I voted for this.
This is not a hypothetical case.....
- Thread starter L4Dawg
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No it was 100 on Obama and Biden. All they had to do was secure the border.
Turns out it was really simple to do.
Learn to code and cope!
I didn't support the "vaccine" via Operation Warp Speed but I fully support Operation Ludicrous Speed for deportations. They skipped our legal process coming in so they get no due process being shipped out.
How do you square that with the fact that no due process violates the constitution?
Is it an ends justify the means sort of view?
Is it that you simply don't care that parts are violated as long as you agree?
Oh great, another leftie who thinks they own the high moral ground. Nothing could be farther from the truth, but self-righteousness tends to be an all too common trait among liberals. So much so, we should probably change the word to "self-lefteousness".
Always find it amusing when a left-winger accuses the right of "koolaid-drinking" and moral bankruptcy when reality suggests it is you types who are oblivious to your brainwashing and immoral behavior. Any honest look at a balance-sheet of humanity & moral foundation would lean so far right as to make a comparison laughable.
Yeah, total ********!
"The cost of U.S. citizenship in 2024 varies depending on individual circumstances, including eligibility for waivers, geographic location, and personal preparation preferences. For most immigrants, the baseline expense is $725, but preparation and optional fees can significantly increase the total cost."
Maybe you haven't been paying attention, but the days of liberals going unchallenged by the actual adults on this ignorant, unjustified moral-outrage crap are OVER. We're not putting up with your BS anymore!
You may have eyes but you have not used them on a dictionary.
Our constitution affords due process to people before the government infringes on their constitutional rights. If you are living in the US as a non citizen you do not have the right to live here.
People are arrested and detained in the US all the time while awaiting trial. That is part of the "due process." If you are caught living here illegally, which is a crime, why should our government just let you keep being here illegally while waiting for a hearing? It could take years.
And yet the fence post would likely still win the argument*****
Your interpretation through this whole post is simply incorrect. It is objectively wrong, based on actual Constitutional cases.
Your interpretation is also circular. You ask why someone who is illegal should stay here while awaiting trial for being illegal, yet the trial is required to determine the person is here illegally.
It is unacceptable to ignore the Constitution just because it is inconvenient and following it will take a long time.
If something in there isn't 'good', then it needs to change by using the proper process. What you want is for the Constitution to change, but not actually do the work and follow the process to change it.
I'm not gonna be nice to you. Your post is literally the definition of zero awareness or empathy. It's incredibly stupid.
$725 + extras significantly increasing the cost is EXPENSIVE.
Most estimates have it in a broad range, but somewhere between 30% to 70% of people in America live PAYCHECK TO PAYCHECK. They don't just have $725 + change to drop.
How you read that excerpt and came to the wrong conclusion shows a distinct level of stupidity. Your critical thinking skills are broke. Not everyone has the same level of income as you or had the same opportunities to save up as you. It's actually a word that will probably trigger a sjw snowflake like you: Privilege.
Now your only rebuttal left will be "word length". As shown earlier in this thread - it's a telling level of low intelligence when the response is "too many words - i'm too dumb to read" and that's supposed to insult me.
In conclusion, you're an idiot. You're also not a morally good person. Don't respond, just read this a few times until maybe something clicks for you and you develop at least one iota of critical thinking.
A core tenant of due process is that one is innocent until proven guilty.
What happens (well i should say has already happened) when a guy is arrested because ICE says he's an illegal. 6 months of awaiting his trial in jail later, he's proven to be a US citizen.
How in any world is that due process or a good thing to allow run rampant?
The liberals knew what they were doing by opening the border.........Biden created this b.s. so eff due process under these circumstances..........Drastic times call for drastic measures and Trump is getting results.........So be it.........
I’m not assuming anything. I’m taking at face value what was written by the poster close to the situation, and it was clear that was the only thing on his record.
If that wasn’t the reason….and it just got denied and he got immediately detained by ICE for some other far more arbitrary purpose when he was legally here and just going through the normal process that he’s been doing for decades to keep it that way, then that’s actually far, far worse.
And by the way, I’ve heard similar stories from people close to my family, including one person from Europe who was detained for weeks due to a paperwork error on the government’s side during the actual citizen application process. It’s a shít show.
Toss another tally on the board for people who preach that their rights must not be infringed upon, but are in support of seeing other people's rights be violated.
Apparently the ends justify the means, even when the means are a clear and established violation of the Constitution.
But if that same justification to violate rights is given for something that negatively impacts them?...well "THATS A VIOLATION OF MY RIGHTS AND YOU ARE A SOCIALIST AND FACIST!"
This happens all the time with all sorts of crimes. People have rights or privileges restricted while awaiting trial in every court in this country.
My logic is sound. If you are not here legally then you have no right to be here. If caught being here illegally you should be detained or deported until your status is confirmed. Identifying yourself and proving your citizenship/resident status should be pretty straight forward. As simple as handing over an ID and having them run it. If you can't provide documentation you aren't allowed to do a lot of things in life.
Again, you cited circular reasoning as 'sound logic'.
You seem to think a random police officer or ICE agent is who should be the judge of whether someone is here legally or illegally. That is not how our legal system works.
You clearly dislike that reality, but it doesn't mean it can just be ignored.
Also, deporting someone until their legal status is confirmed is 17ing insane.
- where are they deported to?
- how do they get back to the US for their trial/hearing.
- what happens to their legal obligations in the US(rent, job, car payment, children, etc)?
- entering the US illegally is a misdemeanor on the first offense, so why aren't they innocent until proven guilty and allowed to post bail for a misdemeanor?
Your suggestion is straight chaos, completely unreasonable in a functioning society, and violates Due Process.
Things like this are a result of dimocrats allowing 20 million or so illegal's into the U.S. with the intention of fast tracking to citizenship so the democrat's could import foreigners to change the voting landscape.
This guy can thank the mentally disturbed people who voted for a senile SOB in 2020.
It does happen. That's not the point. The point is it should not happen.
And to your piece to golfer. What happens when ICE doesn't care to see your ID and arrests and detains you for 6 months anyways?
So your idea is if they don't have documentation and can't prove their status we just let them go? And yes I do trust police officers to check people's documents. They do it all the time.
I hate that it hurts people and their families. I really do. But we can't just not enforce laws. I'm in no way suggesting that these are bad people but we cannot just let people live here illegally. Yes a lot of them are good neighbors and hard working. But those factors should be used to determine who gets to enter this country legally, not who gets to stay illegally.
As for your list of questions: should we not enforce legal residency requirements because they are inconvenient for those who cannot prove their status? I am not going to pretend I can post a perfect immigration reform on sixpack. But I can confidently say that ignoring this problem under the guise of humanity had led us to a point where the only corrective action we have is strict enforcement. We have ignored this issue for too long.
I keep seeing this claim of 20MM illegals being let in by the left.
It is clear hat nobody making that claim wants to live in reality. In reality, people have illegally resided in the US for decades and decades, and came here regardless of which party sat in the Oval Office.
- The unauthorized immigrant population shot up in the early 00s when W Bush was president.
- Trump's first term featured him slashing legal immigration numbers...but the projected illegal population was almost unchanged from when Obama left the White House.
People living in the US illegally is not new and not due to Democrats. It is due to financial opportunity, economic stability, and personal safety.
Unauthorized immigrant population estimates U.S. | Statista
According to Pew Research Institute estimates, the population of unauthorized immigrants in the United States reached a record of ** million people in 2023.
www.statista.com
Does that happen often? Genuinely curious. What percentage of deportees or people detained for long periods have proof of legal status available?
It never happens. It's a red herring that low IQ idiots like this use when they lose on facts and merit. You can never expect morons like these to make honest arguments when they're taking the 20 side of 80/20 issues. They thought they had the perfect plan...flood the country with illegals, count them in the census, get more seats in congress, get more electoral votes, and never lose elections. Well it didn't work, now it's getting blown up, and all that's left for them is calling the other side immoral nazis. A whipped dog yells loudest and that's what they are...whipped dogs. Their tears pair well with my morning coffee.
What you consider Due Process for an illegal?
BSI keep seeing this claim of 20MM illegals being let in by the left.
It is clear hat nobody making that claim wants to live in reality. In reality, people have illegally resided in the US for decades and decades, and came here regardless of which party sat in the Oval Office.
- The unauthorized immigrant population shot up in the early 00s when W Bush was president.
- Trump's first term featured him slashing legal immigration numbers...but the projected illegal population was almost unchanged from when Obama left the White House.
People living in the US illegally is not new and not due to Democrats. It is due to financial opportunity, economic stability, and personal safety.
Unauthorized immigrant population estimates U.S. | Statista
According to Pew Research Institute estimates, the population of unauthorized immigrants in the United States reached a record of ** million people in 2023.
When you voted for Biden you became part of the problem
No. Almost all asylum cases are BS.
If they have documents that prove they're from some war torn region then that's different. But someone doesn't get to just show up undocumented and claim asylum. USAID was actually funding programs in Mexico to educate these folks on what to say and what not to say to claim asylum. That tells you all you need to know about the dishonesty of the process and how it was all orchestrated. But the next time you care about the honest side of an argument will be the first time.
If they were US citizens, maybe but they're not. They're here illegally and they know it so eff em. Get the hell outta my country or do it legally and come back. You love them so much why don't you take a few of them in and let them stay with you. I'm sure a man of your means and moral high ground will do the right thing and provide shelter and essentials for these poor, poor people. Let us know how many you plan to house.
Or there's a more likely scenario....there's more to the story.
Your question doesn't make sense. In order to determine the person is here illegally, the established Due Process must be followed. The same process is therefore followed for everyone.
This really isn't a tough concept to understand. It seems to be a tough concept for some to want to accept though.
Nothing in my post about how illegal immigrants have been in the US for decades, under R and D administrations, is BS.
All of what I said is readily verifiable.
I have/had several friends that worked and went through the citizenship process. They don't sympathize with the people that don't simply because they work for a living. Just like most liberal thinking an excuse makes the crime null and void. We have laws for a reason. If you disagree contact you representatives.
More BS.
20 million in 4 years and you seem unable to see a problem.
I already said I am aware of how many asylum requests have been rejected year by year.
And I agree that the asylum process is ineffective.
But given how many requests have been approved, under both Trump's administrations and Biden's, it is incorrect to claim almost all are BS.
What????? This was supposed to be a bash orange man thread!
I don't love them so much...I don't even know anyone who is here illegally.
I am simply telling you that what you want to do is a clear and established violation of the Constitution.
You can insult and create false arguments all you want, since that seems like an emotional response to being continually told your view violate the Constitution...but it doesn't change anything...your view violates the Constitution.
The right to Due Process is not limited to only US Citizens.
I have seen no reliable and verifiable report that says anything close to this.
Everything I can find, that analyzes estimated illegal population by year, shows the total is under 20MM...so 20MM didn't come here in 4 years.
I encourage you to provide actual data analysis that supports this claim.
I will look at it and see if it's legit or if its BS. There are easily 8 different actual reports that show it isn't even close to true.
Almost all are BS. They were accepted under both presidents because of laws on the books, and how these criminals are taught to manipulate those laws. The compelling stat here that you don't want to discuss is how few asylum requests there are under trump. Because there are other laws that must be followed in the process that Biden didn't enforce but trump is.
If you had any intellectual honesty, there's plenty of evidence out there and you would seek it out. But hey, let's say it was only 10 million. Is that okay?
Why is that more likely?
I find it hilarious that ICE / Customs and Border control are somehow viewed as being beyond reproach in all instances.
Maybe, just maybe, they are every bit as incompetent and inefficient at their jobs as all the other thousands of government departments and organizations…..as stated by 100% of Republicans and also many Democrats as well. And maybe, just maybe, giving them outsized power and control over the human rights of people legally in the country isn’t such a great idea.
I’ll also give you one more hint. It’s not the visa and green card holders that are going through the regular approval and renewal process that are the problem. Not even a little bit. Creating unnecessary hassle and inconvenience at best, and human rights violations and persecution at worst for those folks is a waste of everybody’s time and taxpayer dollars.
Where does the original post say due process wasn't performed? In fact, it sounds like a hearing took place and it was deemed the individual was here illegally after getting a drug card. They moved judges to the border during the Clinton, Bush, Obama and Trump presidential years to expedite these cases. I think this is the rule other than exception.
I provided a chart with numbers which shows there was no exponential increase under Biden. The increase was quite small.
Perhaps that chart is incorrect. But countless other reports from other groups and media show a similar story.
I asked for genuine and reliable info that shows 20MM in 4 years. That seems reasonable of me.
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