For me, he gets 3 years to have a NIT team. I don't expect anything in the first 2 years but after that - we should at least make a NIT.
Discuss.
Discuss.
Let's discuss about Ray and expectations...
- Thread starter dawgstudent
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For me, he gets 3 years to have a NIT team. I don't expect anything in the first 2 years but after that - we should at least make a NIT.
Discuss.
Discuss.
For me, he gets 3 years to have a NIT team. I don't expect anything in the first 2 years but after that - we should at least make a NIT.
Discuss.
Discuss.
But I think you pretty much it it. If he can't make the NIT by year three, no matter how bad it may be at the moment, that's probably an indication that it isn't working out.
Unless there's something crazy like a winless season the 2nd year or an off the court scandal. In the 4th year we don't have to be in postseason play, but we should be damn, DAMN close and show signs of promise, i.e. we have a badass recruiting class coming in.
Hopefully the crxxms disaster will force everyone who matters to watch closely for Maine/Tulane clues to incompetence. The safety needs to be off and the trigger finger should be resting on the guard.
So far, I've seen nothing that gives much confidence. But it's too early.
So far, I've seen nothing that gives much confidence. But it's too early.
If Stansbury is back you give him one more year to make the NCAAs, since he's shown that he can get a team that far. If we don't make it, that'd be 4 straight years without a berth.
For a brand new coach you have to give them time to get their players in there, and install their system.
For a brand new coach you have to give them time to get their players in there, and install their system.
just think about what we are right now. We have Jalen, Wendell, Rocquez, Shaun, and Kristers. Kristers has to sit 33% of the season next year and Jalen is the only one who has any business starting next year. We have no core or leadership and we would be a below .500 team in the SWAC next season. How do you expect Ray to recruit top talent to MSU anytime soon? We are literally starting over. Our basketball program is at rock bottom. To think that we should even sniff the NCAAT in 3 years is unrealistically naive.
Hard to say right now being that Reed Clayton or Baxter Priceis our starting point guard if the season started today. I honestly would be shocked if we win more than 10 games next year.
Now if by some miracle Pollard, Thomas, Sword, and Gray all end up at MSU then I would expect an NIT bid in year two and an NCAA bid in year three.
Now if by some miracle Pollard, Thomas, Sword, and Gray all end up at MSU then I would expect an NIT bid in year two and an NCAA bid in year three.
After that we should be there 50% of the time.
Our "old coach" has left the basketball program in shambles and if we lose the class he signed it will be even worse..
Our "old coach" has left the basketball program in shambles and if we lose the class he signed it will be even worse..
I say NIT by year 3 and NCAA no later than year 5. SEC football and baseball programs take depth and experience to compete and thus take longer to build. Basketball, for whatever reason, doesn't work that way. If Ray is a good coach we should have no problem making the tournament by year 4 and possibly year 3.
NIT in three years? I've never understood why being one of the 64 best teams in the country is so hard. I would certainly hope we're one of the 96 best teams in the country in 2 years. I realize that next year we literally have no players, but it's not like we play a hard OOC schedule, or that we play in league with a bunch of good teams. If he's a good coach he will have us in the tourney in three years. If he's not, I don't want him.
I am unsure if I really have expecations right now. I mean we barely have enough to qualify for a team. I think the idea of letting him go can't happen till year 4. His first real class isn't going to be till next year so this year is more like practice. I do have this sort of expectation that we are going to play really hard with passion. These last few years have been just horrible to watch at times. I mean you could see that they didn't care.
If he can pick up a decent transfer or two in the next couple of months and put together a decent class in Nov, the NIT should be expected in year 2.
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I think the jury is still out on that... At any rate, many would say that the progress has been too slow.
well it is going to be hard because I don't see very much to go on right now, but I think it is pretty safe to say we should have fired stansbury long before, now ... he has truly imploded a basketball team that 3 years ago had a commercial or billboard that said this was the hardest ticket to get intown. He needs to release a statement apologizing for still getting a paycheck to do what he did, to a university he says he loves.
1) We have to work hard and fight
2) We should notice improvement throughout each year
3) We have to recruit our asses off
4) We need to be a top-96 team in 3 years ...we could basically have a roster of JR-SR in the next 4 years, then rebuild all over again, if we can get the right people to come here right now
1) We have to work hard and fight
2) We should notice improvement throughout each year
3) We have to recruit our asses off
4) We need to be a top-96 team in 3 years ...we could basically have a roster of JR-SR in the next 4 years, then rebuild all over again, if we can get the right people to come here right now
And I said yes, because I thought it would be a bad thing for MSU because at the end of the day finding someone to eclipse Stans' success at MSU would be difficult.
Im certainly not saying I was right, because Ray could come in and have a surprising year next year or the year following as, C. Martin proved that at Tennessee, but if you had asked an Ole Miss fan to lay out a blue print as to what they wanted to see happen to MSU basketball about six weeks ago, Im pretty sure the most rabid and delusional Ole Miss fan would have said the following on March 1, 2012:
"MSU should fire Stansbury"
"Moultrie would then go pro"
"MSU would then hire an assistant coach at Clemson, that no one had really heard of"
"MSU would then have a basketball signee asking for a release"
"MSU would then get out of the running for the McDonalds All American Pollard"
"MSU would then lose Rodney Hood to a transfer"
"MSU would then struggle to be relevant for the next two years in the SEC"
To me, if this had been posted back then, I don't think a single poster would have thought even 30% of that happening as being possible when Coach was chanting Shaka Smart!, Shaka Smart!
All I know is that if I could be in charge of MSU basketball as an Ole Miss sleeper cell, everything that has happened to MSU basketball in the last month, would have been by design.
Im certainly not saying I was right, because Ray could come in and have a surprising year next year or the year following as, C. Martin proved that at Tennessee, but if you had asked an Ole Miss fan to lay out a blue print as to what they wanted to see happen to MSU basketball about six weeks ago, Im pretty sure the most rabid and delusional Ole Miss fan would have said the following on March 1, 2012:
"MSU should fire Stansbury"
"Moultrie would then go pro"
"MSU would then hire an assistant coach at Clemson, that no one had really heard of"
"MSU would then have a basketball signee asking for a release"
"MSU would then get out of the running for the McDonalds All American Pollard"
"MSU would then lose Rodney Hood to a transfer"
"MSU would then struggle to be relevant for the next two years in the SEC"
To me, if this had been posted back then, I don't think a single poster would have thought even 30% of that happening as being possible when Coach was chanting Shaka Smart!, Shaka Smart!
All I know is that if I could be in charge of MSU basketball as an Ole Miss sleeper cell, everything that has happened to MSU basketball in the last month, would have been by design.
the way college basketball is today it is dominated by freshmen and sophmores. It shouldnt take him that long to get things back on track. He should get a one year pass for 2012-2013 season then 3 years after that to make the NCAA once or possibly back to back NIT berths for me to bring him back for a 5th season.
It is not that hard to find a couple of Phil Turner/ Barry Stewarttype players out there to fill your roster with . Guys who weren't really offered by anyone (Turner was offered by Jackson State and USM- Stewart offered by Chattanooga and Middle Tenn) who play hard and can contribute to a certain extent to what you are trying to do on the court. I am just about sick of the 5star / McDonalds All American type player. All the ones we land are pre-madonna and either leave or dont live up to expectations. Give me 5 Phil Turnersand I'll be ok</p>
It is not that hard to find a couple of Phil Turner/ Barry Stewarttype players out there to fill your roster with . Guys who weren't really offered by anyone (Turner was offered by Jackson State and USM- Stewart offered by Chattanooga and Middle Tenn) who play hard and can contribute to a certain extent to what you are trying to do on the court. I am just about sick of the 5star / McDonalds All American type player. All the ones we land are pre-madonna and either leave or dont live up to expectations. Give me 5 Phil Turnersand I'll be ok</p>
Calipari took over the trainwreck that Tubby and Gillespie left and in three years has taken them to an Elite 8, a Final Four, and a NC - with basically three different teams.
And before you start yelling about comparing UK to MSU, I get the difference.
But if Cal can do that, given the schedule MSU will play over the next couple of seasons (in conference and out), don't you think its reasonable to expect to have a team that can compete for an NIT berth in year 2?
And before you start yelling about comparing UK to MSU, I get the difference.
But if Cal can do that, given the schedule MSU will play over the next couple of seasons (in conference and out), don't you think its reasonable to expect to have a team that can compete for an NIT berth in year 2?
That Kentucky team Cal inherited was able to keep their top player in Patterson as well as signing 5 HS all Americans 4 of whom were 1st round picks following their freshman year.
I am not going to base it on any signing classes yet. I will base expectations on what difference I see in the team between November and March.
We were patient with Dan because we saw definite improvement between the start and finish of every season.
I think Cohen has improved a little more slowly than we wanted, but I am seeing a difference between now and when he took over.
No reason not to give New Rick the same chance.
We were patient with Dan because we saw definite improvement between the start and finish of every season.
I think Cohen has improved a little more slowly than we wanted, but I am seeing a difference between now and when he took over.
No reason not to give New Rick the same chance.
is for Ray to have a full 13 man roster on scholarship by August. He has stressed that his team will work hard so I expect him to use his 4 open roster spots to bring in guys that match what he wants to accomplish on the court. That's it. I think that's an attainable expectation. Putting wins and losses expectations on Ray right now is pointless when he currently only has 5 basketball players.
We need to know what kind of team we have when the season starts to determine realisticexpectations. Personally, I would like to see improvement from year one to year two but to be fair I will need to know who we have on our team to determine specific expectations.
We're about to be in the wilderness.
It's kind of like a divorce that is necessary. It sucks in the beginning for all involved, but after a while, you start to see how much better off you are, even though you are in a bad place for a while. Coach34 knows all about this topic as well.
It's kind of like a divorce that is necessary. It sucks in the beginning for all involved, but after a while, you start to see how much better off you are, even though you are in a bad place for a while. Coach34 knows all about this topic as well.
...
oh wait... never mind.
i'd be happy if he got some players to State that wanted to be AT State. I'm tired of seeing the floodgates open at the end of the season. Most of this year's departure has specifically to do with "this" year and not what drove previous transfers.
i think coach ray will have his work cut out for him. i would certainly expect him to avoid places like this. i'll be interested to see what sort of system he'd like to build.
oh wait... never mind.
i'd be happy if he got some players to State that wanted to be AT State. I'm tired of seeing the floodgates open at the end of the season. Most of this year's departure has specifically to do with "this" year and not what drove previous transfers.
i think coach ray will have his work cut out for him. i would certainly expect him to avoid places like this. i'll be interested to see what sort of system he'd like to build.
with expectations of SIGNIFICANT improvement season to season...
this aint football and baseball where you have to develop players.....
And I'm being lenient on 3 years.....he has some good players coming in....maybe not a lot of depth, but hell stansbury really only had 7 players this year....
this aint football and baseball where you have to develop players.....
And I'm being lenient on 3 years.....he has some good players coming in....maybe not a lot of depth, but hell stansbury really only had 7 players this year....
I think he gets 3 years minimum. I wouldn't put an NIT or bust label on year 3 --- but would more judge him on body of work. Do we see improvement over the first 3 years, or do we look as bad in 2015 as we did in 2013?
If we're seeing improvement, not having off the court issues, and he seems to be getting good effort out fo the players - I'd be all for giving him year 4 even if we don't make NIT in years 1-3.
But if nothing changes in 3 years, it's time to find another coach.
If we're seeing improvement, not having off the court issues, and he seems to be getting good effort out fo the players - I'd be all for giving him year 4 even if we don't make NIT in years 1-3.
But if nothing changes in 3 years, it's time to find another coach.
Thanks for making my point.AshleySchaffer said:
In the spirit of full disclosure, Orton was a Gillespie recruit as was Hood. Cal brough in Wall, Cousins, Bledsoe and Dodson.
The Kentucky team Cal inherited lostin the early rounds of the NIT the year before - WITH Jodie Meeks.
Thanks for playing.