Who is leaving next year?

[ticket2ride04]

This one an done is killing college basketball. I get we had 3 freshman in 2015 that helped win us a ship but it has to be a nightmare for coaches when kids leave when they are not supposed to.

This is a great post. Unc's lack of recruiting the top-tier talent has actually been a pleasant surprise. Would I trade it for a Championship? Maybe. I can honestly say the last few years I've really enjoyed the type of kids we have and watching them grow. Made the loss to 'Nova heartbreaking but still, it's been fun the last few years.

 

[timo0402]

This is a great post. Unc's lack of recruiting the top-tier talent has actually been a pleasant surprise. Would I trade it for a Championship? Maybe. I can honestly say the last few years I've really enjoyed the type of kids we have and watching them grow. Made the loss to 'Nova heartbreaking but still, it's been fun the last few years.

You wouldn't trade it for a title huh? That is laughable.

 

[ticket2ride04]

You wouldn't trade it for a title huh? That is laughable.

I said maybe. But I've seen multiple titles in my lifetime and we have a good shot at one this year.

Would you trade away Amile and Grayson for two players if it meant another title this year?

 

[DukeDenver]

I said maybe. But I've seen multiple titles in my lifetime and we have a good shot at one this year.

Would you trade away Amile and Grayson for two players if it meant another title this year?

The way this question is posed is problematic. It's not as if Grayson and Amile would be getting the boot. They would've been happily playing elsewhere in your scenario. Also, those two already helped us get a title.

 

[ticket2ride04]

The way this question is posed is problematic. It's not as if Grayson and Amile would be getting the boot. They would've been happily playing elsewhere in your scenario. Also, those two already helped us get a title.

I understand, but I was using it to make my point. Watching Marcus and Brice grow has been more fun than brief stint with Brandan Wright or Marvin Williams.

Of course 'Ships are huge and I freely admit I'm jealous of Duke's recent success. Beyond that however, I've been more into UNC basketball and a huge part of it is watching these kids grow.

 

[QC Dukie]

You wouldn't trade it for a title huh? That is laughable.

Of course he's gonna say that when they're not winning titles. Yea I'm okay with not winning a championship as long as I can watch these kids for four years...haha. Okaaaaaay

 

[BNM79]

I understand, but I was using it to make my point. Watching Marcus and Brice grow has been more fun than brief stint with Brandan Wright or Marvin Williams.

Of course 'Ships are huge and I freely admit I'm jealous of Duke's recent success. Beyond that however, I've been more into UNC basketball and a huge part of it is watching these kids grow.

Don't forget duke fans know this feeling too with guys like Quinn and scheyer

 

[ticket2ride04]

Don't forget duke fans know this feeling too with guys like Quinn and scheyer

Absolutely. Wasn't it more fun with those teams?

I'm not disparaging the OAD. Just making a point is all.

 

[QC Dukie]

2015 was kinda fun too

 

[RanDEVILman]

I get what ticket is saying. But no one ever has a team of guys they only love. Every team has those fan favs, who are usually guys who have been there longer, but that's also because those guys tend to at with more Moxy. Of course, in 2015 a lot of guys ended up loving Tyus, Justise, and even Allen later on because of that. So I think the real point is we love winners who at the right way.

 

[ticket2ride04]

I get what ticket is saying. But no one ever has a team of guys they only love. Every team has those fan favs, who are usually guys who have been there longer, but that's also because those guys tend to at with more Moxy. Of course, in 2015 a lot of guys ended up loving Tyus, Justise, and even Allen later on because of that. So I think the real point is we love winners who at the right way.

Which is why I'll really love my guys if they cut down the nets this year

 

[timo0402]

I said maybe. But I've seen multiple titles in my lifetime and we have a good shot at one this year.

Would you trade away Amile and Grayson for two players if it meant another title this year?

Well they both have one already so yeah. Also no player is bigger than the program. Granted I get it it's a hypothetical but the ultimate goal as a program and as a fan is to be the best any given year. You don't trade titles.

 

[ticket2ride04]

Well they both have one already so yeah. Also no player is bigger than the program. Granted I get it it's a hypothetical but the ultimate goal as a program and as a fan is to be the best any given year. You don't trade titles.

Would you have traded the Reddick/Williams group for some OADs and a title?

Is title or bust?

 

[Duke It Out]

Would you have traded the Reddick/Williams group for some OADs and a title?

Is title or bust?

You are twisting it a bit aren't you? Of course we loved Redick and Williams. Those are our guys. They carried the program for 2 years. If what you are asking is, if we could do it all again with Redick/Williams with the same result or we could do it with one and done talent and win it all? Most fans of ANY program would take the national championship.

What you are trying to compare is sentimental value of past players versus a hypothetical national championship. What it really gets down to as far as the point you are trying to make is recruiting strategy. At the end of the day, the goal of all recruiting strategies is to win.

 

[BNM79]

Absolutely. Wasn't it more fun with those teams?

I'm not disparaging the OAD. Just making a point is all.

Both 2015 and 2010 were equally fun. The 2015 freshmen (other than oak) were not for sure one n dones. They just played so well together it made them have those opportunities. But I did still enjoy cooks journey the most. I do worry k is going too far down the one n done road some times. So far it has been a very good balance of experience and one n dones.

The thing I don't like about this era is players that think they can or should be even if their ranking doesn't necessarily guarantee it. This seems to happen with a lot of bigs. They seem to have the most to learn (unless you are special like Davis, oak, or towns) since it came so easy to them

 

[ticket2ride04]

You are twisting it a bit aren't you? Of course we loved Redick and Williams. Those are our guys. They carried the program for 2 years. If what you are asking is, if we could do it all again with Redick/Williams with the same result or we could do it with one and done talent and win it all? Most fans of ANY program would take the national championship.

What you are trying to compare is sentimental value of past players versus a hypothetical national championship. What it really gets down to as far as the point you are trying to make is recruiting strategy. At the end of the day, the goal of all recruiting strategies is to win.

Roy is recruiting the same guys but not landing them. I want them too, don't get me wrong. I've just learned to appreciate the journey more. BN touches on it below. The OAD is difficult to manage. UK and Duke have results but they also have a lot of frustration. It's new territory for sure.

Both 2015 and 2010 were equally fun. The 2015 freshmen (other than oak) were not for sure one n dones. They just played so well together it made them have those opportunities. But I did still enjoy cooks journey the most. I do worry k is going too far down the one n done road some times. So far it has been a very good balance of experience and one n dones.

The thing I don't like about this era is players that think they can or should be even if their ranking doesn't necessarily guarantee it. This seems to happen with a lot of bigs. They seem to have the most to learn (unless you are special like Davis, oak, or towns) since it came so easy to them

Great post. One could argue K has been too successful in getting top flight talent. Privately, he's tell you he'd like a little more balance and Roy would say he'd like some better recruits.

 

[pisgah101]

Who's reddick?

 

[denverexpat]

Roy is recruiting the same guys but not landing them. I want them too, don't get me wrong. I've just learned to appreciate the journey more. BN touches on it below. The OAD is difficult to manage. UK and Duke have results but they also have a lot of frustration. It's new territory for sure.




Great post. One could argue K has been too successful in getting top flight talent. Privately, he's tell you he'd like a little more balance and Roy would say he'd like some better recruits.

You make some good points. Villanova won last year with no OAD if i recall and this year are very successful with none also....i would prefer we followed this path vs chasing the Top OAD talent because you get to share the journey with the players and are more vested in their success.
Another thread on who is staying vs going is interesting - next year we could/will have a completely different team with Duke jerseys on...so you start from square one with getting to know the team.
My best memories of Duke are from the days players were here 3-4 years...the Hurley/Laettner/Hill years or Williams/Redick years + other years - Duhon, Langdon etc...
The success achieved in 2015 with the 3 FR i think overshadows the years of frustration in between.

 

[skysdad]

Sometimes I wonder just how much difference there is between a 3 star recruit and a 5 star recruit or a top ten recruit vs. a top 50 recruit. There are so many really good college basketball players out there. Sometimes players just develop slower. It's kind of the same in the NBA . There are really good players in the league that weren't super recruits as high school players. OFC

 

[Mac9192]

Sometimes I wonder just how much difference there is between a 3 star recruit and a 5 star recruit or a top ten recruit vs. a top 50 recruit. There are so many really good college basketball players out there. Sometimes players just develop slower. It's kind of the same in the NBA . There are really good players in the league that weren't super recruits as high school players. OFC

How much does a kids ranking rise when a school like Duke shows interest?

 

[Jake1985]

Rating players is subjective although most use a ruberic to evaluate and grade to calculate what "star" equivalent that is.

There are variables that definitely can not be measured that result in development of a player.

 

[hart2chesson]

How much does a kids ranking rise when a school like Duke shows interest?

Good point Mac because I know for SURE if Duke shows interest in a football player who's a 3 star, that ranking almost always rises if the Bama's, Ohio States,etc begin to call...

OFC

 

[denverexpat]

Good point Mac because I know for SURE if Duke shows interest in a football player who's a 3 star, that ranking almost always rises if the Bama's, Ohio States,etc begin to call...

OFC

I would hope that Duke's recruiting isnt swayed by changes in ranking based on our interest. The ability of the player obviously ranks as the #1 consideration. Rankings are difficult because they are subjective to the service or person doing the ranking + the level of play at HS is so unpredictable its hard to truly project how that translates to college. Even using AAU as a benchmark has its issues due to team style, squad make up and coaching etc....recruiting is definitely an art not a science. Then try to project who is returning to the squad the following year and what you need to fill those holes and you need to employ a full time Nostradamus to get it 100% right!

 

[HuffyJB]

Obviously, the ideal scenario is to bring in elite talent and pair it with experienced guys - much like 2015. People have felt the frustration this year, thinking we have skewed too far to OADs, but this year was supposed to be the perfect example of the aforementioned blend. There were highly touted freshmen, but Duke was returning guys like Allen, Jefferson, Kennard, and Jones. That is why people in the preseason pegged Duke as one of the favorites. But due to a crazy level of injuries and mishaps, it hasn't shaken out like that.

The series of injuries this year have been so flukey and unprecedented, we need to resist the urge to think that the staff needs to rework its approach. If you look at Duke's top 8 guys, they have missed a combined 36 games, and that doesn't take into account the games they played but were hobbled. Duke has exactly two guys who have been available for every game, lowest in the nation. It also doesn't take into account the biggest injury of all, which was missing K for awhile.

This year has been frustrating because the complete lack of continuity. But this level of injury has never happened at Duke before, and is not likely to happen very often in the future (knock on wood). Duke needs to keep doing exactly what it has been doing: recruit the Okafors, Parkers, Ingrams, Tatums, Carters, and pair them with the Cooks, Jeffersons, Allens, Jones, etc.

 

[QC Dukie]

Who's reddick?

Oh I guarantee he knows who he is....haha

 

[hart2chesson]

Obviously, the ideal scenario is to bring in elite talent and pair it with experienced guys - much like 2015. People have felt the frustration this year, thinking we have skewed too far to OADs, but this year was supposed to be the perfect example of the aforementioned blend. There were highly touted freshmen, but Duke was returning guys like Allen, Jefferson, Kennard, and Jones. That is why people in the preseason pegged Duke as one of the favorites. But due to a crazy level of injuries and mishaps, it hasn't shaken out like that.

The series of injuries this year have been so flukey and unprecedented, we need to resist the urge to think that the staff needs to rework its approach. If you look at Duke's top 8 guys, they have missed a combined 36 games, and that doesn't take into account the games they played but were hobbled. Duke has exactly two guys who have been available for every game, lowest in the nation. It also doesn't take into account the biggest injury of all, which was missing K for awhile.

This year has been frustrating because the complete lack of continuity. But this level of injury has never happened at Duke before, and is not likely to happen very often in the future (knock on wood). Duke needs to keep doing exactly what it has been doing: recruit the Okafors, Parkers, Ingrams, Tatums, Carters, and pair them with the Cooks, Jeffersons, Allens, Jones, etc.

Pairing those OAD's w/leadership is a strategy K is truly adept, but the biggest question for me is what seasoned experience will we have returning next year???

OFC

 

[dukiejay]

Pairing those OAD's w/leadership is a strategy K is truly adept, but the biggest question for me is what seasoned experience will we have returning next year???

OFC

It's a good question....but it's not as if the groundwork wasn't laid. No one here thought we'd be talking about Luke leaving this early, and even to an extent, Frank. The plan all along was that both of them would return, along with a junior Chase Jeter and Vrank. The plan obviously can have its flaws when unpredictable things happen.

 

[HuffyJB]

It's a good question....but it's not as if the groundwork wasn't laid. No one here thought we'd be talking about Luke leaving this early, and even to an extent, Frank. The plan all along was that both of them would return, along with a junior Chase Jeter and Vrank. The plan obviously can have its flaws when unpredictable things happen.

I think 2015 is a great example of that. Okafor was perceived as the only sure-fire OAD in that group before the season. But winning a national championship will raise your profile pretty quick, and three guys ended up going.

 

[timo0402]

I think 2015 is a great example of that. Okafor was perceived as the only sure-fire OAD in that group before the season. But winning a national championship will raise your profile pretty quick, and three guys ended up going.

Correct, that team had a senior captain, two junior role players and two soph, one of which was supposed to have a big role (Matt jones) after the way he meshed with that team during the offseason.

One junior got kicked off, the other soph left. We won it all that year. My point is, we can plan until the cows come home, but things change. I think we have the right formula but unfortunately between injuries, Grayson's antics, people leaving unexpectedly- Thornton. The year doesn't look the way we once thought it would, that happens and you can't always plan for all of it.

 

[DevilDJ]

Mark Armstrong‏ @ArmstrongABC11

Duke spokesman just told me Bolden has no health issues (other than being chained to the bench.)

Stephen Wiseman‏ @stevewisemanNC

@ArmstrongABC11 Remember the Clemson game in BKYN when got the ball stripped from him like he was asleep? There's your answer

Mark Armstrong‏ @ArmstrongABC11

It's funny because in a lengthy answer yesterday, Amile talked about the 'additions' to the team lately and first of his lips was Bolden

Mark Armstrong‏ @ArmstrongABC11

More On Bolden: Duke spokesman said he's fine, another team source said he's under the weather. Saw him, tried to ask, quickly ushered away

Mark Armstrong‏ @ArmstrongABC11

Fact is - not sure they need him right now, but I know it's a matter of great curiosity, hence the tweets.

https://twitter.com/ArmstrongABC11

 

[dukiejay]

Bolden is not really helping this team going forward anyway. Vrank was much more productive in the few minutes he received last night than Bolden at any point this season....sans maybe the Miami game.

 

[HeLooks2MuchLikeDave]

Yeah but it makes no sense for him to be at the end of the bench unless he's sick or being punished. He's always sat third on the bench. Being sick makes more sense to me. And I hope that's what it is because if he's being punished, we've certainly seen the last of him on the court for Duke.

 

[hart2chesson]

Yeah but it makes no sense for him to be at the end of the bench unless he's sick or being punished. He's always sat third on the bench. Being sick makes more sense to me. And I hope that's what it is because if he's being punished, we've certainly seen the last of him on the court for Duke.

For the record he was sick. Stayed on end of bench and sipped water, didnt participate in handshake line. Nate James quoted after game noted they would quarantine him, and they think he may have flu. He got worse just before gametime, but wanted to be on bench.

OFC

 

[HeLooks2MuchLikeDave]

Yeah just saw posted that Bolden is missing practice today with flu-like symptoms.

 

[topps coach]

This is a great post. Unc's lack of recruiting the top-tier talent has actually been a pleasant surprise. Would I trade it for a Championship? Maybe. I can honestly say the last few years I've really enjoyed the type of kids we have and watching them grow. Made the loss to 'Nova heartbreaking but still, it's been fun the last few years.

Your lack of recruiting has not caught up with you yet because you have five McDonald's players who have stuck around for three plus years.You lose at least three of them this year.Lets see how well you do with your three star recruits and then see if you feel the same way

 

[jnastasi]

Sick or not, I don't think Bolden is in a Duke uniform next year.

 

[duke0527]

may be a blessing in disguise. Vrank can play and maybe he helps Duke get over the top.

 

[lyonhawk]

I heard an interesting stat watching coverage the other night. Since the 1 and done rule went into effect, only Duke and Kentucky have won a title with a OAD on the roster.

 

[K-oach Q]

Luke Kennard 4-18 in his last two games as a Blue Devil.

Adam Rowe Twitter^

 

[Laettner15]

I know this has been discussed more times then we want to and the consensus is we all expected it... but still reading this tweet makes me worried:

Jones and amile - seniors

Tatum
Giles
Allen
Kennard
Bolden
Jeter- transfers

8 guys gone is unfortunately what I see with 3 coming in (Trent jr, O'Connell, Wendell)... leaves 5 open spots.... I hope we get Duval but I'm not getting hopes up until it happens..

Hopefully there are some good grad transfers that are going to be available...