Mullen is 0-15 vs Top 20 teams...

[fishwater99]

He is 1-19 vs teams with 8 wins...
Dan has no real signature win in 4 years.
Hell, even Crooms beat Bama..

He is 2-16 vs Top 25 teams.
2009 (win over #25 Ole Miss)
2009 (loss to #25 G. Tech)
2010 (win over #22 UF)


Let that sink in..

 

[Railin Jemmye]

The Ole Miss and Florida wins were both just as good as Croom's Alabama win(s)..

...and probably just as good as his Auburn win. Alabama was 6-6 in 2006 and 2007, Florida was 7-5 in 2010. Ole Miss was 8-4 in 2009 and equals Auburn's 8-4 season in 2007.

Quit posting completely idiotic ****.

 

[FlabLoser]

He is 1-19 vs teams with 8 wins...
Dan has no real signature win in 4 years.
Hell, even Crooms beat Bama..

He is 2-16 vs Top 25 teams.
2009 (win over #25 Ole Miss)
2009 (loss to #25 G. Tech)
2010 (win over #22 UF)


Let that sink in..

As was posted here in another thread, somebody listed results of all the 8-win teams. The overwhelming majority of 8-win teams are 0-fer against top 20 opponents.

 

[SwingAway]

As was posted here in another thread, somebody listed results of all the 8-win teams. The overwhelming majority of 8-win teams are 0-fer against top 20 opponents.

All other 8 win teams have beaten at least 2 bowl teams. Most 3 or more

 

[Railin Jemmye]

MTSU was 8-4 with a win over an ACC Championship game participant, at their field. They got snubbed for a bowl. Just pointing out that they are in fact in the conversation when talking about 'bowl' teams people have beaten.

 

[slickdawg]

Lets look at our history since 2000:

Jackie 16-31 (7-25) last 4 seasons, 1 bowl game

Sylvester 17-30 (8-24) in 4 years, 1 bowl game
Sylvester 21-38 (10-30) in 5 years, 1 bowl game

Dan 29-23 (13-19) in 4 years, 3 bowl games

This year, by winning 8 games, we won as many as Jackie did in 2001, 2002 and 2003 COMBINED. He won one game less than Sylvester Croom did in 2004, 2005 and 2006 combined. Mullen won 21 games in his first three years, a feat it took Sylvester FIVE years to do.

Did the end of this season suck? Absolutely. Are we better off than we were four years ago? Hell yes! We redshirted guys this year that would have started immediately in the 2003-2009 time frame. It takes time to build a program, and Dan is building it. We've gone from "Gee, I wish we could win six and go to a bowl" to "We're on our second NYD bowl in three years, we lost, we suck". Really??

 

[FlabLoser]

All other 8 win teams have beaten at least 2 bowl teams. Most 3 or more

We beat MTSU who was 8-4, finished 4th in their conference, and earned a bowl bid which they did not receive.

Troy was 5-7 and didn't go to a bowl....because we beat them.

We beat Tennessee who didn't go to a bowl game because they lost a 4 OT game to Mizzou.

Now if you had a valid point, it ought to be visible without hair-splitting.

 

[slickdawg]

2001-2008 State was 29-65 (13-51) [.308/.203]

2009-2012 State was 29-21 (13-19) [.580 /.406]

Dan did in 4 years what others did in 8.

 

[missouridawg]

Some more Mullen nuggets...

Croom coached 4 years against Mike Shula, who ammassed a stellar 26-23 record in 4 years at Alabama. I hate to be so arrogant... but you could put my grandma in the head coach role at Alabama and she could win more games than that.

In Crooms 4th year, he beat Saban head to head in what was one of the best games ever at Scott Field. I landed in Calgary for a business trip and got to watch the pick 6 right at the half before I boarded my next flight. That was a great plane flight.

You know who also beat Saban that year? The guy who coached at UL Monroe at the time.

Mullen has coached 4 years against Alabama. In those 4 years, Alabama has gone undefeated for a National championship, won 10 games and the Cap One Bowl, went 12-1 for a National Championship, and is currently 12-1 playing for it's 3rd National Championship in 4 years (which would tie Nebraska's record). So in the four years Mullen has been here, Saban has led Bama to a 48-5. Let me repeat that. Forty Eight wins, Five losses. Those five losses are South Carolina (2010), Auburn (2010 - went on to win NCG), LSU (2010), LSU (2011), aTm (2012). So it took Steve Spurrier, two Heisman trophy winners, and the best football program not named Alabama to beat them in the last 4 years.

Even Croom beat Alabama? That's about the dumbest thing that could be said about Mullen right now.

Complain about his offense lacking? Fine. Complain about his demeanor? Fine. Complain about his **** talking? Fine. Complain about his special teams? Fine. But to complain about him "not beating Alabama" is 17ing retarded. I'm suprised there is wifi on the short bus.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Fishwater you have been completely owned here, pal.

 

[mstateglfr]

Hell, even Crooms beat Bama..

He did beat Bama. And that was hardly a signature win. That win is nothing to speak about after that season ended. Bama was average that year. Just because its Bama doesnt mean its always a great win. Currently it does, but now always.

 

[fishwater99]

I agree it was not a signature win, just a quick jab at Dan..

My point is that Dan is not getting it done and it looks like he never will at MSU.
It appears that we have peaked under Mullen and we will be lucky to win 6 games next year...

 

[missouridawg]

I agree it was not a signature win, just a quick jab at Dan..

My point is that Dan is not getting it done and it looks like he never will at MSU.
It appears that we have peaked under Mullen and we will be lucky to win 6 games next year...

You are free to think that. I'm not going to bash it one way or the other...

But with that train of thought, Spurrier should've been fired at USCe after a 7-6 fourth year and 7-6 fifth year.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Sooo.....You are posting complete horsecrap. Yep.

 

[FlabLoser]

My point is that Dan is not getting it done and it looks like he never will at MSU.

After Croom averaged 2-3 wins per year, if I had told you that our next coach was going to go 5-7, 9-4, 7-6, 8-5 and get us to the Gator twice and Music City once...you wouldn't have taken that? You would have said, no that's not good enough?

What were your expectations?

Name another program where a coach steps into a multi-year disaster of a program and elevates it to, what, a BCS competitor (?) in 4 years.

 

[SwingAway]

You are free to think that. I'm not going to bash it one way or the other...

But with that train of thought, Spurrier should've been fired at USCe after a 7-6 fourth year and 7-6 fifth year.

Does Dan have a NC like Spurrier?
Does Dan have 6 SEC Championships like Spurrier?

This is ridiculous. Spurrier is a legend and Dan is a first time coach. You can stop the Spurrier talk in these various threads because it makes you look foolish.

 

[FlabLoser]

Does Dan have a NC like Spurrier?
Does Dan have 6 SEC Championships like Spurrier?

This is ridiculous. Spurrier is a legend and Dan is a first time coach. You can stop the Spurrier talk in these various threads because it makes you look foolish.

OK, Spurrier is college football's Vince Lombardi.

Yet Dan in his first 4 years at State has done just as well as Vince in his first 4 years at South Carolina. What's that say about Dan?

 

[fishwater99]

Just the fact than Mullen has yet to beat a Top 20 team at MSU.

When will he do it, YEAR 5, 6, 7, OR 8?
Will he ever beat a Top 20 Team while coaching at MSU??

When will Mullen learn to make better coaching adjustments, especially at halftime?
Why does he stick with TR in the 2nd half vs NW when he clearly wasn't getting it done?
Why did we not run a more pro-style offense with TR at QB, do we not have anyone to play FB?
Why did we not run the ball more in the 2nd half vs NW when we were clearly having success in the 1st half?
Why is Chris Wilson still on our staff?

 

[SwingAway]

OK, Spurrier is college football's Vince Lombardi.

Yet Dan in his first 4 years at State has done just as well as Vince in his first 4 years at South Carolina. What's that say about Dan?

Nobody's saying get rid of Dan either. And if we go 7-6 next year like 'Vince' nobody will be saying get rid of Dan either.

But Dan is on his way to 5-7 next season based on what I saw from this year's performance. More teams with pulse's means more games Mullen fails in.

 

[FlabLoser]

Just the fact than Mullen has yet to beat a Top 20 team at MSU.

When will he do it, YEAR 5, 6, 7, OR 8?

Will he ever beat a Top 20 Team while coaching at MSU??

Rubs Magic 8 Ball....Signs point to yes.

When will Mullen learn to make better coaching adjustments, especially at halftime?

Mullen has better information than you on what's working, what's not, and what's possible during the flow of a game. If it was as easy as you believe, quality head coaches would be employed in every program for $70,000.

Why does he stick with TR in the 2nd half vs NW when he clearly wasn't getting it done?

Maybe because he is more interested in developing and maturing his QB than going 9-4. Maybe he is patient enough not to mortgage the future for a mid teir bowl game.

Why did we not run a more pro-style offense with TR at QB, do we not have anyone to play FB?

You're right. After the Troy game, when it was clear that this new offense was challenged, we should have quit on the playbook and installed a newer offense mid-season.

Why did we not run the ball more in the 2nd half vs NW when we were clearly having success in the 1st half?

I don't know. Playcalling in this new offense has been suspect a lot this year.

Why is Chris Wilson still on our staff?

Your man-crush, Spurrier, stayed with Tyrone Nix (current DC at MTSU) for 3 seasons. Once, Spurrier called him out in a post game press conference to ask him why the other team has made big plays against South Carolina. Mullen sorta did the same by announcing Gator Bowl morning that Collins was going to be calling plays.

 

[DAWG61]

I thought our DL played better yesterday. Wilson was coaching them. We know he can recruit so maybe it's best to have him as DL coach and not DC?

 

[Corch42]

That Dan plays a much easier schedule than "Vince."

OK, Spurrier is college football's Vince Lombardi.

Yet Dan in his first 4 years at State has done just as well as Vince in his first 4 years at South Carolina. What's that say about Dan?

The real difference is that you're stupid enough to believe that Dan Mullen is in the same category as Spurrier. Mullen may end up being a good coach, record wise. But to compare him to Spurrier after 4 years of beating up on Sun Belt teams is simply retarded.

 

[Railin Jemmye]

Technically, uhh, yes he does.....

2008 n ****.

 

[fishwater99]

My point is Wilson has not proved to be a very capable Defensive Coordinator at MSU.
He stuck with rushing 3 on the DL all year, we do not have the talent to do that in the SEC and put pressure on the QB.
Sure make him the recruiting coordinator, but our DL has not impressed me this year. Next year might be different.

 

[fishwater99]

Not so fast Flab..

Just the fact than Mullen has yet to beat a Top 20 team at MSU.

When will he do it, YEAR 5, 6, 7, OR 8?

Will he ever beat a Top 20 Team while coaching at MSU??

Rubs Magic 8 Ball....Signs point to yes.
(I hope it's sooner rather than later)

When will Mullen learn to make better coaching adjustments, especially at halftime?

Mullen has better information than you on what's working, what's not, and what's possible during the flow of a game. If it was as easy as you believe, quality head coaches would be employed in every program for $70,000.
(Well he sure as Hell didn't realize that TR at QB was not working yesterday and that we need to put DAK in and run the damn ball)

Why does he stick with TR in the 2nd half vs NW when he clearly wasn't getting it done?

Maybe because he is more interested in developing and maturing his QB than going 9-4. Maybe he is patient enough not to mortgage the future for a mid teir bowl game.
(I think it may have hurt TR more by leaving him in the game when he was playing bad, he might never recover from that performance yesterday)

Why did we not run a more pro-style offense with TR at QB, do we not have anyone to play FB?

You're right. After the Troy game, when it was clear that this new offense was challenged, we should have quit on the playbook and installed a newer offense mid-season.
(My point is that TR is not and never was a running/spread QB, we had all off-season to adapt the offense to TR's skill set, and didn't. Dan is either too arrogant or just not the offensive genius some of you think he is.)

Why did we not run the ball more in the 2nd half vs NW when we were clearly having success in the 1st half?

I don't know. Playcalling in this new offense has been suspect a lot this year.
( I totally agree.)

Why is Chris Wilson still on our staff?

Your man-crush, Spurrier, stayed with Tyrone Nix (current DC at MTSU) for 3 seasons. Once, Spurrier called him out in a post game press conference to ask him why the other team has made big plays against South Carolina. Mullen sorta did the same by announcing Gator Bowl morning that Collins was going to be calling plays.
( I have never said anything about Spurrier, but Wilson should not be our DC any more. Let him recuit and be a position coach.)

 

[FlabLoser]

The real difference is that you're stupid enough to believe that Dan Mullen is in the same category as Spurrier. Mullen may end up being a good coach, record wise. But to compare him to Spurrier after 4 years of beating up on Sun Belt teams is simply retarded.

After 4 years at South Carolina, their own fans and other SEC fans questioned whether or not Spurrier was washed up, whether or not he had the energy to be a head coach. People questioned whether or not he shot his wad at Florida and just wasn't going to be able to do it at a lesser program.

Sound familiar? Or would you rather leverage hindsight of Spurrier to make arguments against Mullen while it is still impossible to give Mullen that same advantage?

 

[engie]

After 4 years at South Carolina, their own fans and other SEC fans questioned whether or not Spurrier was washed up, whether or not he had the energy to be a head coach. People questioned whether or not he shot his wad at Florida and just wasn't going to be able to do it at a lesser program.

Sound familiar? Or would you rather leverage hindsight of Spurrier to make arguments against Mullen while it is still impossible to give Mullen that same advantage?

Bingo.

 

[engie]

He is 1-19 vs teams with 8 wins...
Dan has no real signature win in 4 years.
Hell, even Crooms beat Bama..

He is 2-16 vs Top 25 teams.
2009 (win over #25 Ole Miss)
2009 (loss to #25 G. Tech)
2010 (win over #22 UF)


Let that sink in..

If you are going to make the argument, at least get the damn facts correct. It's a stupid argument to begin with, but making it factually incorrect simply takes it to a whole 'nother level of ridiculous.

Dan is 5-21 vs teams with at least 8 wins. Where in the 17 did you come up with 1-19?
Dan has 1(arguably) "bad loss" in 4 years--in Oxford. How many did Croom and Jackie have in their first 4 years? Bad losses cancel "signature" wins from where I'm sitting. We can go through the numbers, if you'd like -- but you don't want to -- because Mullen is kicking all their asses when you look at it from a LOGICAL PERSPECTIVE instead of blind ILLOGICAL BITCHING.

Even so, stuff we've accomplished under Dan Mullen that Fishwater doesn't consider "signature":
- Beat an 8-win UF in the Swamp. Last time we won there? 1965. 18 years before I was born. 16 STRAIGHT LOSSES in Gainesville. Not good enough to be considered "signature" though.

- Beat UGA period. Last time that happened? 1974. 9 years before I was born. 9 STRAIGHT LOSSES. Still not good enough for some people that call themselves Mississippi State "fans"

- Won our first SEC game of the season. Last time that happened? 1999. 12 STRAIGHT LOSSES. Doesn't qualify as "signature" though. Jackie accomplished this FOUR times in 13 years. 1996, 97, 98, 99. It's happened 7 times in 33 years -- but no one gives a damn when Mullen breaks these "bad" streaks.

- Beat Kentucky 4 times in a row. Last time that happened? NEVER. But no one gives a **** about beating UK now -- we just expect to every year -- even though we had NEVER previously accomplished this task.

- Beat Ole Miss 3 times in a row. Last time that happened? 1942. My deceased grandfathers were being drafted at the ripe old age of 18 to fight in WWII. Neither had met my grandmothers yet. But hey, this is EASY -- Certainly not "signature".

- Beat Arkansas period. Has happened 4 times in my lifetime. We had won 1 of the previous 13 prior to this year. Yet, certainly nothing "signature" about beating them while they were down. Nevermind that Croom lost to 5-6 and 4-7 Arky teams, while Jackie lost to 6-6, 4-7, 4-7, and 5-5-1 Arky teams. But by God we are MSU and can certainly, CERTAINLY EXPECT to beat them while they are down**

Just off the top of my head. I'm sure there are plenty of others. But hey, let's keep bitching about "signature wins"...

 

[FlabLoser]

If you are going to make the argument, at least get the damn facts correct. It's a stupid argument to begin with, but making it factually incorrect simply takes it to a whole 'nother level of ridiculous.

Dan is 5-21 vs teams with at least 8 wins. Where in the 17 did you come up with 1-19?
Dan has 1(arguably) "bad loss" in 4 years in Oxford. How many did Croom and Jackie have in their first 4 years? Bad losses cancel "signature" wins from where I'm sitting. We can go through the numbers, if you'd like -- but you don't want to -- because Mullen is kicking all their asses.

Even so, stuff we've accomplished under Dan Mullen that Fishwater doesn't consider "signature":
- Beat an 8-win UF in the Swamp. Last time we won there? 1965. 18 years before I was born. 16 STRAIGHT LOSSES. Not good enough to be considered "signature" though.

- Beat UGA period. Last time that happened? 1974. 9 years before I was born. 9 STRAIGHT LOSSES. Still not good enough for some idiots that call themselves Mississippi State "fans"

- Won our first SEC game of the season. Last time that happened? 1999. 12 STRAIGHT LOSSES. Doesn't qualify as "signature" though.

- Beat Kentucky 4 times in a row. Last time that happened? NEVER. But no one gives a **** about beating UK now -- we just expect to every year -- even though we had NEVER previously accomplished this task.

- Beat Ole Miss 3 times in a row. Last time that happened? 1942. My deceased grandfathers were being drafted at the ripe old age of 18 to fight in WWII. Neither had met my grandmothers yet. But hey, this is EASY -- Certainly not "signature".

- Beat Arkansas period. Has happened 4 times in my lifetime. We had won 1 of the previous 13 prior to this year. Yet, certainly nothing "signature" about beating them while they were down. Nevermind that Croom lost to 5-6 and 4-7 Arky teams, while Jackie lost to 6-6, 4-7, 4-7, and 5-5-1 Arky teams. But by God we are MSU and can certainly, CERTAINLY EXPECT to beat them while they are down**

Just off the top of my head. I'm sure there are plenty of others. But hey, let's keep bitching about "signature wins"...

...

 

[SwingAway]

@Engie I think most are bitching about effort. The kind that we came to love in 09 and 10 but was conspicuously absent this year. The giving up. The lack of emotion. The 'finesse' on both sides of the ball. The bend but dont break. It's all symptoms of the same problem. Softness is not a good condition for a football team. It's why we can't finish people off.

When we coast to end games it shows that we think the game is over. Therefore when we get down the idea that a game can be over before 0:00 4Q is already in our heads and we concede and Mullen doesn't do a damn thing about it. Relentless effort? Yeah right. The FL game, the GA game, our OM wins, we had it then. But we did not have it this year and it starts from the top down.

Mullen has succeeded but the complacency that we saw this year is a problem and we will pay by sitting at home next December if it continues.

 

[engie]

If people want to ***** about the effort, that is their right -- It was certainly lacking at times this year, no doubt. But leave it at THAT -- and don't try to make "effort" into a tangible thing like wins and losses to make an argument against Mullen. That's when I have to step in and bury it....

I think a large part of the "effort" that we don't see is simply due to not being very good -- and getting disheartened by that fact. Does that make it excusable? Hell no. Understandable? To an extent, yes. It's certainly 17'ing hard to play with relentless effort and confidence when you are continually getting your *** whipped. Still something that Mullen HAS to find the answer for this year. Because we ALL expect to see relentless effort @ MSU regardless of what happens with wins and losses.

That said, I saw pretty damn good defensive effort in that bowl game -- and defensive playcalling that was being modified to stop different things as the game went on. That's on Collins -- and he deserves credit for it. Our DL rotations were much better as well -- and that is on Wilson. Still don't think Cherry should have been playing, but that is another topic altogether. Collins brought 5 on damn near every play of that game in a "running down" and as such, we took away their best previous offensive weapons for large portions in that game. The "big play" killed us in this one -- but we got a bunch of 3-6 and outs as well. There just wasn't the defensive lethargy that we've been seeing -- there was some flying around and intensity. And that's with Collins JUST calling plays in Wilson's scheme.

Give Collins time to put in his (attacking) scheme that he has used @ FIU, and we are right back on track.
http://www.hailstate.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=16800&ATCLID=205075838

The offense is the bigger problem for us -- it is what needs the immediate fixing.

 

[fishwater99]

"Dan is 5-21 vs teams with at least 8 wins. Where in the 17 did you come up with 1-19?"

It was on ESPN College Game Day before the game...
I also think on it was on the Clarion Ledger Blog..

Also from covers.com
"Mississippi State’s Dan Mullen is 1-18 SU and 5-14 ATS versus .750 or greater opponents."

 

[engie]

"Dan is 5-21 vs teams with at least 8 wins. Where in the 17 did you come up with 1-19?"

It was on ESPN College Game Day before the game...
I also think on it was on the Clarion Ledger Blog..

Also from covers.com
"Mississippi State’s Dan Mullen is 1-18 SU and 5-14 ATS versus .750 or greater opponents."

So, you are regurgitating ESPN and Marcello -- and trusting them to produce factual MSU information? There's your first mistake.

1-18 against teams that win at least 10 games(9-4 < .750). Darn, can't believe we aren't consistently winning these**

 

[fishwater99]

You are correct.. I just did the research..
12(MTSU), 11 (LA Tech), 10 (UF), and 09(Ole Miss, MTSU)

But, he is still 0-15 vs Top 20 Teams, and I sure don't see us winning one of those next year, do you??

 

[engie]

You are correct.. I just did the research..
12(MTSU), 11 (LA Tech), 10 (UF), and 09(Ole Miss, MTSU)

But, he is still 0-15 vs Top 20 Teams, and I sure don't see us winning one of those next year, do you??

Would you with a different coach? I think a helluva lot changes from year to year(this year will be the same). We will see. I think fairly drastic changes are coming for us. No, I really don't see us beating any top notch teams next year, and I don't see us losing to any bad teams either. I think we could beat LSU in Starkville next year. There was alot of cracks in their armor a bunch of different times this year -- and they lose both dominant DEs. I also believe we could beat OK State in week 1.

This year wasn't great -- but in reality we're not losing much...

 

[SwingAway]

Would you with a different coach? I think a helluva lot changes from year to year(this year will be the same). We will see. I think fairly drastic changes are coming for us. No, I really don't see us beating any top notch teams next year, and I don't see us losing to any bad teams either. I think we could beat LSU in Starkville next year. There was alot of cracks in their armor a bunch of different times this year -- and they lose both dominant DEs. I also believe we could beat OK State in week 1.

This year wasn't great -- but in reality we're not losing much...

But what are we bringing back? A team that got throttled 5 times and laid down and yelled uncle to their rival.

5-7

 

[engie]

But what are we bringing back? A team that got throttled 5 times and laid down and yelled uncle to their rival.

5-7

What did OM bring back last year?

Bad argument is bad.

 

[Ace-Leroy]

Hell, even Crooms beat Bama..

Clearly the worst part of your post is this statement, comparing Croom's win over a lame Bama team to Dan's losses to them.

You are either very unintelligent or simply trying to throw **** at Mullen.....I'm guessing both.

 

[Todd4State]

With regards to my article about assistants- when Jackie was beating top 20 teams, we had Joe Lee Dunn as our DC.

I believe Dan can beat some top 20 teams with our current talent with better assistants. But we have to make a commitment to get those assistants.

 

[fishwater99]

What did OM bring back last year?

Bad argument is bad.

That's a Moot point..

Ole Miss brought in a new coach, we will still have Mullen(a coach he will not change his offense to suit our QB)..

7-5 or 6-6 is our Ceiling next year, if TR is still our QB and we don't run a pro style offense with a FB..