Shooting and Mass Casualties

[.S&C.]

But we did train him. The whole Al-Queda network was a CIA creation.

But that's no what started the problem. The whole Islamic revolution is a build up from the 50s.

I'm one of those guys that doesn't even care anymore who started what or even how it started. Sykes-Pecot agreement (most people have no idea what this is) is where a huge chunk of the modern problem started. But it's largely irrelevant to the U.S. right now.

It's good to take into account our part so we don't don't again. Beyond that? Now?

Go in, finish them, take their oil, force them to live in the consequences, and give THEM the next 150 years to rebuild and explain to future generations why you don't screw around with powerful nations. Take the GD kid gloves off and make a hundred year statement.

But I'm one of those bigoted psychos so....

 

[Crushgroove]

To clarify, Willy, I agree with you but disagree on your limited scope of Islamic theocratic war and hate for anything not Islam.

 

[NCukcat62]

Believe it or not, she is considered more hawkish than The Donald. A nasty, smelly stench in either direction if you ask me.

After yesterday. I am 1000% behind Donald trump. He's the only nominee that gets it.

 

[.S&C.]

After yesterday. I am 1000% behind Donald trump. He's the only nominee that gets it.

Lol. Hillary hawkish.

The media has spun that lie since she voted for the Iraq war. The common denominator with Hillary isn't a war vote, it actually contradicts her record. The common denominator is political. She sways with the polls.

Hillary has never been hawkish and her foreign policy record is the worst of any Secretary of State in modern history. I'd name all of her major failures but it would take way too long.

The shorter list? Foreign accomplishments. Ends when it starts.

 

[UKserialkiller]

Islam has been at war with all comers in the name of Mohammad since, AT LEAST, the 7th century. Listen to Col. Allen West.

Yes. Correct. The creation of Islam was 7th century. I'm talking more on a local sphere. Meaning why Islam and the US got into it. It wasn't really religion. It was a proxy war with Russia after WWII for natural resources. We changed the game when we ousted the Iran leader in the early 50s and put in a US puppet. That helped set the future problems between the US and Islam. Wasn't about religion, it was about oil.

They used the Islamic revolution as a mode to fight Western gaining power and influence in the area.

 

[Stonewall12]

You think Al-Queda formed itself?

Maybe this is what part of America's problem with understanding the war on terror.

Al Queda is not the source of the problem.

Maybe this is what America's problem is with understanding the war on terror.

 

[Perrin75]

It's hard to point to one moment when these problems got started, but I would probably look to the Carter administration as a good starting point. There are several things that happen during his Presidency that directly or indirectly lead to our current mess. Our policy to support the Shah of Iran and our failure to normalize relations with the new Iranian Government; our lack of effort to force both sides to live up to the Peace Accords that Carter brokered in the Israeli - Arab conflict; and most importantly the implementation of the Carter Doctrine which began a policy of increasing (and utilizing) the American Military presence in the Middle East. As a direct result, every President since Carter has been involved in major military operations against predominately Muslim countries ever since.

The tipping point for where we are now was most likely our decision to build Military bases in Saudi Arabia. Bin Laden used that as his moment for declaring Jihad against the United States. We don't know if our relationship with him went South before that, but it clearly became the moment where he (and subsequently Al Qaeda) became openly hostile against the US.

 

[UKserialkiller]

Go in, finish them, take their oil, force them to live in the consequences, and give THEM the next 150 years to rebuild and explain to future generations why you don't screw around with powerful nations. Take the GD kid gloves off and make a hundred year statement.

But I'm one of those bigoted psychos so....

It is a big deal to know how it started. America did not help itself with any meddling in the Middle East.

With that, I agree. Wipe them off the map.

 

[KingOfBBN]

Is anyone else not pretty terrified by finding out the security company he worked for and that his dad visited Congress a few months ago?


I'm surrounded by leftist all the time and one thing that they have memorized for talking points but are complete retards about is the history of the Crusades. Drives me nuts that they don't know a GD thing about how that started or what it was in response to and Muslims get a pass.

But it's what they do. When you're an ideologue, you don't do tons of research. You try to get the talking points and try to shout down someone when they're about to expose you.

 

[UKserialkiller]

Al Queda is not the source of the problem.

Maybe this is what America's problem is with understanding the war on terror.

Not sure you understand. I never said OBL. You did. The problems with America go beyond OBL. That was my point.

 

[UKserialkiller]

To clarify, Willy, I agree with you but disagree on your limited scope of Islamic theocratic war and hate for anything not Islam.

Gotcha.

Theocracy was a result, but not the cause of. I guess that's what I am saying.

Iran looked like the U.S in the 70s. It was faaaar from theocratic

 

[Stonewall12]

Not sure you understand. I never said OBL. You did. The problems with America go beyond OBL. That was my point.

I understand

 

[UKserialkiller]

I understand

Not really, but whatever

 

[TransyCat09]

Hillary wanted even more intervention in Libya, wanted troops and weapons in Syria, was partially responsible for the drone program, etc.

She is basically a neocon when it comes to military intervention. That's a bad thing imo, so TIFWIW, but she is very much a hawk

 

[Stonewall12]

Not really, but whatever

[laughing]

You are so wise

 

[CatsFanGG24]

The guy in LA may have just been attending the parade, It is confirmed he is gay...good they got him though, stopped him from doing something.

 

[.S&C.]

It is a big deal to know how it started. America did not help itself with any meddling in the Middle East.

With that, I agree. Wipe them off the map.

Like I said the Sykes-Pecot agreement (old Asia Minor deal) started a huge part of the problem in modern times, and we should correct any mistakes sure, but it's largely irrelevant for the future no matter what we do. The caliphate has started, and the Islamist feel emboldened due to the nature of wording in the Koran. And since we've let them continue to slaughter and survive, hold land, and showed fear, it's now just a breeding ground for the crazy. At this point You could offer them land, a seat at the table, and full cooperation; they'd still try to kill us.

 

[.S&C.]

Is anyone else not pretty terrified by finding out the security company he worked for and that his dad visited Congress a few months ago?


I'm surrounded by leftist all the time and one thing that they have memorized for talking points but are complete retards about is the history of the Crusades. Drives me nuts that they don't know a GD thing about how that started or what it was in response to and Muslims get a pass.

But it's what they do. When you're an ideologue, you don't do tons of research. You try to get the talking points and try to shout down someone when they're about to expose you.

There are so many people who are completely clueless to the crusades.

 

[UKserialkiller]

[laughing]

You are so wise

Not really. Just have better understanding of the problems than you do.

You're no different than average ignorant American who thinks the problem with the Middle east is about Islam vs Christianity. That's actually pretty stupid. But I like said, whatever.

 

[mdlUK.1]

Gave him wpns to fight the Russians.

Not like we sent him to basic and infantry school.

Don't let facts enter into this.

 

[UKserialkiller]

Like I said the Sykes-Pecot agreement (old Asia Minor deal) started a huge part of the problem in modern times, and we should correct any mistakes sure, but it's largely irrelevant for the future no matter what we do. The caliphate has started, and the Islamist feel emboldened due to the nature of wording in the Koran. And since we've let them continue to slaughter and survive, hold land, and showed fear, it's now just a breeding ground for the crazy. At this point You could offer them land, a seat at the table, and full cooperation; they'd still try to kill us.

Totally agree with the last part. Just saying we can't ignore history and make **** up. We'll look like the inhabitants of Idocracry

 

[Crushgroove]

I get the impression that the current admin has 'Idiocracy' memorized and recites it daily like the Auburn Creed.

 

[UKserialkiller]

I get the impression that the current admin has 'Idiocracy' memorized and recites it daily like the Auburn Creed.

[laughing] That's a Stone Cold Lock there

 

[MegaBlue05]

Dying for a noble belief and cause is one thing. That's not what Islam is doing. They are killing for a political ideology mascaraing as a religion. That's what Islam is. They want to have full control over women for sex, children for their war, and the people for power. Sharia law is an ideology that most Muslims actually agree with in one form or another. And if you support it, you are nothing close to peaceful.

But with religion, none of that **** is "noble." That's my whole point. If you're willing to die for your faith in 2016 - Muslim, Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, Hindu - you're a GD moron. That's as blunt as I can put it.

In my opinion the world would be better off sans religion because they've been fighting with each other since the beginning of time.... but I know I'm a heathen with front row tickets to Slayer in residence Live from Hell ... with opening acts Cannibal Corpse, Kurt Cobain and the Head Holes, poetry reading from Charles Manson and a guest monologue from Ronald Reagan himself. DON'T MISS IT!!! :fire::fire::fire:

 

[.S&C.]

Believe it or not, she is considered more hawkish than The Donald. A nasty, smelly stench in either direction if you ask me.

Who considers her hawkish? The media likes to build her up as sort of "hawkish" as to make her appear more presidential. When the left hears of ANY sort of intervention, they see it as "hawkish". Hillary Clinton merely suggesting safe zones and minor intervention is "occupation" to the left. Her resume on foreign policy wouldn't be a grain of sand compared to a historical "hawk" president.

 

[Perrin75]

She is considered a Hawk because every time a War/military conflict has been mentioned she has been an advocate for it. Regardless of who is President she is ready to throw American lives and treasure at the problem. It's almost like she is a paid flunky for the major military companies. Oh wait...

 

[Catfan in Tn.]

You don't know what the killers motivation was? Really Mr. President?

 

[vhcat70]

We changed the game when we ousted the Iran leader in the early 50s and put in a US puppet. That helped set the future problems between the US and Islam. Wasn't about religion, it was about oil.

Between Shia & US, yes. Between Sunni & US, no. Never the twain shall meet. But it was over oil.

 

[qwesley]

I will agree that people on a watch list should not be able to buy a gun if we can also add that people under federal investigation cannot be eligible to be POTUS.

 

[.S&C.]

But with religion, none of that **** is "noble." That's my whole point. If you're willing to die for your faith in 2016 - Muslim, Christian, Jewish, Buddhist, Hindu - you're a GD moron. That's as blunt as I can put it.

In my opinion the world would be better off sans religion because they've been fighting with each other since the beginning of time.... but I know I'm a heathen with front row tickets to Slayer in residence Live from Hell ... with opening acts Cannibal Corpse, Kurt Cobain and the Head Holes, poetry reading from Charles Manson and a guest monologue from Ronald Reagan himself. DON'T MISS IT!!! :fire::fire::fire:

But with all due respect, you're a religious bigot. I mean, this is the third time I've seen you make those kinds of statements.

I hate to break this to ya, but everyone fought with everyone for centuries homeboy. People evolve in time, and you cannot name a single place on this map that at one time or another weren't fighting. So lets separate that because you are conflating issues that have nothing to do with one another, a usual tactic by people of your belief. Ususally next they try and paint "all religion" under a bad light instead of highlighting the bad one. Another tactic used.

How do you justify your position when supposed atheism and the absence of God has created far more destruction in the world than a peaceful religion like Christianity? Studies from all over prove without Christian interaction philanthropy would take a huge nose dive. What do you have against helping the needy and impoverished? For a non believer what more would you want out of a religion. Peaceful, offers their survives to all, feeds the poor, helps the needy. You don't accept the message of Christ? Ok. So past the fairy tales and hellish comic book section of the bible, why do you care?

And hell, I mean, self identified atheist have given us so much more as an alternative. Napoleon Bonaparte, Alfred Kinsey, Kim Jong II, Benito Mussolini etc. Those lightweight anti-religious atheist like Pol Pot and Joseph Stalin. Great examples of great worldly atheist.

Give me a break.

If you are willing to die for a just and altruistic cause, whether that be for a kid in the street or the feeling that you are spiritually saving thousands, it shows incredible self actualization and a thinking past most common people.

Not trying to change the topic but I keep forgetting which thread I'm in.

 

[mashburned]

I think the biggest problem everywhere is people talk too damn much.

 

[Crushgroove]

Bravo. :clap:

 

[.S&C.]

Looks like the body of Me-Shell. Her head on his body would be epic. Reports are she's a dude.

 

[Monroe Claxton]

Been in similar situations as Derek many times. If he knew that he was in Northern Kentucky, he wasn't that drunk

 

[starchief]

This is getting good!

Paddock posters:

1 Never show up at the appointed place, date and time for the battle.

2 Never pay up when they lose a bet.

Takes all the fun out of it.

 

[UKserialkiller]

And hell, I mean, self identified atheist have given us so much more as an alternative. Napoleon Bonaparte, Alfred Kinsey, Kim Jong II, Benito Mussolini etc. Those lightweight anti-religious atheist like Pol Pot and Joseph Stalin. Great examples of great worldly atheist.

None of them were truly Atheist. The reason why these leaders were portrayed as being Atheist is because of one choice. They were not going to let their countries be ran as a theocracy. They were opposed of religion being higher than the State. Which isn't a coincident that the Pledge of the Allegiance was changed in the 1950s to say "Under God" during a time of the birth of the Cold War. Up until then, the Soviet Union's Pledge was virtually the same as America's. It wasn't about Atheism at all, it was about not letting religion be higher than the State. Those leaders had egos that put themselves above the pushing of the religious power.

 

[.S&C.]

None of them were truly Atheist. The reason why these leaders were portrayed as being Atheist is because of one choice. They were not going to let their countries be ran as a theocracy. They were opposed of religion being higher than the State. Which isn't a coincident that the Pledge of the Allegiance was changed in the 1950s to say "Under God" during a time of the birth of the Cold War. Up until then, the Soviet Union's Pledge was virtually the same as America's. It wasn't about Atheism at all, it was about not letting religion be higher than the State. Those leaders had egos that put themselves above the pushing of the religious power.

Willie that's something I will just have to disagree on. The position of those men were all standing on a common denominator. They did not believe in a supreme being. None of them.

The world has a muslim problem, nothing more, nothing less.

 

[UKserialkiller]

Willie that's something I will just have to disagree on. The position of those men were all standing on a common denominator. They did not believe in a supreme being. None of them.

That isn't true? May they had some doubts. maybe. But they were not full blown Atheists.

But the one thing that is true. Is that their true religion is the state, not the religion.

The reason why the "under God" went into the Pledge is because of the very reason I said. Stalin did not believe in religion over State, and we had to distinguish ourselves from the Soviet Union's Pledge. That's the truth.


Timothy McVeigh supported himself as Christian. The KKK supported themselves as Christian. Do you think they symbolized Christianity?

 

[Bill Derington]

Willy, Those leaders were afraid of religion, didn't have anything to do with theocracy.

They wanted the state, and party to replace God in their lives.

We put Under God in the pledge in order to show that we weren't like them, God was above the State.

 

[UKserialkiller]

Willy, Those leaders were afraid of religion, didn't have anything to do with theocracy.

They wanted the state, and party to replace God in their lives.

We put Under God in the pledge in order to show that we weren't like them, God was above the State.

Bill, that's exactly what I just said.