a pulling a rabbit’s foot when it comes to the SEC schedule.

IF all this happens, my question is…. Would you take it today considering where we are?

 

[Xenomorph]

4-0 or GTFO

 

[greenbean.sixpack]

The floor for Levee this year is 4 wins, any less and we should seriously consider firing him. Make a bowl and give him a raise and extension.

 

[mcdawg22]

It’s very intentional

 

[patdog]

I’ll have to see some progression to have any thoughts on it.

 

[msudawg1200]

Because of everything that's transpired after the departure of Mullen we are pretty much in a spot where we have to keep him barring another 2-10 or less disaster, and we probably keep him then as long as he cans Hutzler. My main concern with the Lebby hire was not Lebby himself, but the Hutzler hire. The guy had zero business getting a job as a play caller in the SEC. None. Then on top of that we gave him a guaranteed 3 year 1 million per year deal. If that was the only guy Lebby could pull as DC, which makes me worry in itself, then Hutzler should've been given a 1 year deal at about 350,000. Take it or leave it prove yourself deal. Then, on top of all that, zero changes were made to the defensive staff. I get a shitshow was inherited, and last year was probably the least talented defense in modern MSU football history, but there was zero excuse for looking as unprepared and out of position as we were. Rhoads and MacIntyre were brought in as analyst hopefully to guide Hutzler and clean some of that stuff up.

All that said, we are more talented on both sides(couldn't be any worse) of the ball. If the defense is historically bad early on he'd better pull the plug and promote either Rhoads, MacIntyre, or both to run the ship. If we go 4-8 and look competitive I'll have more confidence going forward.

 

[onewoof]

this year is just to win 3 non-conf and be moderately competitive against the SEC and Arizona State

We will stack up some moral victories, better than last year.

 

[The Peeper]

Who is win #4? I'm assuming those that say 4 wins mean that we'll beat USM, Alcorn, and N. IL. Beating 2 of those 3 only means we are comparable to last years team. Beating AZ St for win #3 should mean we have improved. I just read an article that says AZ St (that won the Big 12 conference last year and went to the playoffs) returns the most starters in their conference and as for total starts across offense, defense and special teams, they are 2md in the country in returning starts. That doesn't sound good for the home team. Again though, who is win #4 or maybe even win #3? The best choices would be road games at AR and at Mizzou.

 

[HailStout]

We really, really, really need an upset win against someone we have no business beating relatively early in the season. Not likely to happen, I know, but we need a break

 

[The Cooterpoot]

This is year 1 for Lebby whether some people like it or not. We can talk about all this after the season coming up because it's pointless right now.

 

[onewoof]

AZ State game going to bring back Toledo PTSD flashbacks

 

[CaptainFalcon]

It would take another 2-10 (0-8) for him to possibly get the boot this year, IMO. You’ve almost got to give him 3 years just to see if having a smidge of continuity works for us.

My suspicion is we win 3 or 4 games, his staff is the scapegoat, and he gets a Year 3 with major staff changes for next year.

 

[MississippiTexan]

This is year 1 for Lebby whether some people like it or not. We can talk about all this after the season coming up because it's pointless right now.

I can't remember if you are one of the people who count Leach's first year or not (COVID year), but I know many on here do, but that was a year I could get behind not counting. Lebby had a fully off-season and non-conference games, so I'm not sure how you can say this, his second full season, is year one.

 

[MississippiTexan]

AZ State game going to bring back Toledo PTSD flashbacks

I'm more afraid N. Illinois is going to be like the Toledo game. We won't be caught off guard by how good AZ State will be, but I could absolutely see us taking N. Illinois for granted like we did with Toledo.

 

[HomeBoyDawg]

Ok, I’m not a big Lebby fan at the moment. Let’s get that out of the way. Last season was a disaster, I don’t think he sells the program, his recruiting is very meh, and he hasn’t shown that he can make difficult decisions when it comes to his staff.

That said, my question is more about all these Ifs that I’m about to roll out. If this team does find a way to get 4-5 wins this season, it would only happen by both sides of the ball seeing significant improvement, and I’d at least be able to say by year’s end that we beat who we should’ve beaten. That’s a helluva lot more than we could say about last year.

Then, let’s just say that recruiting gets a little better, money continues to come in, and by god we make it back to 6-7 wins and a bowl next year. Following that, we finally hit 8 wins in year 4 which I honestly think is this program’s peak barring major changes or a pulling a rabbit’s foot when it comes to the SEC schedule.

IF all this happens, my question is…. Would you take it today considering where we are?

 

[patdog]

This is year 1 for Lebby whether some people like it or not. We can talk about all this after the season coming up because it's pointless right now.

No it’s not. That stupid.

 

[Maroon Eagle]

One step at a time.

I don’t concern myself with IFs.

I look at what the team has done under his stewardship.

(Some folks might say leadership instead but Lebby hasn’t showed me that yet…)

 

[DAWGSANDSAINTS]

AZ State game going to bring back Toledo PTSD flashbacks

You mean Northern Illinois!
We aren’t beating AZ St.

 

[johnson86-1]

Ok, I’m not a big Lebby fan at the moment. Let’s get that out of the way. Last season was a disaster, I don’t think he sells the program, his recruiting is very meh, and he hasn’t shown that he can make difficult decisions when it comes to his staff.

That said, my question is more about all these Ifs that I’m about to roll out. If this team does find a way to get 4-5 wins this season, it would only happen by both sides of the ball seeing significant improvement, and I’d at least be able to say by year’s end that we beat who we should’ve beaten. That’s a helluva lot more than we could say about last year.

Then, let’s just say that recruiting gets a little better, money continues to come in, and by god we make it back to 6-7 wins and a bowl next year. Following that, we finally hit 8 wins in year 4 which I honestly think is this program’s peak barring major changes or a pulling a rabbit’s foot when it comes to the SEC schedule.

IF all this happens, my question is…. Would you take it today considering where we are?

If you don't take 4-5 wins this year, 6-7 next, and 8 the year after that, the only argument is that you want him to get fired to get a coach with a higher floor, because there's no reasonable likelihood of us doing better than that. I guess we could possibly do better next year depending on the schedule, but if you offer me that progression, I take it considering where we are at this point.

 

[karlchilders.sixpack]

SEC Media days, anything noteworthy said about Defense?
I missed it.

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Heavy Levee ain't it. When you know, you know. Dude spews coachspeak and is trying to make us offense first with no defense. He'll probably have his year 2 breaking point this year just like his brothers Croominator and Sloppy Joe. Remember Croominator going off on the fans after Auburn waxed our asss? Maybe that was year 3, because he got a longer leash. Sloppy lost it in the Egg Bowl year 2.

I figure Heavy will lose it after NIU beats us at home.

 

[TNT.sixpack]

Ok, I’m not a big Lebby fan at the moment. Let’s get that out of the way. Last season was a disaster, I don’t think he sells the program, his recruiting is very meh, and he hasn’t shown that he can make difficult decisions when it comes to his staff.

That said, my question is more about all these Ifs that I’m about to roll out. If this team does find a way to get 4-5 wins this season, it would only happen by both sides of the ball seeing significant improvement, and I’d at least be able to say by year’s end that we beat who we should’ve beaten. That’s a helluva lot more than we could say about last year.

Then, let’s just say that recruiting gets a little better, money continues to come in, and by god we make it back to 6-7 wins and a bowl next year. Following that, we finally hit 8 wins in year 4 which I honestly think is this program’s peak barring major changes or a pulling a rabbit’s foot when it comes to the SEC schedule.

IF all this happens, my question is…. Would you take it today considering where we are?

8 wins wont' happen again for a very long time for us in this conference (if at all). NIL dictates that more than Lebby.

 

[Yeti]

I like Lebby. Hope he wins but his DC and lack of D recruiting is not a long term plan. I really think Huff and the mustard buzzards beat us. The line won’t be ready. It will get better and O will improve as year goes but too little too late as the D will be Peter Sirmon level bad

 

[msugolf]

I like Lebby. Hope he wins but his DC and lack of D recruiting is not a long term plan. I really think Huff and the mustard buzzards beat us. The line won’t be ready. It will get better and O will improve as year goes but too little too late as the D will be Peter Sirmon level bad

Gotta love the ol MState exaggerated pessimism. We beat USM by more than 3 tds

 

[Bullldawg78]

It would take another 2-10 (0-8) for him to possibly get the boot this year, IMO. You’ve almost got to give him 3 years just to see if having a smidge of continuity works for us.

My suspicion is we win 3 or 4 games, his staff is the scapegoat, and he gets a Year 3 with major staff changes for next year.

I don't understand the continuity argument, that isn't college football right now. It mattered 10 years ago, going somewhere with a coach who prepared you for the next level, hell now it's just go where they pay you who cares about the next level when you are making money that makes league minium look like working the drive through at McDonald's! The ice cream machine is broken and accepting piss poor coaching decisions and performance on the field is as asinine as keeping Hutzler at D coordinator!

 

[Bullldawg78]

Gotta love the ol MState exaggerated pessimism. We beat USM by more than 3 tds

 

[Shmuley]

Fully expect 4-8 with a couple of moral victories. And a very active sunshine pumping spooge-fest scene full of payboard jockies hammering the typical “give him time” narrative.

 

[AttillaTheDog]

Lebby Is Howdy Doody making millions to coach football

 

[CaptainFalcon]

I don't understand the continuity argument, that isn't college football right now. It mattered 10 years ago, going somewhere with a coach who prepared you for the next level, hell now it's just go where they pay you who cares about the next level when you are making money that makes league minium look like working the drive through at McDonald's! The ice cream machine is broken and accepting piss poor coaching decisions and performance on the field is as asinine as keeping Hutzler at D coordinator!

I would argue that patience with head coaches is higher right now than it was 3-5 years ago. There were only a handful of HC changes in the entire P5 last year and the only one that was what I would call a quick trigger was Ryan Walters at Purdue. He was kinda their Moorhead (even worse record-wise) that followed up a successful coach that went elsewhere.

There were zero coaching changes in the SEC last year and that included Auburn keeping Freeze who has yet to have a winning season there, UK keeping Stoops after he tried to leave and then went 4-8, Florida keeping Napier in spite of being 19-19 (10-14) after three years, Oklahoma keeping Venables after his second losing season in 3 years, etc.

No, it is not normal to fire your coach within two years. It definitely would not be normal for us to do it for the third time since early 2020.

If Lebby shows any smidge of progress from last year, he will get a Year 3. Can just about guarantee that.

 

[85Bears]

I would argue that patience with head coaches is higher right now than it was 3-5 years ago. There were only a handful of HC changes in the entire P5 last year and the only one that was what I would call a quick trigger was Ryan Walters at Purdue. He was kinda their Moorhead (even worse record-wise) that followed up a successful coach that went elsewhere.

There were zero coaching changes in the SEC last year and that included Auburn keeping Freeze who has yet to have a winning season there, UK keeping Stoops after he tried to leave and then went 4-8, Florida keeping Napier in spite of being 19-19 (10-14) after three years, Oklahoma keeping Venables after his second losing season in 3 years, etc.

No, it is not normal to fire your coach within two years. It definitely would not be normal for us to do it for the third time since early 2020.

If Lebby shows any smidge of progress from last year, he will get a Year 3. Can just about guarantee that.

Have to agree, I don’t see any way Selmons signature hire gets fired unless he goes 2-10/0-8 again, 3-9/0-8 may be cutting it close though

 

[HailStout]

Fully expect 4-8 with a couple of moral victories. And a very active sunshine pumping spooge-fest scene full of payboard jockies hammering the typical “give him time” narrative.

I’m absolutely fine with “give him time” so long as I feel we are definitively headed the right direction. Thus far there has been none of that

 

[OG Goat Holder]

Fully expect 4-8 with a couple of moral victories. And a very active sunshine pumping spooge-fest scene full of payboard jockies hammering the typical “give him time” narrative.

Exactly what will happen.

 

[Lucifer Morningstar]

Fully expect 4-8 with a couple of moral victories. And a very active sunshine pumping spooge-fest scene full of payboard jockies hammering the typical “give him time” narrative.

 

[patdog]

Fully expect 4-8 with a couple of moral victories. And a very active sunshine pumping spooge-fest scene full of payboard jockies hammering the typical “give him time” narrative.

You’re an optimist. I expect 3-9 & more excuses. And another year.

 

[HotMop]

Lebby sucks, he should have been fired after Toledo.

 

[Baddog11]

Lebbie sucks. He’s all in on a quarterback that stands no chance at staying healthy….again this year….

 

[Seinfeld]

I would argue that patience with head coaches is higher right now than it was 3-5 years ago. There were only a handful of HC changes in the entire P5 last year and the only one that was what I would call a quick trigger was Ryan Walters at Purdue. He was kinda their Moorhead (even worse record-wise) that followed up a successful coach that went elsewhere.

There were zero coaching changes in the SEC last year and that included Auburn keeping Freeze who has yet to have a winning season there, UK keeping Stoops after he tried to leave and then went 4-8, Florida keeping Napier in spite of being 19-19 (10-14) after three years, Oklahoma keeping Venables after his second losing season in 3 years, etc.

No, it is not normal to fire your coach within two years. It definitely would not be normal for us to do it for the third time since early 2020.

If Lebby shows any smidge of progress from last year, he will get a Year 3. Can just about guarantee that.

Gotta wonder if that’s truly patience or the fact that schools simply can’t be paying 7 figure buyouts with $21M in revenue sharing on the way

 

[TheDawg-Pound]

Because of everything that's transpired after the departure of Mullen we are pretty much in a spot where we have to keep him barring another 2-10 or less disaster, and we probably keep him then as long as he cans Hutzler. My main concern with the Lebby hire was not Lebby himself, but the Hutzler hire. The guy had zero business getting a job as a play caller in the SEC. None. Then on top of that we gave him a guaranteed 3 year 1 million per year deal. If that was the only guy Lebby could pull as DC, which makes me worry in itself, then Hutzler should've been given a 1 year deal at about 350,000. Take it or leave it prove yourself deal. Then, on top of all that, zero changes were made to the defensive staff. I get a shitshow was inherited, and last year was probably the least talented defense in modern MSU football history, but there was zero excuse for looking as unprepared and out of position as we were. Rhoads and MacIntyre were brought in as analyst hopefully to guide Hutzler and clean some of that stuff up.

All that said, we are more talented on both sides(couldn't be any worse) of the ball. If the defense is historically bad early on he'd better pull the plug and promote either Rhoads, MacIntyre, or both to run the ship. If we go 4-8 and look competitive I'll have more confidence going forward.

Hutzler not leaving Alabama the moment he was hired he should have been on a short leash from the start. He should have been fired last year. I get the process but Hutzler did a lot of this to himself. I'm expecting more than improvement from defense because of this. There needs to be a turn around or he's out.

 

[TheDawg-Pound]

It would take another 2-10 (0-8) for him to possibly get the boot this year, IMO. You’ve almost got to give him 3 years just to see if having a smidge of continuity works for us.

My suspicion is we win 3 or 4 games, his staff is the scapegoat, and he gets a Year 3 with major staff changes for next year.

Okay but then who is going to come in to that. No one without being grossly overpaid and then large and long contract buyout so our handcuffed cash flow continues.

 

[maroonmania]

Hutzler not leaving Alabama the moment he was hired he should have been on a short leash from the start. He should have been fired last year. I get the process but Hutzler did a lot of this to himself. I'm expecting more than improvement from defense because of this. There needs to be a turn around or he's out.

Yep, my pessimism on Jeff Lebby can be summed up in two words, Coleman Hutzler. He took bad talent last year and seemingly coached them down. Hutzler had no real credentials to warrant an SEC DC job and his recruiting has not been up to par. You would think with all of the defensive playing time we can offer with decent NIL we could get some real difference makers to come but apparently not. And now our defensive HS recruiting has gone in the toilet. I really can't think of any good reason why he was retained. Lebby keeping him could very well be his downfall.