I was typing that while you posted.
I guess I don't understand what a true atheist is.
Shooting and Mass Casualties
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I was typing that while you posted.
I guess I don't understand what a true atheist is.
Well, Hitler, the KKK, and Timothy McVeigh were all self-proclaimed Christians. Maybe I don't understand what Christianity is.
Well I don't actually believe in "atheism" exactly. So I'm more meaning non religious men of choice. They were. And several of those names have writings anyone cal go to and read for themselves. No use in really debating how "atheistic" they were.
Every group has some nuts, but non religious nuts are responsible for larger numbers of mass casualties. Self claimed atheist have tried for years to twist it up, changing the meaning, diluting their own writings, to shake the perception. They were non religious men. I'm not really sure how Joseph Stalin could have ever felt he would be held accountable in the afterlife.
I don't believe every agnostic is a bad person or looking to harm. The problem is, when a civilization moves away from the accountability associated with a higher power, I personally feel a certain self awareness and standard goes with it. But I'm one of those christians Willie, so, can you blame me?
HItler believed all over the map and isn't accepted as a christian in any sense of the word.
Come on Willie.
Hitler said this
“Besides that, I believe one thing: there is a Lord God! And this Lord God creates the peoples.” [1] ~Adolf Hitler
“We were convinced that the people need and require this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations; we have stamped it out” [2] ~Adolf Hitler
Hitler was allover the map because he was a meth addict.
Hitler was not a self proclaimed Christian, Hitler used Christianity to get elected because the German population was Christian.
Kind of like our President.
Timothy Mcveigh is not a nation, nor is the KKK.
My point was when a nation, limits or tries to remove religion what exactly do you call that?
Anyway, I was being serious when I said I didn't understand what atheism is.
Kind of like our President.
Timothy Mcveigh is not a nation, nor is the KKK.
My point was when a nation, limits or tries to remove religion what exactly do you call that?
Anyway, I was being serious when I said I didn't understand what atheism is.
Hitler is not considered a Christian by any reputable source on the subject that I've ever seen.
He was all over the map on religion and has many writings of claiming no God.
You can't be a christian and hurt people with ill intent.
lol, he was a meth head yea.
I use agnostic most of the time because I don't believe it's entirely possibly to be atheist. The KKK and Mcveigh are apples to oranges comparisons, like you said.
Not at all. I think you're a good man S & C. I don't blame you at all, you're following your faith.
But the extensiveness of those leader's Atheism is definitely debatable. Mao flat out stated that he did not want a theocratic State. Had nothing to do with Atheism. had everything to do with previous theocratic gov'ts It's just a label that created by religious believers.
Stalin was a self-proclaimed atheist. He encouraged secularism. Stalin was responsible for even more deaths than hitler, which included Jews, Muslims, and Christians. The only reason why he tolerated the church in the 1940s was to increase support against the advancing Germans. Hitler while not a full blown atheist despised Christianity and viewed it as weak. He was more fond of the Japaneses religion at the time. He wanted to move Germany to having no church with the country, including the Catholic Church.
What? Lol I know a lot of people were raised in the church and yet are atheists. Stalin was a self proclaimed atheist, it is very well known.
False.
The fact that Stalin practiced civil religion (like many atheists) does not excuse his actual atheism in any way. Stalin was an avowed atheist by his own admission (the Soviet was infested with atheists.) That's what it means in your words "their true religion is the state".
Go read Stalin: Court of the Red Czar and Young Joseph Stalin - both by Simon Sebag Montefiore on how Stalin became an atheist while in an Orthodox Seminary (also infested with atheists).
These atheists executed or sent to the Gulag every person that didn't practice their civil religion.
Still debatable, hahah I'm not conceding my point.
"He saw an opportunity to gather political support for his rule, by attacking the corruption of the Patriarchy of the Orthodox Church.
The Russian people greatly supported this.
Following his rise to power, Stalin reinstated the Orthodox Church, and was a tremendous proponent of the teachings.
So what Stalin might have thought, and how he behaved, are two very different things.
There really isn't any evidence to suggest he was a true Atheist.
Stalin often made notes in the books he read. One such note indicates he was a spiritual individual.
Stalin left such mark about God in the book by Anatole France "Last pages. Dialogues under a rose. About God": "Don‘t know traces, don‘t see. There is no Him for them." ("Следов не знают, не видят. Его для них нет."). It seems that Stalin thought he knew God’s traces and saw God, not like others.
Stalin actively criticized atheist writings.
Stalin "denied categorically to prescribe atheistic literature to his personal library, fastidiously calling it ""antireligious waste-paper (junk)"
Stalin was a poet (believe it or not) who wrote in his native Georgian language, quite often referring to god and faith.
(...) In his burden and song like the beam of the Sun, lived great truth – DIVINE dream.
(...) But people who forgot GOD, with darkness in their hearts, instead of wine served poison to him in the cup.
And told to him: "Damn you! Drink this cup to the bottom!... And your song is alien for us, and we don’t need your truth!"
The only real quote Stalin has ever reported making in favor of atheism was written by a man under the Khrushchev years. And Nikita Khrushchev was a militant atheist, who needed to capitalize on Stalinist support to solidify his power, so it is quite possible he had attributed to Stalin words which Stalin did not say."
crazies make me tired, and islam has more truly committed to murder crazies than anyone else. its that simple. fred phelps protests ****, crazy non-pants wearing pentecostals are annoying when in your face, I'm not big on the catholics with their hierarchy of self protection, and nothing is harder to deal with than a dullard protestant who thinks hard work is the ticket, or a calvinist that believes in predestination of the soul, etc. but again, today, i see none of them as committed to (and allowed to) murder as the islamonuts. f them. forever. and their police state, racist, child abusing, woman abusing, intolerant, disease infested, purely sectarian countries. i feel sorry for the truly descent among them, undoubtedly a plurality if not a majority, that otherwise would wish to live free...but i don't sympathize with them at the expense of allowing this to happen to us in the west as well. enough with it.
I think a lot of "religious" people aren't religious, per se, they just enjoy the fellowship, or the power/control/money aspect of it. Business, religion, and politics are all the same ****, really. You are convincing someone of something for some reason.
You know, they are fooling us, there is no God… all this talk about God is sheer nonsense.-Josef Stalin
Long talk with a Tunisian friend of mine a few months ago, said that most of ISIS are nothing more than thugs with no religious convictions. Basically they are offered to go into an area, pick wherever he wants to live, choose and take as many wives as he wants, provided with money and they can kill/torture whomever they want. Then they'll get a few religious fanatics to go blow themselves up to cause mayhem. (He had a former schoolmate who went off the deep in and blew himself up as part of this.
Per my friend--and this is a very smart reasonable guy, ISIS really isn't about religion--it's just a bunch of thugs. Something to think about.
Per my friend--and this is a very smart reasonable guy, ISIS really isn't about religion--it's just a bunch of thugs. Something to think about.
I love how anti-Christians point out the KKK, Hitler, the Crusades and McVeigh when saying how similar Christians are in terms of being terrorists, when it's been decades since anyone died from their hands.
Yeah I know. Using Hitler as an example for a "Christian" is laughable. He never killed Jews, gays, gypsies, pols, Slavs in the name of Jesus. He just thought the Germanic races were elite and wanted to cleanse Europe of other people. He also wanted world domination. Hitler only masqueraded as a Christian because Germany was devout Protestant in Prussia and Catholic in Bavaria.
Totalitarian dictators do not want competition in controlling their subjects. That's why they ban religion. Hell, many of these dictators claimed themselves to be divine and required worship. That ain't atheism. I can't think of any atrocities committed in the name of atheism. Religion on the other hand .....
I enjoy these discussions by the way. So don't think I have an agenda out for you. You're good in my book
This ain't true. There are some crazy Christian groups in the Eastern world perpetrating atrocities in the name of their religion (and other baseless reasons), including but not limited to the LRA and Anti Balaka groups in central Africa and NLFT of Northern India and Bangladesh. Their recent horrific crimes are just eclipsed in scale and scope by crazy Muslim groups.
Obviously extremist Islamic terrorist organizations are of major concern, but the ideological battle should be against extremism in general, not focused on one religion.
Have a friend that works in Homeland Security. The TSA swears it's the airlines decision, but I was getting flagged so much, I call BS.
You are exactly right but in this day and age. Islam is the true enemy. Orlando, Brussels, Paris, San bernardino. It's a world issue.
Anyone not a Jew, Muslim or any other organized religion - or a declared atheist - automatically gets lumped in with the Christians in the US. If they ever once attended a church service as a child, it doesn't matter if they dropped out as an adult and rejected every Christian teaching in the way they lived their life, yep, they were Christians.
There was a guy on here who proclaimed his involvement in his church and followed up later essentially saying he didn't even believe in God.
The definition of a Christian, according to a lot of people, is someone who believes that Jesus was a nice guy who said some nice things and got killed for it. So I like him. I'm a Christian.
If you post stupid **** on Facebook and/or internet forums you're flagged and on the list. I think that's how it works. Makes sense at least.
The problem is nearly made up entirely of a political ideology connected to islam. True christian faith is based on the promise of good, not evil, and the promotion of salvation. It has nothing to do with waging war on anyone, actually quite the opposite.
I give credit for saying the words "islamic extremist". That's tough for some in your circles.
NCukcat- I will say this. It is also pretty evident through Stalin's writings that he was spiritual. He does recognize a higher power. Maybe not the earth made God, but he did believe in a higher power.
Here's the kicker. Stalin strongly opposed Darwin's Evolution. He did not believe in Evolution. Which is one of the pieces that hard core Fundies use to label Atheists.
Here's the kicker. Stalin strongly opposed Darwin's Evolution. He did not believe in Evolution. Which is one of the pieces that hard core Fundies use to label Atheists.
To an extent you are correct. Stalin did believe in something, from reading he believed in a God of nature or whatever that means but I don't think he was a religious person in the sense you and me think of. I will also say this, I don't think any of these leaders did what they did in the name of Christianity or atheism. They were narcissistic and consider themselves their own god.
Nope. Most "terrorist attacks" in the Western World are carried out by groups not motivated by religion. Terrorism carried out by Islamist extremism is definitely leading the way, but Our issues lie with extremism.
There's some crappy stuff sprinkled throughout the NT and has been used to incite conflict. Plus, you have to take the OT into consideration if you're a Christian, which has some deplorable teachings.
On average, Christians and Christianity has done, and is doing, a much better job (for lack of a better term at the moment) of minimizing, or trivializing, the more extreme, fundamental aspects of their doctrine to promote a peaceful co-existence with non Christians. We need the same type of "reformation" with moderate Muslim majority.
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